STI Levers v Bar-end shifters

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iandusud
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Re: STI Levers v Bar-end shifters

Post by iandusud »

I regularly ride bikes with both STI and barends. STIs on the whole are very good and great for quick shifting when trying to optimise cadence. However I really like my barends and find that when I'm riding with my hands on the hoods the reach to the barends is very natural. I just lower my hand and it falls to the lever. If I was building up a new touring bike I would definitely opt for barends for simplicity and reliability. I have had gear cables fail on STI levers and they can be a pain to replace. Not something I would like to do at the roadside. My bike with barends has the same gear cables I fitted it with over 30 years ago (I ride this bike several times a week). Gear cables on STI levers fail where they are contorted at the lever. I do rate STI gear levers as good but as I say it wouldn't be my choice for a touring bike.
pwa
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Re: STI Levers v Bar-end shifters

Post by pwa »

thirdcrank wrote: 22 Jun 2021, 2:46pm
Repair - in the field or a local shop - you have to be joking. I believe that Shimano is just about unrepairable beyond normal maintenance
Just to illustrate the point being made, here's the exploded view of a Shimano STI lever. (It's not Sora, just the first I found online.)

https://si.shimano.com/api/publish/stor ... -1321B.pdf

I imagine the main thing that might affect the efficient working of an STI lever might be a crash: brake levers on drop handlebars are very exposed.
My daughter had the left side Sora STI fail a few days into a ten day tour of Provence and was unable to keep the chain on the bigger of the two rings for the rest of the holiday. No crash, just failed inners. WD40 etc failed to remedy that one. Something had broken inside. I have had two Ultegra levers fail, again with no crash involved. Rather expensive to replace. My son had a Sora lever fail. Bar end levers fail too, but in my experience they last several times longer before doing so, and they tend to give you plenty of warning first.
mattsccm
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Re: STI Levers v Bar-end shifters

Post by mattsccm »

Be aware of the " keep it simple for touring" idea. Why? Well it may apply crossing the Gobi desert when you haven't looked at the bike for 10, 000 miles but in the UK I doubt it is an issue. Most bikes do less than that in their life.
STIs fail as does anything but if looked after it will be rare enough to ignore the possibility. Go Shimano and any bike shop in the country will be able to fix you if a mech is trashed. Go SRAM and it will be close and you can mix and match MTB and road in virtually all cases.
I use bar ends but to be honest in most situations they have had their day. (nowt wrong, just superceeded. )
pwa
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Re: STI Levers v Bar-end shifters

Post by pwa »

mattsccm wrote: 23 Jun 2021, 6:11am Be aware of the " keep it simple for touring" idea. Why? Well it may apply crossing the Gobi desert when you haven't looked at the bike for 10, 000 miles but in the UK I doubt it is an issue. Most bikes do less than that in their life.
STIs fail as does anything but if looked after it will be rare enough to ignore the possibility. Go Shimano and any bike shop in the country will be able to fix you if a mech is trashed. Go SRAM and it will be close and you can mix and match MTB and road in virtually all cases.
I use bar ends but to be honest in most situations they have had their day. (nowt wrong, just superceeded. )
I doubt my local bike shop will fix an STI for you if it fails. You will be left needing a new one, which they may or may not have in stock. Either way, it will be at least one day out of your holiday and may leave you unable to complete your tour without hopping on a train to catch up. My daughter had to cycle using just the small ring for a week when her left STI shifter failed mid tour. Bar end levers are so easy to use that I don't see any benefit to be had from using STIs, which are definitely a lot less reliable. In a race situation, yes, of course STIs are better, but on a tour the number of occasions where you wish the levers had been closer to the finger tips will be very low. And having to move your hands around a little more helps reduce aches and pains.
PhilD28
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Joined: 26 Sep 2016, 8:31am

Re: STI Levers v Bar-end shifters

Post by PhilD28 »

My own experience with sti was marred by them causing repetitive strain injury in my right hand on the one long tour I did with them (2 months in Ireland). Riding about 7 hours a day and so much changing was a problem for me. I had used them for lots of 4 hour rides at home without problem but the high volume use on a tour led to months of pain.

I went back to Ultegra bar end shifters and never bothered with integrated shifters again. I’ve used bar end shifters on all my bikes for about 40 years now and Ultegra 8 speed since they first introduced them, totally reliable and never a failure, they have a friction option and the LH shifter will work with any front mech. I don’t miss having integrated brake/shifters one bit. I couldn’t even guess how many miles I have ridden with ultegra bar ends but it includes at least 30 probably more multi month tours along with daily rides at home.

If integrated shifters don’t cause any bio mechanical issues for the user they are a very convenient way of changing gear, far from essential on a tour, certainly not for me.
UpWrong
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Re: STI Levers v Bar-end shifters

Post by UpWrong »

Or switch to flat bars and trigger shifters?
djnotts
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Re: STI Levers v Bar-end shifters

Post by djnotts »

IF I were building a drop bar bike from scratch then I would use an STI for the rear and, either double or triple, a friction bar end for the front. Trimming is much superior with friction.
My "best" shifting bike (flat bars) is that fitted with old school 3 x 7 thumbies - rear is switchable and I run the index option.
merseymouth
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Re: STI Levers v Bar-end shifters

Post by merseymouth »

Hi all, Maybe because I am no spring chick, but I avoid STi/Ergo stuff for two main reasons.
I use down-tube levers in various forms, from old skool friction through to Indexed. Early Campag Record gets its 6 speeds shifted with contemporary levers, when tightened correctly it doesn't slip. The Cyclo 3 speed gets its matching lever. Latest version is the 10 speed Ultegra, relying on the super efficient Indexed lever, slick and sure.
The hand automatically goes to the right place.
But the second factor is that the cables have a much easier life, easy to inspect, simple to lubricate. When wheels out or off to transport there is only a rear brake cable under stress. Simples! MM
bikepacker
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Re: STI Levers v Bar-end shifters

Post by bikepacker »

When I toured, I always carried with me a set of the cheapo Sunrace downtube shifters as part of my emergency spares. Never used them and sometimes wondered why I bothered until one day in the Cevennes. Heading along the Cornice to Florac I caught up with a cycle camper struggling up one of the climbs. From the back I guessed he was British by his Carradice panniers. The reason he was finding it tough was his front sti had completely seized and he was limping on using his front three rings. At last my downtube levers had a purpose and within a few minutes he had all his gears functioning again.

We were actually heading for the same campsite and in conversation we found our paths had already previously crossed at Mildenhall Rally. And we met up again there later that year where he gave me back the lever.

Going back to the initial posting; I have both on my bikes and often am undecided as to which is best. However, for cycle camping with a full load I much prefer bar-end shifters and separate brake levers.
Last edited by bikepacker on 23 Jun 2021, 1:25pm, edited 1 time in total.
There is your way. There is my way. But there is no "the way".
nsew
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Re: STI Levers v Bar-end shifters

Post by nsew »

No mention of riding style / technique as yet. There’s no doubt forcing gear changes under load with a loaded bike damages the innards of plasticy STI’s as it will on an unloaded bike, more so if the rider is heavy. Doesn’t do much good on far more robust bar end, d/t lever or old school thumbies.

There is a finesse technique while changing gear, a slight easing off on the pedal stroke. Mashing while changing is common practice amongst riders and is one of my favourite painful moments when in close proximity. Of course those riders drivetrains are also set up like muck and they can’t find a smooth gear.

I wouldn’t fit those Sora’s if they were free. Shimano bar ends (and d/t levers) are ultra reliable and don’t have to be fitted at the bar end. Ask the bike builder to clamp them near the stem to be used as thumbies. It tidies up the cabling which presents a more positive gear engagement. Like this
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geomannie
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Re: STI Levers v Bar-end shifters

Post by geomannie »

You could split the difference by installing Gevenalle shifters, essentially bar-end shifters grafted onto the front of a brake lever mech(s). I have a pair and I like them a lot. They are beatifully well made, easy to use (no moving of hand position) and mechanically simple.
https://www.bikemonger.co.uk/gevenalle-326-c.asp
Image
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rotavator
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Re: STI Levers v Bar-end shifters

Post by rotavator »

nsew wrote: 23 Jun 2021, 12:32pm It tidies up the cabling which presents a more positive gear engagement. Like this
Did you post the wrong photo?
Vorpal
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Re: STI Levers v Bar-end shifters

Post by Vorpal »

I have experience with Sora on new bikes on two occasions. I will say they have been extremely reliable, however, they both needed adjusting after the first month or so of usage.

Personally, my choice would be to go with the Sora, and plan on getting them checked and adjusted as needed.

Needing adjustment just meant that shifts weren't going so smoothly &/or the levers were hard to move, so it wasn't really a big problem in terms dealing with it.

I don't think I would bother with planning for a back up solution. I would just accept that on the small chance things went wrong, I might have delay for repair.
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nsew
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Re: STI Levers v Bar-end shifters

Post by nsew »

rotavator wrote: 23 Jun 2021, 1:08pm
nsew wrote: 23 Jun 2021, 12:32pm It tidies up the cabling which presents a more positive gear engagement. Like this
Did you post the wrong photo?
Oops. Here we go, the cables cross nicely and keep the bars clean. I’m currently using the Gevenalle Audax Shifters (9sp Dura Ace shifting 8 from 9) mentioned upthread and like them though they are a touch awkward on occasion. Nice to have the changes there though, especially off road. The system in the photos is incredible for massive shifts - making it possible to change from highest gear (showing 3x7) to lowest (and all points in between) in less than a second and vice versa. I may return to this system though have a desire to return to 7sp downtube for a planned never coming back adventure. That system is even more bombproof, even more precise and represents a big ‘up yours’ to comical modern gearing.
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mcshroom
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Re: STI Levers v Bar-end shifters

Post by mcshroom »

Which would you prefer? It's probably better you go with that than anything else. You've got to ride the bike, so I'd suggest you pick what you would be most comfortable with.

There's positives to both approaches. I like bar ends for the ability to mix and match components more easily than with STIs, and to get tfor how you can trim front derailleur just right to avoid any chain rub, whatever the gear.

However, I've mainly ridden (and toured) using STI levers, and been very happy with them. The only problem I've ever had was one of the nylon caps on the brake cable holder cracking in an old 2303 shifter, meaning I had to manually push the brake lever back out every time I pulled the rear brake. If you look after the cables, modern STIs are robust and I wouldn't have any qualms about touring round the UK with them. Having the brakes and gears in one place can be useful when navigating urban traffic, and the hoods in modern STIs are a little more comfortable than the RL-520 brake levers I have on my pub bike.

At some point I'll build myself a new tourer to replace the broken one in my shed, and I honestly can't decide whether to equip it with bar ends or STI levers. Currently I'm thinking bar ends, but mainly so I can have v-brake cable pull from the brake levers, rather than anything to do with the shifting.
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