It is possible to over tension a spoke to the point that it yields but does not break, without breaking the rim. But steel (or stainless) have to stretch quite a bit to break in tension, and wheel building doesn't really have the space for that kind of elongation. I suppose I could calculate how much a spoke has to stretch before it breaks if I were bothered about it. But I know someone who stretched some spokes 3 - 4 mm before he realised that he had the units wrong on his tension meter.531colin wrote: ↑3 May 2021, 9:08amA slight over-simplification.Cyril Haearn wrote: ↑3 May 2021, 8:47amIf that is true, that a rim of whatever material might break before a spoke breaks, surely spokes are too strong and rims are too weak. Replacing a spoke is easier than replacing a rimrogerzilla wrote: ↑30 Apr 2021, 9:54pm Overtensioning is unlikely to break any half-decent spoke, since the rim will give up first. You might manage it with a steel rim
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A new (un-fatigued) spoke will pull through a new (un-fatigued) rim.....thats true, but has very little relevance to wheel failures in use.
Spokes which fail in a crash, or hitting a pothole were previously fatigued.
Rims which fail by cracking at the spoke hole were previously fatigued, eg stress-corrosion-cracking in alloys.
As well as supporting spoke tension locally, a rim needs to be stiff enough to work, and (for rim brakes) to have enough material for a braking surface.
Spokes need to be stiff enough to work but elastic enough to share applied load between multiple spokes ....this is why butted spokes are often said to be "better" than plain gauge.
The solution to spoke failure is stress-relief, which is usually done badly, and not at all in machine built wheels.
The solution to stress corrosion cracking is to use enough material, of an appropriate alloy, with an appropriate finish, and to wash off road salt frequently.
A spoke that has yielded due to over tensioning may very well break due to fatigue at low mileage, but it will fail at the point of elongation, which I think is unlikely to be the bend, as this has been work hardened in the manufacturing process.