Help me! Complete novice who needs to travel with toddler.

landsurfer
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Re: Help me! Complete novice who needs to travel with toddler.

Postby landsurfer » 8 Jul 2019, 8:09pm

Pashley Trike with kiddie seats fitted .... we took our 2 to primary school for years on one ...
The Road Goes On Forever ...

Vorpal
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Re: Help me! Complete novice who needs to travel with toddler.

Postby Vorpal » 9 Jul 2019, 8:35am

skyhawk wrote:
Vorpal wrote:
edited to add: The risks of cycling are similar to those of walking, and the risks of driving are much higher, if you include the difference due to benefits that result from active travel. In other words, the benefits of active travel far outweigh the risk. As a parent of two kids and someone whose profession is safety & risk, my kids have been on bike since they were very small.


Just being over cautious as being a single father of three

The point is that if you take your kids around in a car, you are actually choosing the higher risk over the lesser. Because of the pollution they breathe, the lack of exercise, and the damage to environment, they will have to pay the price for that when they are older.

Cyclists, on average, live longer.

I understand that it seems like the risk is lower. That is because of vulnerability, and because the risks are immediate. It is difficult for our brains to weigh long term risks against immediate risks.
“In some ways, it is easier to be a dissident, for then one is without responsibility.”
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pjclinch
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Re: Help me! Complete novice who needs to travel with toddler.

Postby pjclinch » 9 Jul 2019, 11:23am

skyhawk wrote:As a single father of three sons(all their lives) just my word of caution, as a driver like most of us are, i would personally never have a youngster on a bike on the main road especially one of those LOW follow me things, just think how invisible to morons recumbent bikes are.


I ride a recumbent for touring. If you think they're invisible I suspect you haven't. The experience I have is I get noticed, and I get more space than when I'm on an upwrong.

skyhawk wrote:I just would never want my son to be 2' off the ground next to a 40t lorry


If they were on a "normal" bike they wouldn't be clearly safer, and even if they were in a car, if a 40 tonne truck tries to occupy the same bit of road at the same time I don't think the airbags would help much.

skyhawk wrote:Just being over cautious as being a single father of three


You're being understandably anxious as a father, numbers are not relevant. However, that natural and understandable anxiety isn't standing you or your children in good stead, as Vorpal states.

I would suggest a look at Time Gill's Cycling and Children and Young People for a good discussion of the realities of risk and cycling for children.

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Often seen riding a bike around Dundee...

skyhawk
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Re: Help me! Complete novice who needs to travel with toddler.

Postby skyhawk » 9 Jul 2019, 1:11pm

Vorpal wrote:
skyhawk wrote:
Vorpal wrote:
edited to add: The risks of cycling are similar to those of walking, and the risks of driving are much higher, if you include the difference due to benefits that result from active travel. In other words, the benefits of active travel far outweigh the risk. A


Are you being serious ??????????????????


Have you measured the "height" of a child on a follow bike and a cars exhaust

Hmmmmm unhealthy in a car until they get to the school where they have sports as opposed to risk of car hitting small bike, I can live with that as single father of three
Both I and my son are Autistic. We have aspergers and ADHD, not stupid :). If I sound "blunt" in my posts, please be understanding : I am not perfect. Thank you. Visit https://www.asdinfowales.co.uk/ to learn more

skyhawk
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Re: Help me! Complete novice who needs to travel with toddler.

Postby skyhawk » 9 Jul 2019, 1:14pm

Well my Scenic was hit by a 40 tonner on a roundabout with my three sons in the back, a few shouts and that was it, so I am happy
Both I and my son are Autistic. We have aspergers and ADHD, not stupid :). If I sound "blunt" in my posts, please be understanding : I am not perfect. Thank you. Visit https://www.asdinfowales.co.uk/ to learn more

skyhawk
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Re: Help me! Complete novice who needs to travel with toddler.

Postby skyhawk » 9 Jul 2019, 1:16pm

"I ride a recumbent for touring. If you think they're invisible I suspect you haven't. The experience I have is I get noticed, and I get more space than when I'm on an upwrong."

I have, and have many disabled friends who do, and have unfortunately see a rider HIT where I lived, trendle Lane Bere Alston, Devon, a narrow country lane just a car wide, no thanks
Both I and my son are Autistic. We have aspergers and ADHD, not stupid :). If I sound "blunt" in my posts, please be understanding : I am not perfect. Thank you. Visit https://www.asdinfowales.co.uk/ to learn more

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pjclinch
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Re: Help me! Complete novice who needs to travel with toddler.

Postby pjclinch » 9 Jul 2019, 2:22pm

skyhawk wrote:"I ride a recumbent for touring. If you think they're invisible I suspect you haven't. The experience I have is I get noticed, and I get more space than when I'm on an upwrong."

I have, and have many disabled friends who do, and have unfortunately see a rider HIT where I lived, trendle Lane Bere Alston, Devon, a narrow country lane just a car wide, no thanks


I'm afraid the reality here is you have a very poor understanding of risk and the nature of anecdotal data, and also of the long term benefits of regular cycling. Please read the Gill report I highlighted.
Often seen riding a bike around Dundee...

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Re: Help me! Complete novice who needs to travel with toddler.

Postby Vorpal » 10 Jul 2019, 11:00pm

skyhawk wrote:
Vorpal wrote:
skyhawk wrote:


Are you being serious ??????????????????


Have you measured the "height" of a child on a follow bike and a cars exhaust

Hmmmmm unhealthy in a car until they get to the school where they have sports as opposed to risk of car hitting small bike, I can live with that as single father of three


Research commissioned by Global Action Plan (GAP) and the UK Health Alliance on Climate Change said passengers in cars breathe in nine times as much pollution than those completing the same journey on a bike or by foot.

Meanwhile, parents are being warned that driving their children to school is exposing them to significantly more harmful levels of pollution than if they were to cycle or walk.


https://www.bewiser.co.uk/news/car-insu ... en-breathe

Other studies have obtained somewhat different results. Those comparing by distance (4 km walked, driven, or cycled) in city traffic find cyclists are the least exposed because it's the fastest mode, whilst pedestrians are the most exposed.
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belgiangoth
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Re: Help me! Complete novice who needs to travel with toddler.

Postby belgiangoth » 12 Jul 2019, 2:12pm

Tangled Metal wrote:Do you know, that fear of a trailer being visible was something my parents lectured us about when we used ours.

Truth is vehicles see it better because it's different. They work out very quickly that there's probably a young child in there. That kind of wakes then up to the danger they present. The result is some of the biggest gaps between us and the car overtaking I've ever seen. Even skip lorries gave us a wide berth.

^This.

I use the trailer with 4yo twinse and get lots of space from cars. Conversely when I cycle with a child seat I get no special behaviour from cars. Trailers are 100% better than a kid on the back, easier to ride, less chance for them to fall over sideways, no kicking them in the head as you swing your leg over the crossbar (and you'll need a crossbar to hold them up with your legs).

The other option is child in seat at back, walk to school (using bike as a pushchair) and then cycle from there.
If I had a baby elephant I would let it sleep in the garage in place of the car. If I had either a garage or a car. (I miss sigs about baby elephants)

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Re: Help me! Complete novice who needs to travel with toddler.

Postby Elizabethsdad » 20 Jul 2019, 7:48am

I am a big fan of the long john style of cargo bike - I currently have two although I am trying sell one at the moment - a Bakfiets which is designed exactly for the sort of journeys you are talking about. Other similar makes would be Baboe, Gazelle Cabby and Urban Arrow. That last one is a dedicated electric assist bike so a bit more expensive but good if you have any hills or longer distances to travel. I have taken my bikes to events where people have had a go on them and not everyone has got on with them, so definitely try before you buy. Probably their main disadvantage is their size making secure storage at home an issue if you have a flat or small house without a garage.
An alternative that might suit you would be the Big Billy from Rodford bikes:-
https://www.rodfordbuilt.co.uk/
If you are very unsure about cycling you might prefer a box trike, three wheel stability and large carrying capacity but again harder to store securely at home and they do not take corners so well. I see someone else has mentioned Circe Morpheus and I have quite a number of posts in various forums from people who like the Circe Helios tandem.
The main problem with getting a cargo bike in the UK is their are only a handful of dealers - I was fortunate to have one fairly local to us where I could go to try some out. London and Cambridge are the two hot spots, otherwise there's Practical cycles in the north west, Really Useful Bikes in Bristol, Kids and Family Cycles near Bournemouth and possibly Kinetics in Scotland.
Be interested to see what you end up going with.

Caledonia64
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Re: Help me! Complete novice who needs to travel with toddler.

Postby Caledonia64 » 12 Sep 2019, 5:09pm

Late to the party I know: I found the seats be they rear or cross bar very difficult to manage and not very stable.

We had a number of child trailers (second hand the first two, very second hand both that eventually fell apart admittedly in one instance when I tried off roading with it), however the third (a Ridgeback? Avenir?) outlasted the child's ability to fit in it/towing weight (till he was 5/6 but the size of a 7/8 year old). Not one of the expensive Burleigh/Croozer. There is a Belgian site with a huge range of trailers: fiestkarren https://www.kidscab.be/en/117-kids-tour ... ke-trailer < I was looking for dog trailers.


A trailer will not tip ordinarily (even if you spill/fall) and the hitch is simple. It is a more stable way to carry a load than a bike seat (and the child wiggling is less impactful than on a seat on the rear rack, which also makes it hard to carry anything in panniers, or even a backpack); the centre of gravity is lower plus you can put all the child-paraphanelia in the luggage area of the trailer (or 20 L of soya milk though you may as I did struggle to tow that weight home with the child as well, but also shopping, is the poiint).
You can have the panniers on the rear rack to take with.

I have to say in all but one incident (where there should have been no motorised vehicle at all and it was a 17 year old bouliie basher to boot, and it was me that came off braking suddenly, so that was ok), and my toppling off the bike as I had not anticipated a new bollard/chicane gate on a usual cycle path (trailer stayed upright; I think I complained and the gate was removed). I had no incidents with a child trailer felt perfectly safe wiith my child in tow. Cars gave wide berth and Police did not sanction the use of (3m) wide pavements or wheeling it over a crossing at tricky roundabout, which I only did sometimes/if it was dark. The trailer had as many lights as the bike, and the flag too had LEDs.

There were the annoyances of the trysting gates on the cycle path (a Natiional Route I think) on LochLOmondside/Dumbarton Castle and again en route from Stirling to the Falkirk Wheel, plus the trailer getting bogged down in the mud generated by a field full of cows again on a National Cycle Route that ran through the middle of the field near Loch Lomond: my son still remembers the cows kinda surrounding us (there was a trysting gate there to boot). But these are not your average cycle trailer use and not perilous.

Our Nursery let us park the trailer at the front (there were steps up so I was not taking it up to leave with the -sometimes folded - pushcairs, plus it was not nearly as foldable as they were), locked to the gate with a cable/Ulock left there permanently (and for which the nursery had a spare key). At home (also steps up to my front door, and no side entrances to garden: straight through the front door), I left the trailer similarly at the front gate with similar semi-permanent locks (to avoid transporting them everywhere - just a light one for use out and about when the trailer was attached to the bike anyway). I latterly left the bike at the front of the house too, as I eventually had another in the hall in the house, and two in the shed (through the hall/kitchen). It kinda did for the bike even with a cover as it was a coastal-ish location too (plus it it had another two years of being outside recently near the harbouR), having said which the bike does still function 16 years on even if with a nasty sound from the bottom brackets and a random surprise number of working gears, usually about 8, rather than the supposed 21. I had a cover for the trailers too. They survived well enough too.

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Re: Help me! Complete novice who needs to travel with toddler.

Postby Caledonia64 » 12 Sep 2019, 5:25pm

skyhawk wrote:
rsian wrote:Hi. I’ve been reading all sorts, but now require some help!

I’m going to have to start transporting my daughter on a bike from September, she will be three. I don’t think she will do the walk from the nursery we hope she will get in (about 1.5 miles either way), and I don’t drive. The journey is along main roads. I’ll be commuting a little bit further, but not much and I’ll need to take some stuff with me too. When I have her it’ll be impossible for me to take all the stuff I need, but on the days I don’t I’ll have a laptop, ringbinder, marking and more. I take a suitcase currently to cart it all around.

I’ve also been on a bike about once in the past five years, so I want to get things sorted and used to cycling over summer.

I had thought about a cargo bike, but there’s no cycle paths and my husband doesn’t think that’s a great idea. I’ve alway liked the style of the Pendleton Somerby (for all the cycling I do :lol: ), but I’m not convinced that’s the best choice.

So, basically I’m clueless. I need suggestions on a bike for me and a child seat for a three year old. Any help would be amazing!



As a single father of three sons(all their lives) just my word of caution, as a driver like most of us are, i would personally never have a youngster on a bike on the main road especially one of those LOW follow me things, just think how invisible to morons recumbent bikes are.

You may be the most amazing caring cyclist, but it only takes a moment for a life of regret, and you say you are a novice, enough to concentrate on and learn without a precious life on the back, sorry.


Curious if by one of these low things you mean a tag-along trailer bike, or a child trailer pod attached to the bike?
It is usually possible to avoid main roads even if you take a longer route or, if the pavements are at all wide/little used, I have never found the Police or even pedestrians object to a slowly riding cyclist with a child trailer on the pavement, esp. at rush hour/dark nights.
My only issue (bar one not that close motorist incident in a throughway where no motorist should have been) was chicane gates and trysting gates, and on National Cycle Routes or Local Authority Cycle Ways.

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Re: Help me! Complete novice who needs to travel with toddler.

Postby jh27 » 30 Sep 2019, 11:54am

Tangled Metal wrote:A decent hybrid bike with rack and pannier(s) plus a good child seat like hamax siesta that can tilt back.


I used a Hamax Siesta, an my daughter did like it (and often fell asleep). But rear child seats aren't for the uninitiated, IMHO. Before spending money on it, I would suggest you have a go at lifting you child into it and out of it - bearing in mind that the child will often be asleep when you lift him/her out. The following might be helpful (and probably obvious, so apologies...):
1. Step through frame - I never had one, and getting my leg over the top tube was almost as difficult as remember not to swing my leg over the seat :O
2. Double kick stand - I went through two, as the Halfords one I bought wasn't great and one of the legs fell off (thankfully not whilst it was in use).
3. Lower your seat so you can stop with your feet down at short notice - you'll lose a lot of pedalling efficiency, but it might be worth the compromise, at least to begin with.

If I were to do it again, I might look at the child seats where the child is positioned in front or I might look at a trailer. If I had the money (that is, could convince my wife to let me spend it), I would probably go for a cargo bike/trike.

I guess it is too late as you will have made your decision, but if you do get a child seat on the rear and you don't have cycle paths, then bear in mind that most motorists will give you a wide berth on the road - if you ride on the pavement they probably won't even notice you and if you fall on the pavement, there's a good chance you will end up in the road (especially if it is a narrow pavement). If you ride on the road - make sure you take a commanding position towards the middle of the lane (or in the middle of the lane) - this forces motorists to pass you only when oncoming lane is free and not to squeeze past. The child on the back can cause you to swerve unexpected when the child moves - it doesn't do any force a little wobble when you hear a car behind you.

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Re: Help me! Complete novice who needs to travel with toddler.

Postby jh27 » 30 Sep 2019, 11:56am

Tangled Metal wrote:A decent hybrid bike with rack and pannier(s) plus a good child seat like hamax siesta that can tilt back.


Panniers and a child seat? I had a Hamax Siesta and was never able to fit a pannier at the same time.

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Re: Help me! Complete novice who needs to travel with toddler.

Postby Vorpal » 30 Sep 2019, 12:13pm

jh27 wrote:
Tangled Metal wrote:A decent hybrid bike with rack and pannier(s) plus a good child seat like hamax siesta that can tilt back.


Panniers and a child seat? I had a Hamax Siesta and was never able to fit a pannier at the same time.

It depends upon the positioning of both. On my hybrid, I could use both child seat & panniers, but the foot rests came down over the panniers, so I could not have anything in the top, nor fill them very full. I could use them enough for waterproofs, nappies, snacks, and a few smaller items, shopping.
“In some ways, it is easier to be a dissident, for then one is without responsibility.”
― Nelson Mandela, Long Walk to Freedom