Simplex Retrofriction levers

For discussions about bikes and equipment.
Post Reply
garygkn
Posts: 1472
Joined: 16 Aug 2008, 8:59pm

Simplex Retrofriction levers

Post by garygkn »

I have some Simplex Retrofriction lever but I don't have any stops on my frame to attach them to.
Does any one know what band on will work.
I know a while back that you could originally buy these levers with a band but I am unsure if the will work with a Campagnolo band or other make?
Brucey
Posts: 44521
Joined: 4 Jan 2012, 6:25pm

Re: Simplex Retrofriction levers

Post by Brucey »

IIRC they will fit to pretty much any band/boss; they dont need the flats, just an M5 thread and the base square.

cheers
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Brucey~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
garygkn
Posts: 1472
Joined: 16 Aug 2008, 8:59pm

Re: Simplex Retrofriction levers

Post by garygkn »

Thank you.
That's good news I was thinking of using them on the Wester Ross.
I am two mind re the build I was thinking of going Campag 9 speed or just carrying on with what is on the bike and just upgrading the levers.
I do have the spare for a Campag triple but it would require a rear wheel build so I think I will just run with what is there already.
It make for a different riding experience.
thirdcrank
Posts: 36776
Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 2:44pm

Re: Simplex Retrofriction levers

Post by thirdcrank »

I've never tried to retro-fit a Simplex lever to a modern boss but when Campag caught on, it made earlier lever bosses and gear hangers useless.

It's not clear to me what sort of Simplex lever you have in mind, but all pre-Campag levers had a much larger cable pulley so using them with a parallelogram mech meant that a tine movement of the lever was all that was needed to change gear.

Anything Simplex made after the Juy Record 60 era, ie when they had gone over to Campag style mechs was Campag compatible. IIRC

PS with apologies to kw, this Benelux lever he is advertising for sale is the style of thing I am talking about.

viewtopic.php?f=32&t=63071
Brucey
Posts: 44521
Joined: 4 Jan 2012, 6:25pm

Re: Simplex Retrofriction levers

Post by Brucey »

I assumed he meant these;

Image

which are the only ones I've ever seen referred to as 'retrofriction'.

You can see the unflatted boss that simplex sold for the braze-on lever; unlike earlier simplex bosses this one had the standard 0.8mm pitch thread.

cheers
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Brucey~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
garygkn
Posts: 1472
Joined: 16 Aug 2008, 8:59pm

Re: Simplex Retrofriction levers

Post by garygkn »

Hi, I was considering using the one that were out in the 80's, they are thin.
Here is a link:

http://www.classiclightweights.co.uk/co ... nents.html

I will have to read the link myself as scanning I think they mention issues.
garygkn
Posts: 1472
Joined: 16 Aug 2008, 8:59pm

Re: Simplex Retrofriction levers

Post by garygkn »

Yes i have the lever just the same.
thirdcrank
Posts: 36776
Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 2:44pm

Re: Simplex Retrofriction levers

Post by thirdcrank »

Brucey wrote: ... which are the only ones I've ever seen referred to as 'retrofriction'. ...


I'm sure you are right. I'd always assumed, probably in ignorance, that retro-friction was a term that was coined when indexing was invented to describe the old system ie something we'd had all along without ever realising it.

--------------------------------------------------------
I've just read the Classic lightweights stuff. very interesting. I think the main point is that once campag caught on over here, there was a period when it carried all before it, even if other stuff was better. I still have a pair of Campag bar end levers fitted - and I did know that the expander worked with the allen key. :D I got them as a swap and thought they looked great because people like Tom Simpson used them. I can understand why team mechanics would not like them because they are terrible to work on, even for something so apparently simple as changing a cable. A triumph of fashion over practicality.
garygkn
Posts: 1472
Joined: 16 Aug 2008, 8:59pm

Re: Simplex Retrofriction levers

Post by garygkn »

Yes I think they are specifically that lever.
It is not a generic term.
Last edited by garygkn on 29 Apr 2012, 11:00pm, edited 1 time in total.
Brucey
Posts: 44521
Joined: 4 Jan 2012, 6:25pm

Re: Simplex Retrofriction levers

Post by Brucey »

garygkn wrote:Hi, I was considering using the one that were out in the 80's, they are thin.
Here is a link:

http://www.classiclightweights.co.uk/co ... nents.html

I will have to read the link myself as scanning I think they mention issues.


It looks as if they used the coarse-pitch thread on the screws in the band-on levers (which are different many other ways too).

The braze-on version whenever I have seen it has a standard M5 x 0.8mm threaded screw in it. If this gets worn (the slots are rather shallow) it can be replaced; it is held captive in the lever assy by a plastic collar, and a little force will simply push it off.

Apart from the screw slots wearing the only other thing that might go wrong is the drag spring breaking inside. Invariably if this happens the tang breaks off. I've seen that happen a couple of times; a temporary repair can usually be made by bending the spring end to make a fresh tang.

cheers
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Brucey~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
GavinC
Posts: 387
Joined: 9 Mar 2009, 10:38pm

Re: Simplex Retrofriction levers

Post by GavinC »

I've just installed a set of Simplex retrofriction levers on a 9 speed Campag setup. Because of the small diameter of the lever barrel, the lever has to travel 180 degrees to access the full range of gears - the lever is pointing downwards to your cranks when you're on the largest sprocket.

I haven't tried it on the road yet, so I don't know if it actually makes any difference in real use, but it certainly looks very strange. :)
Brucey
Posts: 44521
Joined: 4 Jan 2012, 6:25pm

Re: Simplex Retrofriction levers

Post by Brucey »

yes I should imagine that total cable pull is an issue with campag. IIRC shimano road systems need a little less cable pull per gear so should need less total movement. Good to know it looks like it can work with the campag though.

cheers
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Brucey~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
garygkn
Posts: 1472
Joined: 16 Aug 2008, 8:59pm

Re: Simplex Retrofriction levers

Post by garygkn »

I heard that they didn't have enough wind to be useful on modern cassettes. I only have 5 in the back I might swap it out for 6 but I think I may just keep it going its had no wear. If I upgrade I will go to a 9 close ratio with a triple.
BigG
Posts: 984
Joined: 7 Jun 2010, 4:29pm
Location: Devon

Re: Simplex Retrofriction levers

Post by BigG »

Early Simplex dt levers, like Huret and Benelux, used 3/16" BSF threads. Later ones including my Retrofriction levers and the nearly identical Mavic ones use M5 metric threads. Band-on bosses to take these are available on ebay, but I have had no success in buying cheap levers and using the bosses from these. The square locating plate never seems to fit. The Simplex Retrofriction lever was in the 1970s the best down tube lever available. The Suntour Power Ratchet levers challenged it a few years later IIRC. Both used a ratchet without friction when pulling against the derailleur spring but used friction only to hold the lever in the opposite direction.
User avatar
GuyBoden
Posts: 63
Joined: 29 Jul 2015, 7:11pm

Re: Simplex Retrofriction levers

Post by GuyBoden »

If you are interested in the Simplex Retrofriction shifters, I think that this is a good read:
https://bikeretrogrouch.blogspot.com/20 ... t-one.html
Post Reply