English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

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Mike Sales
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by Mike Sales »

Oldjohnw wrote:What is "off of" all about. "You need to lift the kettle off of the hob".


Or 'for free'?
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by Bmblbzzz »

Mike Sales wrote:Superfluous suffixes.
No longer do you park, but now you park up.
One is not told to listen, but to listen up.
Nothing is swapped, it is swapped out.

All give extra information. For instance, listen up conveys 'listen and pay attention to what I'm about to tell you.' You cannot, for example, 'listen up' to music or birdsong. Similarly, swap out says that one component is being replaced with an equivalent in a system. You can swap out a worn cassette for a new one, you cannot swap out a book you've read for one your mate.
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by Mike Sales »

Bmblbzzz wrote:
Mike Sales wrote:Superfluous suffixes.
No longer do you park, but now you park up.
One is not told to listen, but to listen up.
Nothing is swapped, it is swapped out.

All give extra information. For instance, listen up conveys 'listen and pay attention to what I'm about to tell you.' You cannot, for example, 'listen up' to music or birdsong. Similarly, swap out says that one component is being replaced with an equivalent in a system. You can swap out a worn cassette for a new one, you cannot swap out a book you've read for one your mate.


I do not think your examples prove your point.
It's the same the whole world over
It's the poor what gets the blame
It's the rich what gets the pleasure
Isn't it a blooming shame?
Bmblbzzz
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by Bmblbzzz »

"I swapped out the old cassette" means "I replaced the old cassette (with a new one)".
"I swapped the old cassette" could mean the same or could mean "I gave it to someone, who gave me (something else) in exchange".

Here are examples from Cambridge Dic:
Would you mind swapping those plates over?

Swap over clearly has the specific meaning of "swap positions".
While in this example:
I'll swap you my chocolate bar for your peanuts.

"For" means exchanging one item for a different item.

"Swap out" is just an additional specific sub-meaning of "swap". It just happens to have entered use more recently.
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kylecycler
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by kylecycler »

It does my head in to see swap spelled swop - it just looks wrong - but apparently it's an 'acceptable variant'. :(

https://english.stackexchange.com/quest ... nt-of-swap
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by Cyril Haearn »

Use 'exchange' instead :wink:
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by Bmblbzzz »

Swap would be my usual spelling, but I do reckon Multi-Coloured Swap Shop missed a trick there.

In other news, Swap and Mart? :wink:
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by Mick F »

The ones that always rile me, are the weather forecasters and their use of English.

One example ..............

We were told this morning, that, "Tomorrow will be cooler".
How can it be cooler if it wasn't cool to start with?
It's damed hot today, like it has been for most of May.

"Tomorrow won't be hot" ....or "Tomorrow will be less hot" ....... or "Tomorrow will be cool".

It cannot be cooler! :shock:
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Audax67
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by Audax67 »

People confusing the verb to lie with the verb to lay.

To lie: https://chambers.co.uk/search/?query=lie&title=21st

To lay: https://chambers.co.uk/search/?query=lay&title=21st
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by Mike Sales »

Cloth-eared misuse of "stranded."
The strand is the beach, and a ship is stranded when it has run up immovably onto the beach.

So when a ferry and its passengers are said to be "stranded in mid-Channel" it grates.

There was an inadvertent correct use about the pilot whales stranded on the Tasmanian coast, but a little spoilt when they were described as "stranded off Tasmania".
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Isn't it a blooming shame?
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Paulatic
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by Paulatic »

Doing my head in at the moment is
"So"
Being used to start sentences originally I thought it was southern young people giving themselves time to think before they delivered. Used like an err. Now it seems to be right through the country even politicians use it. I’ve also noticed it starting posts on here recently too.
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Jdsk
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by Jdsk »

What don't you like about starting sentences with "So"?

Chaucer used it. Shakespeare used it. And it has a particular precise use with backstories.

Jonathan
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by Jdsk »

Audax67 wrote:People confusing the verb to lie with the verb to lay.

To lie: https://chambers.co.uk/search/?query=lie&title=21st

To lay: https://chambers.co.uk/search/?query=lay&title=21st

In Standard English that is a confusion. In many regions it isn't. Usage differs.

Jonathan
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by Paulatic »

Jdsk wrote:What don't you like about starting sentences with "So"?

Chaucer used it. Shakespeare used it. And it has a particular precise use with backstories.

Jonathan

Chaucer and Shakespeare wrote I’ve never heard them speak. They might well have used it correctly? Listen to young people and it’s "So < pause> then a sentence.
A serial offender IMO is Rishi Sunak.
004EC631-2E35-457B-8F6E-3293D9A51AEA.jpeg

Shouldn’t that second sentence start with "To"? What does "so" add to it?

D690AB5B-892E-4DBD-A36A-38FD21F2E1C7.jpeg

I would have written ...viable jobs <Full stop> Employees ... no need for "so"
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Jdsk
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Re: English Language - what "Does your head in" ??

Post by Jdsk »

Those are both ugly.

Generally agree with you: if in doubt close the sentence and start the next. Have you ever read anything by Denning? He was the greatest exponent of the short sentence.

Paulatic wrote:Chaucer and Shakespeare wrote I’ve never heard them speak.

So you're happy with its use in writing but not in speaking?

Jonathan
Last edited by Jdsk on 25 Sep 2020, 6:13pm, edited 1 time in total.
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