sram apex gears

For discussions about bikes and equipment.
Brucey
Posts: 35525
Joined: 4 Jan 2012, 6:25pm

Re: sram apex gears

Postby Brucey » 27 Jun 2018, 2:28pm

before you condemn the RH shifter, just be sure that you have not pulled the cable through the shifter and that this means you are using the bottom three clicks in the shifter for the top three cogs.

cheers
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Brucey~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

wearwell
Posts: 307
Joined: 3 Feb 2011, 8:45am

Re: sram apex gears

Postby wearwell » 27 Jun 2018, 4:40pm

Checked. No it is the shifter.
Think I'll go for bar end shifters then I won't need to replace the brake levers - just ignore (or cut off) the paddles.
Googled "SRAM shifter problems" - pages and pages come up, so I don't have much hope of a remedy, but will do a dismantle just in case.
They've been a PITA from the beginning and will be glad to see the back of them.

wearwell
Posts: 307
Joined: 3 Feb 2011, 8:45am

Re: sram apex gears

Postby wearwell » 27 Jun 2018, 6:18pm

I've often wondered how it works and now I know!
An ingenious bit of design but a materials failure. Very clear that the splines have broken on the sprocket.
It works OK with no load but jumps under pressure i.e. when connected to the derailleur - which otherwise is working perfectly, not tight, seized or anything.

Image

Airsporter1st
Posts: 564
Joined: 8 Oct 2016, 3:14pm

Re: sram apex gears

Postby Airsporter1st » 27 Jun 2018, 6:29pm

wearwell wrote:
iandriver wrote:Just reading a thread on another forum and people are saying they prefer Apex:

http://www.bikeradar.com/forum/viewtopi ... 8#17174068

Maybe a post here on a more roady forum might be worth your while to try to see why you are struggling. I regularly read about SRAM systems taking some getting used to, but once you do, many seem to get on with it fine.

I've been checking out reviews and reading between the lines with hindsight they all flag up a problem but give the benefit of the doubt, which is fair enough, only time will tell.
New users also tend to give the benefit of the doubt. I did myself at first. But now know for sure that they aren't much good. I'll have another fiddle and adjust. But it'll be back to Spa cycles if they aren't a lot better very soon.


I see you are now 7+ years into this problem, but cannot help wondering why you didn't give Spa Cycles the opportunity of resolving it, as you suggested above?

wearwell
Posts: 307
Joined: 3 Feb 2011, 8:45am

Re: sram apex gears

Postby wearwell » 27 Jun 2018, 6:50pm

Airsporter1st wrote:
wearwell wrote:
iandriver wrote:Just reading a thread on another forum and people are saying they prefer Apex:

http://www.bikeradar.com/forum/viewtopi ... 8#17174068

Maybe a post here on a more roady forum might be worth your while to try to see why you are struggling. I regularly read about SRAM systems taking some getting used to, but once you do, many seem to get on with it fine.

I've been checking out reviews and reading between the lines with hindsight they all flag up a problem but give the benefit of the doubt, which is fair enough, only time will tell.
New users also tend to give the benefit of the doubt. I did myself at first. But now know for sure that they aren't much good. I'll have another fiddle and adjust. But it'll be back to Spa cycles if they aren't a lot better very soon.


I see you are now 7+ years into this problem, but cannot help wondering why you didn't give Spa Cycles the opportunity of resolving it, as you suggested above?
The shop is a long drive away.
I had already returned the wheels which were badly out of true.
I had a knee injury and more or less stopped cycling for sometime. Then decided to fit a triple instead of the 'compact' so that solved the front changer probs. Then the rear changer had been working OK until today.
This, and other faults with this bike showed themselves very gradually, so I never really got around to taking it back. I should have done!
The single worst fault with this bike was that the sand-blasting sand hadn't be cleaned from inside the head tube. This destroyed the oil seals in the bearings and caused the steering to stiffen up, with potentially lethal consequences. It was several years on before I realised the cause of this intermittent problem, which I put down erroneously to adjustment/lubrication.

wearwell
Posts: 307
Joined: 3 Feb 2011, 8:45am

Re: sram apex gears

Postby wearwell » 29 Jun 2018, 9:39am

wearwell wrote:I've often wondered how it works and now I know!
An ingenious bit of design but a materials failure. Very clear that the splines have broken on the sprocket.
It works OK with no load but jumps under pressure i.e. when connected to the derailleur - which otherwise is working perfectly, not tight, seized or anything.

Image

I've looked again at the mech: it seems that the larger pawl is slightly off square, due presumably to wear and use. There are a lot of linkage/pivot points to wear.
This means that it will bear on the outer edge of the spline on the sprocket, instead of square on, and hence all the force goes to one spot and eventually breaks off the corner of the spline.
It's a design fault - the design doesn't allow for normal wear, which will bring about early failure.

Airsporter1st
Posts: 564
Joined: 8 Oct 2016, 3:14pm

Re: sram apex gears

Postby Airsporter1st » 29 Jun 2018, 11:54am

wearwell wrote:
wearwell wrote:I've often wondered how it works and now I know!
An ingenious bit of design but a materials failure. Very clear that the splines have broken on the sprocket.
It works OK with no load but jumps under pressure i.e. when connected to the derailleur - which otherwise is working perfectly, not tight, seized or anything.

Image

I've looked again at the mech: it seems that the larger pawl is slightly off square, due presumably to wear and use. There are a lot of linkage/pivot points to wear.
This means that it will bear on the outer edge of the spline on the sprocket, instead of square on, and hence all the force goes to one spot and eventually breaks off the corner of the spline.
It's a design fault - the design doesn't allow for normal wear, which will bring about early failure.


I'd be inclined to send that photo and your diagnosis to SRAM. If nothing else, they might review their QA/QC.

wearwell
Posts: 307
Joined: 3 Feb 2011, 8:45am

Re: sram apex gears

Postby wearwell » 1 Jul 2018, 7:59am

Airsporter1st wrote:
wearwell wrote:
wearwell wrote:I've often wondered how it works and now I know!
An ingenious bit of design but a materials failure. Very clear that the splines have broken on the sprocket.
It works OK with no load but jumps under pressure i.e. when connected to the derailleur - which otherwise is working perfectly, not tight, seized or anything.

Image

I've looked again at the mech: it seems that the larger pawl is slightly off square, due presumably to wear and use. There are a lot of linkage/pivot points to wear.
This means that it will bear on the outer edge of the spline on the sprocket, instead of square on, and hence all the force goes to one spot and eventually breaks off the corner of the spline.
It's a design fault - the design doesn't allow for normal wear, which will bring about early failure.


I'd be inclined to send that photo and your diagnosis to SRAM. If nothing else, they might review their QA/QC.

And looking even closer! I see a break in the metalwork of the piece which carries the paddle. You can just see the crack near centre of pic just next to the spring. It opens slightly as you work the lever and sends the pawl off at a slight skew, which in turn works on the end of the spline and eventually breaks it off.

Plan now is to get some bar end shifters. If I take the change mech out of the SRAM lever it'll still work as a brake. All problems solved! :shock: for a while at least

wearwell
Posts: 307
Joined: 3 Feb 2011, 8:45am

Re: sram apex gears gutted

Postby wearwell » 11 Jul 2018, 2:32pm

Quite easy to disembowel the change mech. One screw retains the end of the axle pin, the other end poked out with a bent spoke with the levers held out of the way. Pull out the axle and it drops out, paddle and all. Then a little circlip for a spring and all gone, without anaesthetic!
Left with a neat SRAM brake only lever