Gearing question

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531colin
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Joined: 4 Dec 2009, 6:56pm
Location: North Yorkshire

Re: Gearing question

Postby 531colin » 5 Dec 2013, 9:04am

meic wrote:.................... it could be that a light tourer isnt necessarily a bike with a low frame weight but a bike designed to be at optimum rigidity and flexibility with a light touring load.
...................


Meic, your understanding is exactly the same as mine.
I have never been obsessed with bike weights....there is too much junk in my saddlebag for it to make sense to be obsessed with the bike weight.
Long ago, somebody said to me "If you have a bike which is comfortable, and another that is 2 pounds lighter, then you will ride the comfortable bike." I have found this to be the case.

To pick up on Brucey's point about the fork blades. I have forks with Reynolds EB708 blades, which Reynolds recommend for fitting low-rider bosses. I also have forks with 631 blades. The forks are the same oval at the crown, and the same circle at the dropout. However, the taper is such that the 631 blades are narrower for almost all of their length. The EB 708 forks feel stiffer to me than 531ST, whereas the 631 feel about like the original 531 butted, but not as flexible as the old 531C.

Horizon wrote a long post supporting "full-on" tourers.....I will simply highlighted a different bit of my post.....

531colin wrote:..............
At the other extreme, there are plenty of tourers built to take you and the kitchen sink to wherever you want to go. They will also do a Sunday ride......that is, they will unless you want to be the quickest on your Sunday ride. ...........................


This does ignore the pure joy of simply riding a "light bike".

When we get round to discussing the difference in actual size of the same nominal size tyres from different manufacturers, it means only one thing to me.....the clearance is too small.

I started riding in the early sixties on secondhand clubman's frames from a previous decade. The clearances and handling of those frames was much closer to to-days tourers than to-day's "winter trainers". By to-day's standards the brakes were poor, and you walked the steep hills, but in many ways they were more of a general-purpose bike than most of to-days bikes.

I derailed the topic, so to get back......I think a 110/74 BCD chainset has a lot to recommend it. Get a good pair of cranks, and cheap rings. When you know what you really need, you can fit decent rings, without needing a different bottom bracket unit. And I would have square taper for durability.

MartinC
Posts: 1837
Joined: 10 May 2007, 6:31pm
Location: Bredon

Re: Gearing question

Postby MartinC » 5 Dec 2013, 9:06am

reohn2 wrote:RickH
You'll get more clearance than that with a half round m/guard such as SKS Bluemels,and the flare to the edges is a bit more than standard SKS 'squares' too :wink:


Sound advice in my view too. The half round often fit the profile of the brake stirrup better as well

keyboardmonkey
Posts: 657
Joined: 1 Dec 2009, 5:05pm
Location: Yorkshire

Re: Gearing question

Postby keyboardmonkey » 14 Dec 2013, 9:01pm

If the OP is still interested I would recommend the Kinesis Racelight T2 for your apparent needs. If you go for it I am going to assume you are having a 10-speed cassette, so here are a few suggestions:

If your bike shop will build to your (Shimano?) specification get a Shimano XT (M772) Shadow rear derailleur. This is a nine-speed model, but will work for you and take up to a 36 sprocket (later, 10-speed, derailleurs won’t work with road STI levers – another assumption I’m making about your potential bike). Get an SRAM PG1050 or PG1070 cassette (not cheap, though) now or later. Or go with the smaller chain ring if you prefer and if the triple chainset allows. (Or do both!)

Get Shimano R650 brake calipers. You won’t regret the small price premium.

I have the 2010 T2. Yours may come with a higher head tube. That’s no bad thing. I have ridden with a rack bag and bar bag, but I would carry light panniers without any concern.

I rode uphill out of Settle and downhill into Pateley Bridge on a day ride a few years ago (back then on Shimano M324 pedals with toe clips on the flat side and the straps loose). I needed the low gears I fitted on my bike and I would have liked those better brakes on the day.

If you are thinking of a build with a nine-speed cassette there is a link in this post that offers a way to get a 13-34 cassette without too much of an effort:

http://cycleseven.org/kinesis-racelight-t2-review

I now have seven bikes, including a light tourer, but if I was forced to choose just one bike to have it would be my Kinesis. It doesn’t allow me to do everything, but it offers more flexibility than any of my others. Hope this helps – KM.

alpgirl
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Joined: 30 May 2012, 10:22pm

Re: Gearing question

Postby alpgirl » 15 Dec 2013, 9:21am

I have a touring bike (a Galaxy), with the intention of going touring, although have not been yet. I go on club rides with it, have done several Audaxes (shortish ones, as Audaxes go!), and due to the gearing I find I pass people on hills. For me it is a great, all round, go anywear bike (rough tracks too!). Plus it's comfortable to ride. So, as someone already mentioned, make sure you are getting the right bike for you.

F70100
Posts: 111
Joined: 4 Dec 2013, 10:33am

Re: Gearing question

Postby F70100 » 15 Dec 2013, 4:51pm

keyboardmonkey wrote:If the OP is still interested I would recommend the Kinesis Racelight T2 for your apparent needs. If you go for it I am going to assume you are having a 10-speed cassette, so here are a few suggestions:


Still here and still interested!

Having only ridden my 25 year old non maintained Dawes hybrid in fits and starts over the last 20 years, last week I took advantage of Evans Cycles test ride offer to try an up to date road bike. Having listened to my brief, I was guided to try a Trek Madone (alu frame, carbon fork, compact 50/34 and 12-30). I managed about 3 miles before getting a puncture but was able to reassure myself (within the limitations of the test ride) that the ratios available in that compact setup would probably be fine, and that the Madone geometry was too aggressive. Notwithstanding that, the bike was head and shoulders above my old Dawes (as you would expect).

It seems some manufacturers are designing for a "sportive" market; essentially road bikes with a more relaxed geometry. The Cannondale Synapse is one potential model on my list, and comparing the geometry of that frame to the T2, they don't appear (to me) to be remarkably different in the 54cm frame size. It's possible that my LBS's proposals for wheels (Miche sealed hubs and more spokes) might be more suited to my needs than the wheels specced in the Synapse - not sure... The Cannondale also has a disc brake but that's going to be a whole new debate I suspect :D .

Coming down to the differences:

Kinesis - external cable routing, rack top mounts brazed on, saddle to buy, perhaps better wheels, conventional callipers.

Cannondale - internal cable routing, clips available cheaply for top rack mounts, starter saddle included, don't know anything about wheels, disc brake.

Prices are broadly similar.

Which colour scheme do I like best :D ???

keyboardmonkey
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Joined: 1 Dec 2009, 5:05pm
Location: Yorkshire

Re: Gearing question

Postby keyboardmonkey » 15 Dec 2013, 5:35pm

The Cannnondale frame gets a good review in the January 2014 edition of Cycling Plus. It's used on a bike half the price again. I understand those wheels are heavy, though, if that makes much of a difference to you.

If you're not carrying much kit you can get away with P clips to secure a rear rack to the top of the seat stays. Personally I prefer the proper fittings (although since I fitted the BR650 brakes to my Kinesis I've currently managed to fit only one of the top fastenings in place because of the shape of the caliper!), but it's not a deal breaker.

The thing that might sway me is the compact chainset on the Cannondale. I find on my bike with a compact chainset (50/34 with 12-28 cassette) that I can't quite always get at the right gear without a fair bit of chain deflection on both the large and small chain ring. I can live with it where I normally cycle, but I have no trouble finding the right gear with the 50/39/30 chainset on my Kinesis. I would like the option of lower gears, especially if you are serious about the Way of the Roses :)

Good luck and yes, colour does matter :D

F70100
Posts: 111
Joined: 4 Dec 2013, 10:33am

Re: Gearing question

Postby F70100 » 15 Dec 2013, 6:13pm

Still going to take a little time to think it over - my intention is to go out and purchase in early january.

The Way of the Roses might be giving way to my own trip - got a route planned from St Davids (SW Wales) to Cromer (approx 400 miles over 7 days). I'm calling it "Side to Side" ©. It's only hilly for the first third!!

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RickH
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Location: Horwich, Lancs.

Re: Gearing question

Postby RickH » 15 Dec 2013, 11:51pm

A couple more comments on Kinesis - I really like my Tk. It works really well as long as I don't try to carry more than about 10kg long distances on the rear rack (it starts to fell a bit like the tail is wagging the dog on fast descents - not unmanageably so but noticeable), a trailer works better if I want to carry more. Lightly loaded its handling has almost invariably been better than my nerves can manage - & I'm happy doing speeds of 45+mph on half decent descents & I haven't come off yet. The current Tk3 frame is more expensive than the T2 (IIRC the price differential has increased since I got mine - my memory says it was ~£100 between the then "T" & "Tk") but never having ridden a "T" I've no idea how much difference it makes - I just really liked the ruby red the Tk came in at the time! :)

However, if I was getting the bike now I would probably go for the Pro6, ostensibly a CX bike, with very similar geometry, spec & price (compared to the Tk3) but running discs & the space for wider tyres. Others opinions may vary but having discs on the tandem has sold me on them, admittedly the tandem does lower mileage but I haven't even had to change the pads in over 3 years (plus the brakes are pretty much the same whatever the weather) compared to numerous sets of pads & I reckon on about 4000 miles out of a set of Open Pro rims, at about £100 a pair rebuild, on the gritty roads & steep hills round here.

Rick.

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meic
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Re: Gearing question

Postby meic » 15 Dec 2013, 11:59pm

F70100 wrote:Still going to take a little time to think it over - my intention is to go out and purchase in early january.

The Way of the Roses might be giving way to my own trip - got a route planned from St Davids (SW Wales) to Cromer (approx 400 miles over 7 days). I'm calling it "Side to Side" ©. It's only hilly for the first third!!


I managed about 3 miles before getting a puncture but was able to reassure myself (within the limitations of the test ride) that the ratios available in that compact setup would probably be fine,


As somebody who lives in that first third, I can say that three miles isnt long enough to work out that any gearing is low enough.
I know people who can do it on fixed but me myself, I need at least less than 1:1 ratios.
Yma o Hyd