Discs or canti's on a new tourer

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al_yrpal
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Re: Discs or canti's on a new tourer

Postby al_yrpal » 30 Apr 2012, 9:57am

i bought my Halfords Subway on the premise that it had:

Perfect geometry on a stiff frame

Perfect gear ratios for loaded touring

Fat tyres on 26" wheels for the odd bit of rough stuff

Discs , cable operated for simplicity and capable of stopping 15st rider with touring load.

I haven't been disappointed with the discs. An extra lb - pah!

Al
Touring on a bicycle is a great way to explore and appreciate the countryside and towns you pass through. What do you do to make a difference?

Brucey
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Re: Discs or canti's on a new tourer

Postby Brucey » 30 Apr 2012, 10:57am

I agree... 36h wheels would be welcome but for the price it is churlish to criticise it.

cheers
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Bowland Rider
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Re: Discs or canti's on a new tourer

Postby Bowland Rider » 30 Apr 2012, 12:36pm

I've got a Trek Mountain bike with disc brakes, a trek 7.3Fx hybrid with V brakes and a Surly LHT with cantilever brakes. IMO disc brakes are the best. Surly is now producing an LHT with disc brakes, had it been available at the time i would have bought it. I have no confidence in the canti's whatsoever. Utter crap IMO. Not effective at stopping even an unloaded bike on descents. Before anybody starts asking if they're set up correctly, the answer is YES as they were set up by mechanic at LBS who was singing the praises of properly set up canti's.

I'd have gone for disc brakes given the choice as they are far superior to all others IMO. It is possible to get disc compatible racks now too. Im looking at retro fitting the LHT with V brakes, the canti's are going!

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531colin
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Re: Discs or canti's on a new tourer

Postby 531colin » 30 Apr 2012, 1:05pm

Mini Vees with road STI are better than most cantis, fullsize Vees with appropriate levers are better again.

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CREPELLO
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Re: Discs or canti's on a new tourer

Postby CREPELLO » 30 Apr 2012, 3:25pm

531colin wrote:Mini Vees with road STI are better than most cantis, fullsize Vees with appropriate levers are better again.

I have been pondering swapping to mini v's on the tourer, but two things concern me:
*What's the gap between the brake blocks and the wheel rim? What gap can be considered acceptable if the bike is going to used in muddy condition?
*Will the top part of the brake clear the top of the mudgaurd to leave good mud clearance for 32mm tyres?

If both these clearances are acceptable, then I would consider mini v's.

mrjemm
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Re: Discs or canti's on a new tourer

Postby mrjemm » 30 Apr 2012, 3:54pm

Bowland Rider wrote:It is possible to get disc compatible racks now too.


You only need these if the brakes are fitted outside the seat-stays. If they're fitted on the chain-stay/inside the seat-stay you can use a normal rack. I have one of both, and a disc-specific (read old style outside disc) rack on the Merlin, and numerous standard style racks in the shed for the Salsa (narrow jobbie fitted right now, which I'll probably keep on for the next trip or 2).

The crapness of the cantis was one reason I got rid of my Jake, along with hating STIs and being generally too big. (How negative!).

johnb
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Re: Discs or canti's on a new tourer

Postby johnb » 30 Apr 2012, 4:04pm

I feel I'm going to have to quicken up my speed a bit cause I have no problem stopping the bike with canti brakes.
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andrewjoseph
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Re: Discs or canti's on a new tourer

Postby andrewjoseph » 30 Apr 2012, 4:04pm

mrjemm wrote:...

Sorry to once again divert a thread... Andrew, I'm curious to hear about your Burls Ti, it's a current pipe-dream for my next build. The price seems very good for a pretty Ti bike, but on his site some welds look poor- http://www.burls.co.uk/images/ti/largeForks.jpg (perhaps worth another thread or PM, sorry guys).

Cheers, Jem.


Jem, i went with burls because the welds looked better than many I'd seen (not that image though). you can see more images of our bikes on:

http://www.ba-joseph.co.uk/burls

hth
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mrjemm
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Re: Discs or canti's on a new tourer

Postby mrjemm » 1 May 2012, 6:35am

Thanks for the link there Andrew. Off to peruse now...

...Fascinating bikes. Look very smart. Interesting to note the front brakes mounted forward of the forks; is that to escape the need for "lawyer lugs". Curious rear ends too.

And the welds are definitely better!

Cheers, Jem.

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[XAP]Bob
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Re: Discs or canti's on a new tourer

Postby [XAP]Bob » 1 May 2012, 7:13am

mrjemm wrote:Thanks for the link there Andrew. Off to peruse now...

...Fascinating bikes. Look very smart. Interesting to note the front brakes mounted forward of the forks; is that to escape the need for "lawyer lugs". Curious rear ends too.

And the welds are definitely better!

Cheers, Jem.

Most bikes I see have the front brakes forward of the forks. If the bosses snap then the brake isn't instantly in the spokes...

May be other reasons as well (less likely to be self energising?)
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
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mrjemm
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Re: Discs or canti's on a new tourer

Postby mrjemm » 1 May 2012, 7:23am

These are disc brakes Bob. I'd be surprised if most of those you've seen are forward.

andrewjoseph
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Re: Discs or canti's on a new tourer

Postby andrewjoseph » 1 May 2012, 10:42am

mrjemm wrote:Thanks for the link there Andrew. Off to peruse now...

...Fascinating bikes. Look very smart. Interesting to note the front brakes mounted forward of the forks; is that to escape the need for "lawyer lugs". Curious rear ends too.

And the welds are definitely better!

Cheers, Jem.


Jem, the front brakes are on the front of the forks to help prevent the brakes pulling the axle out of the dropout if the QR (I have allen key bolts) come loose. The tabs have a recess too. if things get loose braking will pull the axle up into the drop outs. or that's the theory. i asked justin to do these specially for us.

The rear dropouts are thick Ti plates with no removable mech hanger. Justin assured me that if I manage to bend the plates, the rest of the bike won't be fit to ride.

the rear brakes are inside the triangle to make mounting a rack easier.
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Burls Ti Tourer for tarmac
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mrjemm
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Re: Discs or canti's on a new tourer

Postby mrjemm » 1 May 2012, 11:07am

They look really good to me, and I like that he's willing to try such different things and come out with something that works. I have been having these thoughts about succumbing to temptation, but it's more about self-justification than affordability; my riding doesn't deserve something so nice, but when I consider other forms of transport, that price is not so bad- teenagers have scooters and cars that cost more than a Ti frame, but it's bespoke, fitted and very very nice.

I see there are eyes on the forks, but do you need an adapted rack for the front?

Sorry for the hijack, OP, but maybe some useful things come up!

bealer
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Re: Discs or canti's on a new tourer

Postby bealer » 1 May 2012, 12:47pm

Does anyone use mini-v's?

Was just looking at them as an option (brake lever dependent) but googling around can't find clear info on clearace. I ride up to 32C with 45mm wide SKS Chromoplastics. Would they be able to clear them?

Brucey
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Re: Discs or canti's on a new tourer

Postby Brucey » 1 May 2012, 1:41pm

maybe; brake arm length, boss height, mudguard clearance, all vary. I can fit a nominal 1.9" knobbly under mini Vs on one bike I own (no mudguards)

Mini V arms are typically 80-90mm long IIRC

cheers
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