Membership rates

Summer 2020 - Cycle Magazine announcement about membership changes
Rod Goodfellow
Posts: 37
Joined: 22 Aug 2017, 12:02pm

Membership rates

Postby Rod Goodfellow » 30 Jul 2020, 12:10pm

I am over 80,joined the CTC in 1953 and now only ride about 1/3 as much as in my heyday.Apart from CUK insurance I have no interest in CUK activities or politics.I find the magazine uninteresting, overladen with advertising both inside and with added flyers to such an extent that the whole lot usually goes to garbage unread.Should the proposed removal of seniors discount be removed I shall seek alternative 3rd party insurance and terminate my membership.Insurance suggestions welcome.

thirdcrank
Posts: 29142
Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 2:44pm

Re: Membership rates

Postby thirdcrank » 30 Jul 2020, 12:48pm

AFAIK, quite a lot of the older end members invested in life membership and again AFAIK, they weren't offered a pro rata refund when the former club adopted charity status.

Cyril Haearn
Posts: 13890
Joined: 30 Nov 2013, 11:26am
Location: Leafy suburbia

Re: Membership rates

Postby Cyril Haearn » 30 Jul 2020, 2:30pm

What, they paid for life membership and were chucked out when the organisation changed?

My YHA life membership is still valid
Entertainer, intellectual, idealist, PoB, 30120
Cycling-of course, but it is far better on a Gillott
We love safety cameras, we dislike mortons

AndyK
Posts: 899
Joined: 17 Aug 2007, 2:08pm

Re: Membership rates

Postby AndyK » 30 Jul 2020, 4:32pm

Cyril Haearn wrote:What, they paid for life membership and were chucked out when the organisation changed?

No, their life membership remained valid. I'm not sure what thirdcrank means.

thirdcrank
Posts: 29142
Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 2:44pm

Re: Membership rates

Postby thirdcrank » 30 Jul 2020, 5:01pm

AndyK wrote:
Cyril Haearn wrote:What, they paid for life membership and were chucked out when the organisation changed?

No, their life membership remained valid. I'm not sure what thirdcrank means.


Unless I'm losing it, this thread was originally longer with a comment suggesting that older members shouldn't enjoy an age-related discount. My point was that life members joined a club and became members of a charity without the alternative of leaving. In fact, what is now the OP was itself a response to the post about the discount. Thinking about it, the whole thread now seems adrift.

AndyK
Posts: 899
Joined: 17 Aug 2007, 2:08pm

Re: Membership rates

Postby AndyK » 30 Jul 2020, 5:54pm

thirdcrank wrote:
AndyK wrote:
Cyril Haearn wrote:What, they paid for life membership and were chucked out when the organisation changed?

No, their life membership remained valid. I'm not sure what thirdcrank means.


Unless I'm losing it, this thread was originally longer with a comment suggesting that older members shouldn't enjoy an age-related discount. My point was that life members joined a club and became members of a charity without the alternative of leaving. In fact, what is now the OP was itself a response to the post about the discount. Thinking about it, the whole thread now seems adrift.

OK, I didn't see the original version then.

The charity is not a different organisation. It's the same organisation as it was but now with charitable status. Life members are still members of "Cyclists' Touring Club", a limited company incorporated in 1887. I'm not aware of any life member asking for their membership to be cancelled when the charity transition happened, but then I wasn't a trustee back then so I wouldn't know.

I do know that the terms and conditions of membership say that there are no refunds on life membership. I assume that's always been the case.

Anyway, If you were to offer a partial refund to a life member who wanted to quit, how on earth would you go about calculating the amount of money they were due back?

User avatar
Graham
Moderator
Posts: 6323
Joined: 14 Dec 2006, 8:48pm

Re: Membership rates

Postby Graham » 30 Jul 2020, 5:54pm

Sorry if I have naffed up the flow. TC.
I split this out of the general membership topic because of the following - which seemed to be the critical decision point.

Rod Goodfellow wrote: . . . .Should the proposed removal of seniors discount be removed I shall seek alternative 3rd party insurance and terminate my membership.Insurance suggestions welcome.

Oldjohnw
Posts: 4701
Joined: 16 Oct 2018, 4:23am
Location: Northumberland

Re: Membership rates

Postby Oldjohnw » 30 Jul 2020, 5:58pm

Should anyone need this, Wiggle have quite a good public liability insurance.
John

thirdcrank
Posts: 29142
Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 2:44pm

Re: Membership rates

Postby thirdcrank » 30 Jul 2020, 6:54pm

I wouldn't want to come across as a member of the charity conversion re-enactment society - I moved on long ago.

AFAIK, life membership rates were calculated on a quasi-actuarial formula which could presumably have been used to calculate rebates.

Graham

I was only explaining, not complaining. There's a bit of a history of new boards being created on a diktat and needing stuff moved in to prevent leaving them pretty much empty.

(As I type this, this thread is all there is.)
===================================================================
PS As far as I am concerned, this correspondence is now closed.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Georgina Cox
Posts: 3
Joined: 29 Jul 2020, 6:47pm

Re: Membership rates

Postby Georgina Cox » 31 Jul 2020, 4:23pm

Rod Goodfellow wrote:I am over 80,joined the CTC in 1953 and now only ride about 1/3 as much as in my heyday.Apart from CUK insurance I have no interest in CUK activities or politics.I find the magazine uninteresting, overladen with advertising both inside and with added flyers to such an extent that the whole lot usually goes to garbage unread.Should the proposed removal of seniors discount be removed I shall seek alternative 3rd party insurance and terminate my membership.Insurance suggestions welcome.



Hi Rod

Thank you for nearly 70 years of membership! It's a real shame that you feel this way and we obviously respect your decision.

Just some points on Cycle – we know from our 2019 survey and previous member research that the vast majority of members highly value the magazine. And paid adverts and inserts play a vital role in allowing us to produce and deliver the magazine six times a year. In terms of not finding the content of interest to you, one of the changes we would like to introduce is to offer more tailored communications to members so that information, news and advice is more aligned to particular preferences.

Georgina Cox, head of membership, Cycling UK

millimole
Posts: 596
Joined: 18 Feb 2007, 5:41pm
Location: Leicester

Re: Membership rates

Postby millimole » 31 Jul 2020, 6:56pm

I suspect that the 'value' of Cycle magazine may vary with demographic including length of membership.
It is a very pale shadow of its former self, and certainly does seem to be driven by advertising rather than content.
I rarely find anything in Cycle that deserves my undivided attention.
(For completeness I'll declare I'm a Life Member whose first interaction with CTC was in 1971)
Leicester; Riding my Hetchins since 1971; Audaxing on my Dawes; Riding to work on a Decathlon Hoprider

User avatar
gaz
Posts: 14014
Joined: 9 Mar 2007, 12:09pm
Location: Kent, lorry park of England

Re: Membership rates

Postby gaz » 31 Jul 2020, 11:36pm

The change in life membership rates certainly makes that option look much less appealing from 1 October 2020, and whilst that's more likely a case of an individual's capital resources than their income the two are often aligned. Makes it even more of a niche market. :|

It's something I consider from time to time, best get a move on if I'm going to go for it.

Edit: Making no allowance for inflation and assuming 50% of a household membership rate then for me it's currently 10 and a bit years to financial break even which would become just under 19 years. Oh well, about eight weeks left to make my mind up.
Last edited by gaz on 1 Aug 2020, 10:06pm, edited 1 time in total.
2020 : To redundancy ... and beyond!

belgiangoth
Posts: 1397
Joined: 29 Mar 2007, 4:10pm

Re: Membership rates

Postby belgiangoth » 1 Aug 2020, 2:40am

I'd be very wary of removing the senior rate of membership, this is both the core and the history of the CTC - if they go then we will just be another charity/quango.

I agree the magazine was better 10 years ago, but then all magazines were and the internet was less good. What should go in the magazine? Reviews are pointless, someone's ride report? A suggested ride 5 hours' drive away from where you live? Yet another basic discussion on tyre size? That said once a year I'm really impressed with the mag.
If I had a baby elephant, it would point out that there is no evidence for planing. Then it would eat all my bananas.

millimole
Posts: 596
Joined: 18 Feb 2007, 5:41pm
Location: Leicester

Re: Membership rates

Postby millimole » 1 Aug 2020, 7:23am

belgiangoth wrote:I'd be very wary of removing the senior rate of membership, this is both the core and the history of the CTC - if they go then we will just be another charity/quango. .


I agree but, but the organisation /is/ just another charity /quango!

The purpose of CTC/CUK is to gain grants to to the work of government. By taking the coin the organisation can pay its staff to gain more grants. (Yes, this becomes a self-serving circle).
You can argue that by having more staff allows more effort to be put into getting more bums on saddles (through motivating volunteers).

To believe that the purpose is to be a member organisation, for the benefit of members, is to hark back to the pre-charity days, and that boat has sailed.

The only reason any charity wants the older demographic as supporters is to hope for legacies left in wills.
Remember that charities are managed by young professionals, who do not see any value in those with less disposable income, and a wealth of experience that might contradict the professional world view.
Leicester; Riding my Hetchins since 1971; Audaxing on my Dawes; Riding to work on a Decathlon Hoprider

Oldjohnw
Posts: 4701
Joined: 16 Oct 2018, 4:23am
Location: Northumberland

Re: Membership rates

Postby Oldjohnw » 1 Aug 2020, 8:21am

CUK is absolutely not a Quango, whatever else it may be. Accuracy matters when discussing things like this.
John