mcshroom wrote: ↑23 Jun 2021, 2:54pm
I like bar ends for the ability to mix and match components more easily than with STIs,
I think someone more knowledgeable than myself ought to say a few words about this. The OP is going for a long tour over minor coastal roads (North Devon comes to mind ) carrying all his needs for 6 months. That to me shouts a 22T front chain ring and a 34 or 36T rear sprocket. Of course, he may have other ideas.
When the pestilence strikes from the East, go far and breathe the cold air deeply. Ignore the sage, stay not indoors. Ho Ri Zon 12th Century Chinese philosopher
They’re starting in Kent and would be well advised to take the anti-clockwise route. The pain will start in Yorkshire assuming they negotiated the North Downs with all that stuff onboard and 30mph headwinds off the North Sea for what seems like an eternity.
One more thought. If touring and you have a problem with a shifter or derailleur which needs replacing you are limited in choices with STI systems, and with parts being in limited supply you could be stuck. If you use barends with a friction option you can get away just about any derailleur with enough capacity.
nsew wrote: ↑23 Jun 2021, 2:18pm
The system in the photos is incredible for massive shifts - making it possible to change from highest gear (showing 3x7) to lowest (and all points in between) in less than a second and vice versa.
I've been toying with trying the same set up, but with the Thumbie Mounts and shifters mounted upside down (so rear shifts would be by the LH shifter). I figured that having the shifters under the bars might be a better position because with the hands gripping the tops the levers could be pushed by the thumbs and pulled by index fingers. However, I suspect that the cranked Shimano bar end levers might be further forward than is ideal for that, and a straight down tube lever fitted to the Thumbie Mount might work better.
If a STI lever internals fail, then no one but no one is fixing it. It’s time for a new lever. I’ve had two STI lever failures and many other times they’ve chewed up the cable.
I now run bar end shifters on all bikes except my Brommie. I like 9 speed dura ace as the rear can be run both indexed or friction. I sometimes use a 9 speed wheel or 10 speed wheel and leave it in friction. Shifting 4 or more gears in one smooth hand motion no problem. One of my bikes has 10 speed dura ace where rear has to be indexed so not as cassette or rear derailleur agnostic.
Hand comfort on long rides and tours is about moving the hands about. Bar ends encourage that and are more forgiving of tired hands.
Bar ends give really simple cable runs and smooth easy shifting. Consequently cables failing is pretty rare and if they do, fitting a replacement is that true 5-10 min job at side of road with nothing more than Allen key for cable clamp bolt. The cable can be trimmed if you carry something suitable to cut it. But it’ll survive if not.
Bar end give a very simple view of what gears you are in, or rather whether you have more lower or higher gears to move to.
Muscle memory soon kicks in with bar ends in friction mode. So you soon learn just how far to move the lever for the gear you want. Trimming is trivial and becomes second nature.
To top it all separate brake levers and bar ends is far cheaper and lighter than STI. Plus replacing brake cables also far easier
I use STI or SRAM eTap on road bikes that I take out for day rides. My touring bikes all have barend shifters. I see no reason to use STI or the other manufacturers equivalent for touring.
Jamesh wrote: ↑23 Jun 2021, 10:08pm
Crazy idea but on an extended your why not start with sti but also take a set of thumbies too.
If the sti breaks it's not a hard job to fit a thumbies so long as you don't have oversized bars.
Cable outers should be ok???
Cheers James
Why not just use the ultra reliable, very comfortable and easy to use bar end shifters and cut out the possibility of sti failure. Save money and brake levers can be chosen to suit your calipers/vee brakes. I don’t see how it’s a difficult choice on a bike going on a 6 month tour where reliability should be one of the prime considerations.
My wife found her own solution to this conundrum and bought a Rohloff with twistgrip.
But it’s the OP’s bike and his choice, plenty of arguments for and against here to make an informed decision.
nsew wrote: ↑23 Jun 2021, 2:18pm
The system in the photos is incredible for massive shifts - making it possible to change from highest gear (showing 3x7) to lowest (and all points in between) in less than a second and vice versa.
I've been toying with trying the same set up, but with the Thumbie Mounts and shifters mounted upside down (so rear shifts would be by the LH shifter). I figured that having the shifters under the bars might be a better position because with the hands gripping the tops the levers could be pushed by the thumbs and pulled by index fingers. However, I suspect that the cranked Shimano bar end levers might be further forward than is ideal for that, and a straight down tube lever fitted to the Thumbie Mount might work better.
I toyed with that set-up but IIRC the cable run wasn’t as neat and interfered with the bottle holder I’d set up for that trip. I think it may be a more viable set up with a flat bar brake lever. However if the shifter bracket is hinged then it’s easy to try out either way. What I found was that the shifting was ridiculously easy on top, often requiring only a slight shift with the knuckle in either direction for the rear and a thumb up shift or forefinger down shift on the front. The only downside was when accelerating or when moving at speed in the drops or hoods there was a need to correct the balance when removing a hand for a change. Nothing drastic but certainly something you were aware of. D/t levers are noticeably longer than bar-ends, you might find a need to have the hands further away than where you’d like them to get the full swing of the lever. Easy to set up without cables and experiment with all the above though.
Either way OP should ask for Shimano Dura Ace 9sp bar end shifters - best on a touring bike that doesn’t have flared bars. Don’t be fobbed off with mushy plasticy Microshift. Also ask for downtube lever bosses as they offer further adaptability and cable adjustment. For a touring bike I also like the idea of a d/t shifter for the front and a bar end or thumbie for the rear.
nsew wrote: ↑24 Jun 2021, 3:05pm
I toyed with that set-up but IIRC the cable run wasn’t as neat and interfered with the bottle holder I’d set up for that trip. I think it may be a more viable set up with a flat bar brake lever. However if the shifter bracket is hinged then it’s easy to try out either way. What I found was that the shifting was ridiculously easy on top, often requiring only a slight shift with the knuckle in either direction for the rear and a thumb up shift or forefinger down shift on the front. The only downside was when accelerating or when moving at speed in the drops or hoods there was a need to correct the balance when removing a hand for a change. Nothing drastic but certainly something you were aware of. D/t levers are noticeably longer than bar-ends, you might find a need to have the hands further away than where you’d like them to get the full swing of the lever. Easy to set up without cables and experiment with all the above though.
Thank you. I'll definitely experiment with it as you suggest at some point. I also like your suggestion of Gevenelle Audax brake levers fitted with Dura Ace bar end shifters.
IRD https://southerndistributors.co.uk/prod ... evers-sil/ also make a set which I’ve read are nicer than the Gevenalle’s. Better quality hoods, more comfy, more flexible lever positioning, though the boss requires a slight mod with a file to accept Shimano. Something like 1mm taken off.
Apparently the design of these style of brake-shifters originated with Specialites TA in the 1950’s. I’d love to see a photo of those.
Until recently I have been using bar end levers on friction.
I find that on a long climb in the lowest gear the bar end friction didn't hold sufficiently and the rear derailleur self changed - I was never happy using them on index and friction meant that I could use 7,8,9 levers interchangeably.
I have now fitted STI's on my touring bike which work well and obviously brakes are more accessible.
However If I was doing a long tour somewhere remote I'd probably use the bar end levers on reliability grounds.
I've always used bar end changers, so I am biased.
I recently bought a bike with Sti 'brifters'. Wanting to become acquainted with the new steed I decided to ride it home; about 68 miles.
I immediately loved the bike and still do, but just as quickly, I hated the 'brifters'. The whole ensemble was mounted on long proboscis-like
pedestals putting brakes and shifters almost out of reach (this on a bike with the same stem and top tube length as my existing bike).
To effect a down change, the blade of the brake leaver needed to be pushed to the left (r/h lever). The trouble was that when I needed to apply the brakes, the lever moved to the left, necessitating a 'chase the lever' routine before I could apply any retardation. Absolutely not what is required in the circumstances.
) carrying all his needs for 6 months. That to me shouts a 22T front chain ring and a 34 or 36T rear sprocket. Of course, he may have other ideas.