Parking on Cyclepaths

Ron
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Re: Parking on Cyclepaths

Post by Ron »

The Scottish government is running a consultation on motor vehicle parking issues at present.
https://consult.scotland.gov.uk/road-po ... -scotland/
Pete Owens
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Re: Parking on Cyclepaths

Post by Pete Owens »

Si wrote:
meic wrote:I can understand that the cricket parking on the cyclepath is annoying and, if as it appears, illegal and something should be done about it.
As an aside that bit of cyclepath is very short and goes nowhere, the road itself is a 20 limit, I imagine that I would personally welcome the fact that I could stick on the road without anybody being able to suggest that I should be on the cycle track. Quite possibly there is something not obvious from streetview which makes that bit of road not as benign as it appears.


that section does serve a function that probably isnt obvious when viewed on street view. Coming out of town there is a very busy multilane road between this quiet road and the popular cycle path in cannon hill park. This little bit of soft segragated path allows you to easily cross to the toucan that gets you into the park without having to negociate the busy multilane road.

So just the sort of c***y Sustrans pavement conversion that nobody admits they are campaigning for until they get very angry at a motorist for parking on what was obviously designed as a parking bay in the first place.

The desire line for cyclists is straight across Edgbaston Road from the end of Cannon Hill Road. So if you want to facilitate the crossing the put traffic lights at the junction. And even if you want to access the unconverted pavement (other than a blue sign) to reach the unconverted pedestrian crossing (other than a cycle light) then it is just as easy to do so at the far end of the converted parking bay as it is at the near end - thus avoiding the need to ride on the substandard 2-way cycle lane.
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Si
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Re: Parking on Cyclepaths

Post by Si »

That would require three light phases, biased towards the major road, which would mean waiting longer. The current solution, although certainly not perfect actually works in the real world and I've never heard anyone complain about it.

I'm sure that we could all design something much better, but being able to design such a thing and being able to get it implemented are two different kettles of fish. And just repeating "it should be like this" won't get anything done.
rmurphy195
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Re: Parking on Cyclepaths

Post by rmurphy195 »

Got back from hol today and found this reply in my emails:-

Thank you for taking time to report this to us. Unfortunately, most of the cycle lanes in Birmingham (including this one) has no Traffic Regulation Order that will support its enforcement. I believe Highways department put them as a courtesy hoping it will deter drivers from parking for the cyclists to benefit from.

You can discuss this further with the district engineers for the area on 0121 303 1111 and see if they can make it enforceable.

Yours sincerely

Parking Team



Words fail me!

NA10ZKR - http://i818.photobucket.com/albums/zz10 ... A10ZKR.jpg

HA10DDR - http://i818.photobucket.com/albums/zz10 ... A10DRR.jpg

KP16OXG - http://i818.photobucket.com/albums/zz10 ... P16OXG.jpg

LR64LJL - http://i818.photobucket.com/albums/zz10 ... R64LJL.jpg

LT56HWC - http://i818.photobucket.com/albums/zz10 ... T56HWC.jpg

BT17AEJ - http://i818.photobucket.com/albums/zz10 ... T17AEJ.jpg

G44MES - http://i818.photobucket.com/albums/zz10 ... G44MES.jpg

(Edit 18/06/17 - links corrected (Hopefully))
Last edited by rmurphy195 on 18 Jun 2017, 10:43pm, edited 1 time in total.
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irc
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Re: Parking on Cyclepaths

Post by irc »

rmurphy195 wrote:Got back from hol today and found this reply in my emails:-

Thank you for taking time to report this to us. Unfortunately, most of the cycle lanes in Birmingham (including this one) has no Traffic Regulation Order that will support its enforcement. I believe Highways department put them as a courtesy hoping it will deter drivers from parking for the cyclists to benefit from.

You can discuss this further with the district engineers for the area on 0121 303 1111 and see if they can make it enforceable.

Yours sincerely

Parking Team



Words fail me!
NA10ZKR - http://i818.photobucket.com/albums/zz10 ... A10ZKR.jpg

HA10DDR - http://i818.photobucket.com/albums/zz10 ... A10DRR.jpg

KP16OXG - http://i818.photobucket.com/albums/zz10 ... P16OXG.jpg

LR64LJL - http://i818.photobucket.com/albums/zz10 ... R64LJL.jpg

LT56HWC - http://i818.photobucket.com/albums/zz10 ... T56HWC.jpg

BT17AEJ - http://i818.photobucket.com/albums/zz10 ... T17AEJ.jpg

G44MES - http://i818.photobucket.com/albums/zz10 ... G44MES.jpg


Tried 3 of the links - error messages.
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squeaker
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Re: Parking on Cyclepaths

Post by squeaker »

Guide Dogs are currently getting a petition together - sign and share! (Yes, I know their not exactly shared use friendly - but think of the greater good ;) )
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Re: Parking on Cyclepaths

Post by Annoying Twit »

Signed. Shared.
Pete Owens
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Re: Parking on Cyclepaths

Post by Pete Owens »

rmurphy195 wrote:Got back from hol today and found this reply in my emails:-

Thank you for taking time to report this to us. Unfortunately, most of the cycle lanes in Birmingham (including this one) has no Traffic Regulation Order that will support its enforcement. I believe Highways department put them as a courtesy hoping it will deter drivers from parking for the cyclists to benefit from.

You can discuss this further with the district engineers for the area on 0121 303 1111 and see if they can make it enforceable.

Yours sincerely

Parking Team



Words fail me!

Presumably that means they are still footways - on which it is illegal to cycle. I would imagine guide dogs are every bit as keen to enforce that as they are to clear cars from the pavements.
thirdcrank
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Re: Parking on Cyclepaths

Post by thirdcrank »

I wonder if murphy195 correspondent is mistaken, in that I'm not convinced that cycle tracks are created by traffic regulation orders. When I saw his post, I assumed that somebody else with the facts to hand (gaz?) might post, then I forgot about it. If nobody does deal with that I'll look it up when I have a bit of time.

It's worth remembering that mandatory cycle lanes previously needed a TRO but IIRC, that requirement was ditched in TSRGD 2015.

=============================================================================

Here's one of the posts that led me to assume gaz knew.

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=104492&p=995547&hilit=track#p995547
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gaz
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Re: Parking on Cyclepaths

Post by gaz »

To the best of my knowledge cycletracks are not created by a Traffic Regulation Order, I used the term "order" very loosely earlier in the thread and my apologies for any confusion this may have caused.

AIUI council parking enforcement powers are limited to circumstances that are covered by a TRO, e.g. DYLs. No TRO, no council enforcement.
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thirdcrank
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Re: Parking on Cyclepaths

Post by thirdcrank »

Yes. I'm pretty sure that the people charged with administering things like this at street level will only be trained in their own bit of the law. In the early days of traffic warden schemes which were a within the police, their supervisors would often have been older-end or recently-retired police supervisors with a more general knowledge, but not any more. All rmurphy195's correspondent is really saying is "Nothing to do with the highway authority. We have no power to deal with this." Their additional comment just confused things.

As far as the police are concerned, most parking offences have been decriminalised, and few will know or care which haven't.
sirmy
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Re: Parking on Cyclepaths

Post by sirmy »

It would be worth contacting the council again and asking what powers they exercised in widening the existing path. They don't have the right to extend a path with out reference to the law. From the look of the path it was created by increasing the width of an existing path. Section 65 and 66 of the 1980 highway act gives powers to alter levels of part of the highway, needed for the installation of the kerb line of the cycle path other sections can be used to exclude vehicles from parts of the highway (this may be under a different act, possibly RTA). These powers can be exercised by council officer under delegated powers and would not generate a tro. If a delegated decision has been made then the path is a cycle track (cycletrack orders are only needed for conversion of footpaths, without going into the difference between footway and path). Section 34 of the road traffic act makes it an offence to park on a cycle track. If there is no delegated decision demand to know why as the council has ac ted illegally by placing a structure in the highway

Try asking the council for a copy of the decision for the construction of the extension to the path, use a foi request if they try to fob you off, although any request for such a document should be regarded as an foi request.

Have look at LTN 2/04 and cycling England's Cycle Schemes and Legal Procedures report
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Si
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Re: Parking on Cyclepaths

Post by Si »

Just don't contact the Cycling Officer...he was made redundant last week ;-)


Although to be fair, it was voluntary....and there are still a lot of people working on BCR. If I remember I shall ask about parking enforcement when in the office tomorrow.
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mjr
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Re: Parking on Cyclepaths

Post by mjr »

I agree with the above comments: TSRGD 2016 simplified things and the only time a TRO is needed now is when they put double-yellow lines in an advisory cycle lane. I'd complain both formally and to the local councillor about the council officer giving you incorrect information, as well as the council failing to collect probably-substantial parking fine money to which it is entitled and not dealing with this anti-social motoring. Please keep pushing - if we don't then nothing will change.
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rmurphy195
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Re: Parking on Cyclepaths

Post by rmurphy195 »

I've forwarded the email to (one of) my local councillors expressing my views. We'll see what the response is. Based on past experience this will get me nowhere however if necessary there's always the Lord Mayors department, my local MP and local newspaper if more noise is needed.

Lets not forget that one vehicle was parked on a dropped kerb in addition to those on the cycle path, unfortunately I didn't get the full number of that one. All on the main access into Cannon Hill Park which regularly has some fundraising or awareness raising events on (the other week it was a wheelchair push)
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