How do I tell if my Shimano freehub is 8 or 9 speed?

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barryandjanet
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How do I tell if my Shimano freehub is 8 or 9 speed?

Postby barryandjanet » 2 Mar 2013, 4:49pm

Hi Guys

I have purchased a second-hand wheel from eBay and also bought a new Ultegra 9 speed cassette to go on the Ultegra hub, thinking that it was a 9 speed freehub. However, when I put the cassette on the splines only about 1mm of spline remains for the final sprocket and when I fit the lock-ring it is quite tight after little more than 1 full turn. Therefore, is my freehub really an 8 speed freehub?

On the web I see 8 and 9 speed as being mentioned as interchangeable but I cannot understand this. Surely 9 sprockets need a longer spline than 8 sprockets.

What am I doing wrong? :(

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cycleruk
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Re: How do I tell if my Shimano freehub is 8 or 9 speed?

Postby cycleruk » 2 Mar 2013, 7:08pm

If an 8 fits then so should the 9 and even 10 speed cassettes.
I have not had a 9 speed cassette but do have a couple of 10s on my originally 8 speed hubs.

9 speed cassettes have thinner spacers & sprockets and that is why they fit in the same space as an 8 speed.
(obviously will also need a 9 speed chain.)
You'll never know if you don't try it.

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cycle cat
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Re: How do I tell if my Shimano freehub is 8 or 9 speed?

Postby cycle cat » 2 Mar 2013, 7:15pm

It may be possible to fit a wider cassette body on it if the current cassette won't fit.
Google Shimano tech docs then look up the part number for your hub.
Thank goodness for soup.

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531colin
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Re: How do I tell if my Shimano freehub is 8 or 9 speed?

Postby 531colin » 2 Mar 2013, 7:27pm

As cycleruk says, 8,9,&10 cassettes all fit the same hub.
Long ago, there used to be 7 speed hubs....you won't have one of them....probably!
Take the cassette off, have a good look for bits of dirt, swarf, etc. that could stop it going fully "home". Make sure you are lining up the splines on the top sprocket and the body.
I don't think its very likely that somebody will have either fitted a spacer, or ground down the cassette body to fit say 8 sprockets from a 9 cassette in order to get the wheel into a narrow frame....just to check, it should measure 130mm from locknut to locknut.

Brucey
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Re: How do I tell if my Shimano freehub is 8 or 9 speed?

Postby Brucey » 2 Mar 2013, 7:45pm

the splines should be ~35mm long on a 8/9/10s freehub.

cheers
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meic
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Re: How do I tell if my Shimano freehub is 8 or 9 speed?

Postby meic » 2 Mar 2013, 7:54pm

If it was a seven speed hub then your threads would not even touch each other.
Yma o Hyd

Brucey
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Re: How do I tell if my Shimano freehub is 8 or 9 speed?

Postby Brucey » 2 Mar 2013, 8:47pm

BTW the last sprocket only goes on one way; it too, has one odd spline. If you put it on in the wrong place, the locknut won't do up, pretty much as you describe.

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andrew_s
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Re: How do I tell if my Shimano freehub is 8 or 9 speed?

Postby andrew_s » 2 Mar 2013, 9:17pm

9 speed cassettes are a little wider than 8 speed (36.5mm vs 35.4), but not by so much more that the lockring doesn't hold everything together properly.

barryandjanet
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Re: How do I tell if my Shimano freehub is 8 or 9 speed?

Postby barryandjanet » 3 Mar 2013, 5:36pm

Wow guys, thanks for all or the feedback and suggestions. I have a few comments below.

Cycleruk: “If an 8 fits then so should the 9 and even 10 speed cassettes.”
I only have a 9 so cannot tell.

Cycle cat: “It may be possible to fit a wider cassette body on it if the current cassette won't fit.”
This might be the solution – see below.

531 colin: Lots of suggestions. I’ve cleaned the brand new Ultegra 9 speed and see no change. No grit then. The freehub looks pristine now and shows no sign of modification.

Brucey: “the splines should be ~35mm long on a 8/9/10s freehub.”
Ta raaa…. They measure 32.5mm of actual spline and then 2mm of non spline to the end.

Brucey: “BTW the last sprocket only goes on one way; it too, has one odd spline. If you put it on in the wrong place, the locknut won't do up, pretty much as you describe.”
The last sprocket has a built in spacer and has the serrations to mate up with the lock ring. So, as you say, it only goes one way. I think I must have it correct because when the lock ring is tightened the whole cassette firms up.

Andrew_s: “9 speed cassettes are a little wider than 8 speed (36.5mm vs 35.4),”
Mine measures 36.5 just as a nine speed should.

So it looks like I have a narrow freehub, based on brucey’s comment. What type of freehub has been fitted to my Ultegra hub then? Might it be non Shimano?

And Brucey have I measured correctly.

SilverBadge
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Re: How do I tell if my Shimano freehub is 8 or 9 speed?

Postby SilverBadge » 4 Mar 2013, 7:17pm

barryandjanet wrote:Wow guys, thanks for all or the feedback and suggestions. I have a few comments below.

So it looks like I have a narrow freehub, based on brucey’s comment. What type of freehub has been fitted to my Ultegra hub then? Might it be non Shimano?
It probably is Shimano, before 8 speed was invented rear cassette hubs were 7 speed and 126mm across locknuts, not 130mm. The main hub body was the same. I have converted a 7 speed to 8 speed by swapping the freehub over, really should have used a correspondingly longer axle too but I didn't bother. If the wheel fits the frame then fit one less sprocket to the splines and the top one should tighten up. Even the riveted ones can be separated.

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meic
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Re: How do I tell if my Shimano freehub is 8 or 9 speed?

Postby meic » 4 Mar 2013, 7:25pm

SilverBadge wrote:
barryandjanet wrote:Wow guys, thanks for all or the feedback and suggestions. I have a few comments below.

So it looks like I have a narrow freehub, based on brucey’s comment. What type of freehub has been fitted to my Ultegra hub then? Might it be non Shimano?
It probably is Shimano, before 8 speed was invented rear cassette hubs were 7 speed and 126mm across locknuts, not 130mm. The main hub body was the same. I have converted a 7 speed to 8 speed by swapping the freehub over, really should have used a correspondingly longer axle too but I didn't bother. If the wheel fits the frame then fit one less sprocket to the splines and the top one should tighten up. Even the riveted ones can be separated.


It isnt that simple. Seven and even six speed shimano cassette freehubs were built on 130 OLN axles as well as on 126mm versions.
Seven speeds were also built on 135mm OLN axles.
Yma o Hyd

barryandjanet
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Re: How do I tell if my Shimano freehub is 8 or 9 speed?

Postby barryandjanet » 4 Mar 2013, 9:38pm

Hi Guys

I've measured the OLN and its about 127mm, as near as I can measure. I notice that the axle seems quite long and protrudes 7mm one side and 4mm the other beyond the nuts. Maybe the freehub has been replaced with a thinner one. So maybe I could get a a real 9 speed to fit.

Barry

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meic
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Re: How do I tell if my Shimano freehub is 8 or 9 speed?

Postby meic » 4 Mar 2013, 9:55pm

Two possible problems.

Firstly freehubs cost almost as much as whole hubs.
Secondly they are not all cross compatible, without knowing which hub you have you can not be certain that the freehub which you buy will fit the hub body that you have.
Yma o Hyd

Brucey
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Re: How do I tell if my Shimano freehub is 8 or 9 speed?

Postby Brucey » 5 Mar 2013, 9:40am

barryandjanet wrote: Brucey: “the splines should be ~35mm long on a 8/9/10s freehub.”
Ta raaa…. They measure 32.5mm of actual spline and then 2mm of non spline to the end.
And Brucey have I measured correctly.


Well I wasn't 100% explicit there; actually I should have said that the body with the splines on is ~35mm long. The splines are very often about 1.5 or 2mm shorter than the body. So I'd say that what you have is nominally an 8s freehub body, just a slightly undersize one.

Stupid question; there isn't a thin spacer left on the body when the cogs are off?

cheers
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barryandjanet
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Re: How do I tell if my Shimano freehub is 8 or 9 speed?

Postby barryandjanet » 5 Mar 2013, 11:43am

This post has been edited as I got confused about cassettes and freehubs. I think its now correct.

I’ve now taken the freehub off and notice that, although the wheels are not new, the grease within looks new, so I think the wheel has had a recent overhaul and freehub change, possibly to an 8 speed. Maybe the previous owner has been around this loop, got fed up and simple got rid on eBay.

Having only recently purchased this pair of wheels from eBay and also a new cassette I’m inclined to see this through so might buy a genuine 105 or Ultegra 9 speed freehub from Wiggle etc as they allow returns if it doesn’t fit.

BTW, for a given vintage are 105 and Ultegra freehubs interchangeable.

Thanks for your continued help.

Barry
Last edited by barryandjanet on 5 Mar 2013, 1:06pm, edited 1 time in total.