Dynamo front light

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redfacedbaldfatman
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Joined: 25 Aug 2012, 2:15pm

Re: Dynamo front light

Post by redfacedbaldfatman »

stewartpratt wrote:From my limited use of the Luxos U so far, mine seems to charge via USB just fine with the lights on...


The manual states:

"Permanent USB charging with more than 100mA is only possible when all light functions are switched off. When the cache battery is charged, simultaneous charging and use of the light function is temporarily possible. The duration of this depends on the charging status of the cache battery, cycling speed, the quality of the dynamo and the energy demand of the connected USB device"

So maybe your dynamo is a higher output or your USB device isn't taking much power. I've been watching my iphone charge on my desk and the current went from 0.5A at 50% battery charge to about 0.1A at 90%. Now at fully charged at 100% the iphone is taking 0.03A.
Also I haven't ridden the bike for long enough yet, so maybe my cache isn't fully charged yet. It certainly would be great to be able to keep the iphone "topped up" even at night.

On the other note about rear lights, maybe there was something wrong with my Cyo as the rear lights always "woke up" when turning the front wheel even by a few inches, even when the Cyo was switched off.
stewartpratt
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Re: Dynamo front light

Post by stewartpratt »

redfacedbaldfatman wrote:So maybe your dynamo is a higher output or your USB device isn't taking much power.


Yeah, not sure. It seems to have kept my Garmin ticking over while I've had it plugged in but 1. that's quite a low-power device (I think ~100mA is adequate to charge it) and 2. I've not extensively tested it. I need to give it a longer go with the Garmin and with a phone.

My main use for it would be for the Garmin, anyway, so if it keeps that alive indefinitely then I'm happy.
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honesty
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Re: Dynamo front light

Post by honesty »

Ive found lights and charging fine with mine as well, though only above a certain speed (between 8 and 10mph if I remember correctly), below that the cache battery will start discharging, then the charge will be diverted from the usb to recharging the cache battery.

My switch has the sealed input but usb right on the switch with a white cover. I'm assuming the new configuration is so you can fit an e-werk on simply from the switch?
redfacedbaldfatman
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Re: Dynamo front light

Post by redfacedbaldfatman »

honesty wrote:My switch has the sealed input but usb right on the switch with a white cover. I'm assuming the new configuration is so you can fit an e-werk on simply from the switch?


It looks like the same connector as the e-werk.
De Sisti
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Re: Dynamo front light

Post by De Sisti »

[quote="pete75"]The Edelux is a repackaged B&M.[/quote]
Where's the evidence?
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andrew_s
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Re: Dynamo front light

Post by andrew_s »

De Sisti wrote:
pete75 wrote:The Edelux is a repackaged B&M.

Where's the evidence?

The reflector is a B+M reflector - it says so on the Schmidt website.
. The Edelux II outshines his elder brother Edelux - with the latest LED technology and Busch and Muller's new IQ-Tec Premium mirror design
The lamp housing is completely different.
Schmidt buy the LEDs according to their own specs (they used to pick slightly geener tints with the Edelux 1).
It's not clear whether the PCB & electronics are the same or not. It's unlikely that they are absolutely identical because the better cooling allows the LED to be run at a slightly higher current.
peterh11
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Re: Dynamo front light

Post by peterh11 »

Timely thread - I am looking at these lights too. Anyone had a chance to compare the Edelux II and the Cyo Premium in practice? I've seen conflicting opinions on review web sites. Peter White says they are basically the same, but Schmidt claim higher Lux measurements and I've seen comments also that Schmidt use a better lens which gets rid of some artifacts in the light. I agree that the Edelux looks nice, but hesitate to part with more than twice the price (~ 60 EUR from Bike-discount for the Cyo Premium, £120+ for the Edelux II) unless there is a noticeable difference in the light quality, spread or brightness.

Also, there is a comment on the Schmidt web site about how the light is asymmetric like a car headlight to reduce dazzle for oncoming drivers, which would mean it would give more light out to the right (for those riding on the right hand side of the road), so make it less suitable if anything for the UK.

Peter H
MikeF
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Re: Dynamo front light

Post by MikeF »

redfacedbaldfatman wrote:...My rear lights seem to burn brighter than with my old Cyo RT (I have a toplight line brake plus and a seculite plus)....
Are you running these rear lights simultaneously from the same generator? I've tried front lights in series, but not experimented with rear lights.
"It takes a genius to spot the obvious" - my old physics master.
I don't peddle bikes.
IanW
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Re: Dynamo front light

Post by IanW »

Caveat: I do not have experience of the Edelux II or the Cyo plus series.

But in my household we have 4 hub dynamos and the following headlights:
Edelux, Cyo T, Philips Saferide 60 and Lyt senseo plus.

The Edelux is beautifully made, works very well but costs a lot more than the other options.

The Cyo T is as good a light as the Edelux, but is definitely more lightly constructed / flimsy.
Beam pattern *very* similar to the Edelux

The Saferide 60 is definitely the better light output / spread, its construction is about mid-way between the Edelux and the Cyo
But ... I replaced the OEM flimsy fork-crown mounting bracked on the Saferide 60 with an Edelux mounting bracket.
Beam pattern definitely better and wider.

The Lyt senseo plus light output is feeble by comparison, but is at least as well constructed as the Cyo.

If I was buying again just now I'd go for the Saferide 60 (with Edelux bracket modification)

But see caveat above, as I might go for one of the models of Cyo plus or Edelux II (if I had the funds for a much more expensive light)

Note that my / our riding (at night) is almost exclusively on tarmac roads.
Therefore a stvzo-compliant light is the preferred option.
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interestedcp
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Re: Dynamo front light

Post by interestedcp »

peterh11 wrote:Timely thread - I am looking at these lights too. Anyone had a chance to compare the Edelux II and the Cyo Premium in practice? I've seen conflicting opinions on review web sites. Peter White says they are basically the same, but Schmidt claim higher Lux measurements and I've seen comments also that Schmidt use a better lens which gets rid of some artifacts in the light. I agree that the Edelux looks nice, but hesitate to part with more than twice the price (~ 60 EUR from Bike-discount for the Cyo Premium, £120+ for the Edelux II) unless there is a noticeable difference in the light quality, spread or brightness.

Also, there is a comment on the Schmidt web site about how the light is asymmetric like a car headlight to reduce dazzle for oncoming drivers, which would mean it would give more light out to the right (for those riding on the right hand side of the road), so make it less suitable if anything for the UK.

Peter H


The Edelux II has better cooling, the front glass is treated with anti-reflective material for higher light transmission, so it ought to be slightly better than the Cyo Premium. The old Edelux would have roughly 10% higher output over the Cyo. Nice, but probably really hard to notice.

So the Edelux II probably has slightly better output, much better RF shielding so as not to disturb wireless cyclocomputers (not seen the new Premium tested, but even if its RF shielding has improved, it probably isn't a match for the Edelux). Beautiful build quality.
As I understand it, the Edelux II is really watertight. The Cyo Premium has another strategy; it is not completely watertight all around since it allows draining of water ingress or condensation.

The light beam pattern are identical on both the Edelux II and the Cyo Premium. There is nothing asymmetrical about its beam pattern on the lateral plane, and it would be hard to make due to the TA23/StZVO test that defines that the most intensive part of the beam should be in the middle.

(edit: sorry for posting the same pic twice in this thread)
Here is the Edelux II beam pattern as seen on the ground from above. The distance is 50 meters, the intensity is in Lux (log scale).
Image

At 28 meters distance the beam goes below 8 Lux, don't expect much above that distance.

Is the Edelux II worth the extra price? Probably depend on one's cycling budget.
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honesty
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Re: Dynamo front light

Post by honesty »

In the UK, if you have access to it, it's worth remembering that a dynamo light and wheel count as accessories for a cycle to work scheme and are therefore eligible to buy using an accessories only scheme. Makes paying for the edelux a little easier!
pete75
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Re: Dynamo front light

Post by pete75 »

IanW wrote:
The Saferide 60 is definitely the better light output / spread, its construction is about mid-way between the Edelux and the Cyo
But ... I replaced the OEM flimsy fork-crown mounting bracked on the Saferide 60 with an Edelux mounting bracket.
Beam pattern definitely better and wider.

The Lyt senseo plus light output is feeble by comparison, but is at least as well constructed as the Cyo.

If I was buying again just now I'd go for the Saferide 60 (with Edelux bracket modification)



According to this website which has pretty comprehensive reviews and tests of dynamo lights the Saferide 60 is about as good as dynamo front lights get. He does say the mounting bracket lacked stiffness though is much improved on later versions.

http://swhs.home.xs4all.nl/fiets/tests/ ... oor_dynamo
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willem jongman
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Re: Dynamo front light

Post by willem jongman »

On our bikes with hub generators we have two Edelux 1 lights, one Saferide 60 and a retro version of the Lyt. To begin with the last one, the Lyt is excellent for city riding, but for me not good enough on unlit roads. I did compare the Edelux 1 and the Saferide side by side. The output of the Edelux is marginally more. In particular it throws more light into the distance than the Saferide 60. It also has a better bracket, and a sensor switch. The Saferide has a somewhat wider beam and more straylight. It is also better visible from the side. I had bought the Saferide precisely because of the wider beam and the straylight that I needed on an off road tourer for my son. My experience with the Edelux 1 had been that the beam was too concentrated for rides in the forest (it is principally a road bike light). The Saferide 60 was also a lot cheaper (Philips are apparently getting out of the bike lights business again, so this light can now be had from Germany for 48 euro).
The new Cyo Premium and the Edelux II use the same new reflector with a much wider and even smoother beam that also throws more light in the near field (so the Cyo premium no longer comes in a special lower lux version with more near field light - and less light in the distance). Both the Cyo Premium and the Edelux II also have a slightly higher output than before, with the Edelux beating the Cyo by somethng like a 10 lux margin (that you are unlikely to notice). Most of the extra output from the new led has gone into the wider beam made possible by the new reflector. I think that unless you get a very special bargain price on either of the two older lights, it is much better to go for the new ones. The choice between the Cyo premium and the Edelux depends on budget, and the price you put on esthetics and durability. You could argue that if the Cyo will last five years, you can buy a more modern light at that time, and if the old one still works, move it to a town bike or whatever. There is no diference between them in beam pattern, and only very little in output.
The Luxos U is a quite different animal. It has a different mirror that produces a beam pattern that is really quite similar to the Cyo Premium and the Edelux II. The main difference is a much higher price, and various features like daylight running and particularly usb charging. Personally I do not care much for daylight running lights (my Edelux already switches on when I ride under some trees), but the usb charging is a different matter (and the reason Schmidt did not go this way too - they were too concerned about water ingress). I have concluded that I do not need usb charging for my kind of tours. I do not take a tablet or a laptop, and the Luxos output is apparently insuficient to charge those anyway. I switch my telephone off and only switch it on for a few minutes each day to contact my family. As for my gps, I bought a Garmin Etrex 30, because it was not only the cheapest and the lightest, but also the one with the lowest power consumption. I discovered that top quality rechargeable batteries allow me to ride along downloaded tracks (an important proviso because this consumes little power) for five full days on one set of Ansmann 2500 Eneloop type batteries (cheaper older ones did not last more than two days). Therefore, I think I do not need to charge them from my hub gnerator, and in future I will not even bring a battery charger, but only some spare batteries. With rapidly improving battery technology this will be increasingly feasible. I like to keep things as simple as possible. Admittedly, a world tour would change the equation.
IanW
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Re: Dynamo front light

Post by IanW »

pete75 wrote:
According to this website which has pretty comprehensive reviews and tests of dynamo lights the Saferide 60 is about as good as dynamo front lights get. He does say the mounting bracket lacked stiffness though is much improved on later versions.


I actually have 2 instances of the Philips Saferide 60 which represent both the older mounting bracket and newer mounting bracket.

Whilst I would agree that the newer bracket *is* improved compared to the older bracket,
I would *not* say that it is *much* improved.

In both instances there are lateral stampings / indentations across the mounting bolt area that still act as stress-risers.

The difference is the reduced severity of this stamping / depth of the indentations.

Older bracket showing stress-risers and flattening
Older bracket showing stress-risers and flattening


And in both instances the apparently round-section wire at the lamp base and fork-crown mounting bolt
is actually flattened where it is hidden by the white reflector. This has the effect of increasing the flex of this mounting bracket in precisely the wrong direction (i.e. it tends to increase the vibration of the lamp over rougher surfaces.

The difference is in the severity of the flattening and of the other indentations / crushing of the round-section to effect the bends.

In both cases the round cross-section of the wire that was used to make these brackets was 4.0mm
and it is thinner than 4.0mm at the indentations and flattened sections.

The Edelux bracket on the other hand is made from 5mm cross-section
that is flattened (but with no indentations) to 4mm at the fork-crown mounting point.

Philips Saferide Dynamo fitted with Edelux Bracket (1).JPG


And therefore suffers much less from vibration.
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Sweep
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Re: Dynamo front light

Post by Sweep »

willem jongman wrote:. With rapidly improving battery technology this will be increasingly feasible. I like to keep things as simple as possible. Admittedly, a world tour would change the equation.


Very good point about improving battery technology willem. And lights are getting more efficient as well - the latest Hope Vision 1 drains significantly less power for a given light output than mine.

So seems to me that unless one is daft enough to follow certain industry-self-interested trends like smaller batteries etc the issue will get easier and cheaper as time goes by.

note - am not criticising dynamo solutions, just saying that willem makes an excellent point.
Sweep
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