Campagnolo/Miche 11 Speed Cassette on a 10 Speed Free Wheel

[slowster]

The Campagnolo sprocket will only fit on a Campagnolo freehub one way round. There is a stepped ridge on one of the freehub splines and a corresponding lug on the sprocket which has to be lined up with it.

Further to my comment above about the freehub spline looking like Campagnolo 9 speed pattern, I've googled a bit more, and there are Miche/Bianchi 9 speed cassettes. It appears that these and the corresponding Miche/Bianchi freehubs used a spline pattern the same as (or similar to) Campagnolo's 8 speed Exa-Drive (and short lived 9 speed Exa-Drive).

I cannot find any mention of 10 speed versions of the Miche/Bianchi cassettes. I wonder if a 10 speed cassette was achieved by using 9 speed Miche/Bianchi sprockets, changing the spacers between the sprockets to provide 10 speed spacing, and adding an extra sprocket, i.e. as mentioned in the bottom link.

viewtopic.php?t=83682

https://www.highonbikes.com/collections ... d-cassette

https://thecycleclinic.co.uk/products/m ... d-cassette

https://forum.bikeradar.com/discussion/ ... -and-sizes

[pq]

It looks to me as though you need to ditch this wheel, if as others have said it's a bodged up hotch-potch of obsolete bits. You're complaining a lot about how Shimano would be much easier, but it seems to have nothing to do with that and everything to do with the parts Bianchi have cobbled together to make this bike. A new rear wheel with either a current Shimano or Campag pattern freehub will make your life a whole lot easier. I'd go with Campag becasue that's what your gears are, but either can be made to work.

The Miche sprockets are available, I bought a couple very recently but it's true most places don't have them. Google will oblige. Mine came from Bikeinn - but I only bought from them becasue the 32T I wanted are particularly rare and I couldn't find them anywhere else. There are also old stocks of Marchisio here and there if you hunt around which go up to 30.

For clarity it would be good if you stopped using the word freewheel. One of my earlier posts was simply becasue your use of that word meant I misunderstood what you were saying.

[hondated]

Thanks very much for all your research slowster.
I think what you are saying supports my opinion on Bianchi building these bikes on the cheap.My theory is that when 10 speed came out and was the bees Knees they had a problem in that 9 speed was now unfashionable so they squeezed another sprocket on.
I was always a bit slow on the uptake at school but I finally get what every one has said about it's either a Miche FW designed to take either Shimano or Campag sprockets but mine will take neither..So given your research is that because my FW is designed to only take 9 speed so the design of the FW is different to that of a 10 speed. If you look at the photo I would say that the spacers are fairly thick given the FW is only meant to take 9 sprockets and your research. I've a good a mind to buy a used Campag 9 speed to see if it does fit.
Thanks again slowster.
Also see our Brucey has commented on this and if your reading this Brucey behave yourself your meant to be resting

[hondated]

It looks to me as though you need to ditch this wheel, if as others have said it's a bodged up hotch-potch of obsolete bits. You're complaining a lot about how Shimano would be much easier, but it seems to have nothing to do with that and everything to do with the parts Bianchi have cobbled together to make this bike. A new rear wheel with either a current Shimano or Campag pattern freehub will make your life a whole lot easier. I'd go with Campag becasue that's what your gears are, but either can be made to work.

The Miche sprockets are available, I bought a couple very recently but it's true most places don't have them. Google will oblige. Mine came from Bikeinn - but I only bought from them becasue the 32T I wanted are particularly rare and I couldn't find them anywhere else. There are also old stocks of Marchisio here and there if you hunt around which go up to 30.

For clarity it would be good if you stopped using the word freewheel. One of my earlier posts was simply becasue your use of that word meant I misunderstood what you were saying.

Thanks PQ I will as you advise quit using the term freewheeling.
As you can see from slowster posting it seems like you said Bianchi have just notched up a 9 speed hub. Given the wheels are virtually brand new I am loathed to either sell or ditch them just because I cannot fit lower gearing and now I know they are actually 9 speed I may be able to get a larger 9 speed sprocket.
I think your earlier comment about Campag gearing being aspirational is a fair one as well.
Given my own experience with Campag is at the lowest end of its market I think I may have expressed a foolish comment there. On reflection I do think the reason you pay so much for Campag is that at the Chorus and above level you are buying quality items. In my own experience with Shimano I always used 105 and then decided to upgrade one of my bikes via Ebay with Ultegra and I cannot believe how much better quality the gear changes are. That said I do understand that the latest versions of 105 are equivalent to old Ultegra.
As they say you never stop learning do you.Thanks again Ted

[slowster]

If your hub is the Exa Drive spline pattern (with presumably a freehub width sized to accept a 9 speed cassette), I think the important points are:

1. Non-Exa Drive cassettes will not fit on it according to Hilary Stone. It appears that Campagnolo had two cassette standards in 8 speed: Exa Drive and Ultra Drive. According to at least one of the links above Campagnolo also briefly used the Exa Drive spline pattern for 9 speed.

https://hilarystone.com/cassettesCampag.html

2. The existence of the Miche/Bianchi cassettes - as distinct from Miche's ranges of Campagnolo and Shimano compatible cassettes - seems to confirm that they are the only cassettes that will fit your freehub. Even if you were able to find an old Campagnolo Exa Drive cassette that would fit, it would be 8 speed or possibly 9 speed, and would probably not have a largest sprocket that met your requirements. Whereas Shimano has always produced wide ratio cassettes for its MTB groupsets, which were also compatible with its road groupsets and thus gave tourists etc. options for lower gearing, Campagnolo was focussed on racing. The Miche/Bianchi cassette only appears to be available in a 12t-26t version. I doubt Campagnolo made a larger cassette than that, and therefore I suspect that the 26t sprocket is the largest that you would be able to get for your freehub.

3. A critical question is whether you would be able to replace your current cassette when it wears out. It seems you cannot buy replacement Miche/Bianchi 10 speed cassettes, and I note that none of the retailers above has the 9 speed Miche/Bianchi cassette in stock. So far you have been unable to remove the freehub, but even if you succeeded I would not be confident that you could get a replacement freehub that would fit on the hub and have a different spline pattern (such as Campagnolo 10 speed spline pattern). Your existing hub might be compatible with only Miche freehubs (which might not be available as aftermarket spares), or worse still with only the Miche/Bianchi freehub.

4. If your priorities are a) to keep using your current 10 speed Ergolevers and b) to get a lower bottom gear, I suggest you consider changing your chainrings/chainset. Often that can be a better option because it can provide lower gears without big jumps between gears, and all that is lost are often top gears which are too high for many people.

[hondated]

Thanks slowster. Because I have fitted Harry Rowland wheels with a Campag freehub ( thanks PQ) I am able to use a 29t sprocket which isnt too bad climbing hills with a Compact CS up front.
Sadly the lure of buying the bike was that it had a triple chainset but I found 52,42,30 wasn't great gearing for me and that it was a prestigious brand Bianchi so this bike has never given me what I thought it would.
The wheels will I think become Wall Art after all of this.
PQs comment about Campag of being a aspirational brand has set the hares running in my head so I might just at some time upgrade it to Record or Super Record. After all any money I either spend on bike parts or bikes will just be wasted

[slowster]

According to The Cycle Clinic the freehub is probably the Miche M Drive 8/9 speed version here:

https://thecycleclinic.co.uk/collection ... -8-9-speed

If you are able to get the current freehub off, it looks like you could replace it with one or possibly either of the other two Miche freehubs of this type listed. Both are Shimano spline pattern, but you could presumably do as tatanab has advised above, and fit Miche Shimano sprockets respaced to match Campagnolo spacing.

However, I think you would need to check exactly what you needed and make sure it was compatible before buying anything.