HELP! - Tandem inner tube keeps blowing!

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Vinko
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Joined: 27 Feb 2014, 7:11pm

HELP! - Tandem inner tube keeps blowing!

Postby Vinko » 2 Jul 2015, 9:05pm

Hello All,

I have a Dawes Horizon Tandem. Very much as per original spec from early 1990s.

Wheel rims are: ALESA 515x, ALLOY ETRTO 622x15, 700c . Made in Belgium.

When I got it, it had "Nokia" Rollspeed - LX" 32s on it, and all was well. These have now fallen apart and worn badly (I hadn't heard of them before, guess they are quite old? I brought this bike second hand, so dont know how old these are).

I replaced them with Schwalbe Marathon 32s...and....at about half an hours riding .....BANG....

Rear wheel just went bang! The tube had a big split in it, and I guessed that I had trapped it somehow in fitting. Carefully, very carefully, I put on another and now only three miles later....BANG ! Another huge split - in a different place. Replaced that but over night the front has now gone down :?

Before changing the tyres, I checked all over the rims/wheels. In fact they were "balanced" by a local wheel guy and he too checked them. All good, no visible problems. Also brand new inner tubes and the second tube on the rear was of a different make, so not a "faulty batch" of tubes.

I could just have made fitting mistakes (three times in succession?) - but I have changed a few tyres/inner tubes in my time! It could just be pure coincidence of some sort too I suppose. Or I HAVE done something wrong.

Is it that a tandem should have different (stronger) inner tubes and tyres?

Could it be that these rims are of an old style and spec and wont take modern tubes and tyres?

Is it that my wife (on the rear) is too heavy :lol: (she is actually quite small though and we didnt carry very much luggage either)

Any thoughts folks, because I am stumped.

Thank you.

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RickH
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Re: HELP! - Tandem inner tube keeps blowing!

Postby RickH » 2 Jul 2015, 9:15pm

If the rims are not the hooked edge type then Schwalbe don't recommend tyre pressures above 4 bar (~58psi).

(See my post from yesterday here with more info.)

Rick.

Brucey
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Joined: 4 Jan 2012, 6:25pm

Re: HELP! - Tandem inner tube keeps blowing!

Postby Brucey » 2 Jul 2015, 9:17pm

it could be

- a fitting problem
- a rim tape problem
- a tyre problem

On the latter point I've seen several schwalbe tyres fail in recent years apparently because the bead wires have not been moulded into the tyre properly. These tyres creak in the bead when handled. Some work just fine, but others (seemingly depending on fit, service load, and inflation pressure) creep off the rim or just fail in such a way as bead wires start poking out of the tyre sometimes.

BTW, best check, but I do not think that your tandem would have had anything other than a hook-bead rim fitted to it.

cheers
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NATURAL ANKLING
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Location: English Riviera

Re: HELP! - Tandem inner tube keeps blowing!

Postby NATURAL ANKLING » 2 Jul 2015, 10:21pm

Hi,
I had a similar problem recently :oops: Anyone can.

Next time the tyre is off, carefully run your hand around the rim on the very largest diameter (all around the rim sliding your hand through all 360 degrees of both edges) which would be the bit nearest the road like if you were riding with no tyres.

It only needs to be a very small nick with a raised edge that will slice the tube as you pass the tube (even if you put tube in tyre first, partially inflated) , the tube will have a scar and will inflate up to a point.

I think I went through three tubes in the kitchen one evening before I spotted it, look very hard and use your finger tips.

Worth a try.
NA Thinks Just End 2 End Return + Bivvy
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thirdcrank
Posts: 30083
Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 2:44pm

Re: HELP! - Tandem inner tube keeps blowing!

Postby thirdcrank » 3 Jul 2015, 5:22am

Vinko wrote: ... Rear wheel just went bang! ... .


If that happens, it can only be because part of the tube was outside the tyre. A one-off might be caused by careless fitting (most of us have done it once :oops: but hopefully learn from the mistake) but if it persists it sounds more like a poor rim/ tyre combination of which I have no experience. As there seems to be an interval between fitting the tyre and the bang, why not try an experiment: inflate the tyre slowly but really hard and watch what happens? At some point you must see the tube emerging, although the resulting bang will then be quick.

BTW, I think it's easier to get tyres properly seated if the bikes weight isn't on the tyres during the early stages of inflation: if you can't raise the bike on some sort of workstand, lie it down on the floor.

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Cunobelin
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Re: HELP! - Tandem inner tube keeps blowing!

Postby Cunobelin » 3 Jul 2015, 5:56am

Sounds obsessive, but it works

Align the tyres with the wheel by making sure that a particular letter is at the valve

This way you can always see the position of a puncture. When you locate, lay the tube over the wheel or trye with the valve aligned, and it will enable you to identify the problem area accurately

MGate
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Joined: 19 Sep 2013, 10:22pm

Re: HELP! - Tandem inner tube keeps blowing!

Postby MGate » 3 Jul 2015, 9:01am

It is not careless fitting, it is not a puncture, it is the Schwalbe Marathons not fitting properly. How do I know?

I have an early 90s Dawes Horizon...

...we put two new Schwalbe Marathons on it to replace the Nokia Rollspeeds (which had to be cut off they were so tight) and did a charity ride around Belgium. 10k in I looked down to watch the tyre separate from the rim allowing the high pressure in the tube to blow out and split the tube - BANG! Happened 3 times - both the front and rear in 100k - pretty demoralising and fairly dangerous...

Bike shop (and he was a good LBS and wheel builder) was non the wiser, measured the rims etc. Sent the Marathons back - they said no problems with them but did replace them and suggested rubbing off the silicon based 'mould release compound' - that sheen on new tyres that's slippery. Never trusted a Schwalbe tyre again (rightly or wrongly) so have a new pair hanging in the garage.

I'll look in the shed and see what I have fitted now as these are fine and I've had no issues.

I advise not to ride the machine at all with the current issue.

TonyR
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Re: HELP! - Tandem inner tube keeps blowing!

Postby TonyR » 3 Jul 2015, 9:35am

Another thing to check for on tandem tyres is the bead can separate from the sidewall. The tube then pushes out through the split and bang. Look for a long (sometimes hard to see when not inflated) split around where the rim edge meets the tyre. Had a particular problem a few years ago with Nokian tyres which continually failed in short order but was solved when I replaced them with a cheap pair of Cheng Shin tyres!

Vinko
Posts: 180
Joined: 27 Feb 2014, 7:11pm

Re: HELP! - Tandem inner tube keeps blowing!

Postby Vinko » 3 Jul 2015, 7:10pm

Thanks for all of this folks.

I have again checked everything over....nothing untoward at all on the rims....nothing, they are absolutely fine.

It is now almost certainly that the tyre is separating from the rim (and thus tube bursting through), in fact putting everything back together it did just that when I inflated it this afternoon!

Certainly appreciate your thoughts on tyre (not wife) alternatives...( MGate...that would be extreemly helpful if you have a working solution!).

Thank you to everyone who has contributed to this as it has driven me crazy!
Last edited by Vinko on 4 Jul 2015, 11:44am, edited 1 time in total.

Brucey
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Re: HELP! - Tandem inner tube keeps blowing!

Postby Brucey » 3 Jul 2015, 7:18pm

if this is because the schwalbe tyres you have are badly made (as previously described in other threads) I should not be at all surprised.

cheers
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pete75
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Re: HELP! - Tandem inner tube keeps blowing!

Postby pete75 » 10 Sep 2015, 2:13pm

The Marathon Dureme is Scwalbe's tandem specific tyre. Planet X currently have them on offer at £14.99

Bicycler
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Re: HELP! - Tandem inner tube keeps blowing!

Postby Bicycler » 10 Sep 2015, 2:21pm

pete75 wrote:The Marathon Dureme is Scwalbe's tandem specific tyre. Planet X currently have them on offer at £14.99

Just be careful because there are (or rather were, Duremes were discontinued a couple of years back) tandem and solo variants. The planet x ones are indeed advertised as being the tandem ones.

2wheels2legs
Posts: 1
Joined: 14 Sep 2015, 9:19am

Re: HELP! - Tandem inner tube keeps blowing!

Postby 2wheels2legs » 14 Sep 2015, 9:33am

This problem has been haunting me for quite some time now, I went through some 7 tubes in 3 months. The problem turned out to be the smallest of nicks inside the rim. Its an easy enough fix though. Its just locating the problem. :D

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NATURAL ANKLING
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Re: HELP! - Tandem inner tube keeps blowing!

Postby NATURAL ANKLING » 14 Sep 2015, 3:43pm

Hi,
2wheels2legs wrote:This problem has been haunting me for quite some time now, I went through some 7 tubes in 3 months. The problem turned out to be the smallest of nicks inside the rim. Its an easy enough fix though. Its just locating the problem. :D

Been riding nearly 50 years and it had me foxed :wink:
NA Thinks Just End 2 End Return + Bivvy
You'll Still Find Me At The Top Of A Hill
Please forgive the poor Grammar I blame it on my mobile and phat thinkers.

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bikes4two
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Re: HELP! - Tandem inner tube keeps blowing!

Postby bikes4two » 14 Sep 2015, 4:16pm

NATURAL ANKLING wrote:Hi,
I had a similar problem recently :oops: Anyone can.

Next time the tyre is off, carefully run your hand around the rim on the very largest diameter (all around the rim sliding your hand through all 360 degrees of both edges) which would be the bit nearest the road like if you were riding with no tyres.

It only needs to be a very small nick with a raised edge that will slice the tube as you pass the tube (even if you put tube in tyre first, partially inflated) , the tube will have a scar and will inflate up to a point.

I think I went through three tubes in the kitchen one evening before I spotted it, look very hard and use your finger tips.

Worth a try.


+1 for this notion. I once had 5 punctures in a morning (had to call Mrs B4t to get a lift home as no more patches/tubes left!!!) and I COULD NOT find the cause but was suspicious of a number of small nicks on the rim (poor tyre removal by me with metal tyre levers I suspect :oops: ). I took a fine file to the rim and no more problems :o
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