The Tragic Proliferation of ‘Drive-Cycling’

Vorpal
Moderator
Posts: 17205
Joined: 19 Jan 2009, 3:34pm
Location: Not there ;)

Re: The Tragic Proliferation of ‘Drive-Cycling’

Postby Vorpal » 12 Jun 2018, 6:33am

brynpoeth wrote:Do sportives cause more tragic drive-cycling?

Cause it? No. They may encourage it. Especially the ginormous ones, where thousands or even tens of thousands participate. Not all those people can get there by bike and/or public transport. When I did London to Brighton, a group of us drove down in a people carrier. That was in 2003 or 2004. I also took the car a few times to get to the start of the club run when Mini V was small (2008) I couldn't cope with the extra 11 miles to the start, plus the club run if Mini V was along. If the club run went somewhat in the direction of home, we rode down to the start, and just went home when we wanted to. I also did that a couple of times for family club runs when we were three (me, Mini V, and Littlest), and used tandem and trailer.
“In some ways, it is easier to be a dissident, for then one is without responsibility.”
― Nelson Mandela, Long Walk to Freedom

landsurfer
Posts: 4963
Joined: 27 Oct 2012, 9:13pm
Location: Rotherham

Re: The Tragic Proliferation of ‘Drive-Cycling’

Postby landsurfer » 12 Jun 2018, 7:09am

It's probably just me, but ...... this post seems to be"Troll Powered" .
Ulster will fight, and Ulster will be right ... Carson.
The Road Goes On Forever ...

pwa
Posts: 10283
Joined: 2 Oct 2011, 8:55pm

Re: The Tragic Proliferation of ‘Drive-Cycling’

Postby pwa » 12 Jun 2018, 7:37am

brynpoeth wrote:Do sportives cause more tragic drive-cycling?


How would you get to such events if you wanted to take part? Don't say train, because thousands of participants are not going to be able to get their bikes there at the same time. Or would you just not take part and stay home and read a book instead? These events are important to some cyclists. They are highlights of their cycling year. Some car share with friends.

I've driven to cycling events in the past, and I don't regret it. It was at a time when long distance Audax rides were my passion. Great memories.

There is a puritanical streak in this Forum sometimes and it is now being used to attack fellow cyclists.

thirdcrank
Posts: 28648
Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 2:44pm

Re: The Tragic Proliferation of ‘Drive-Cycling’

Postby thirdcrank » 12 Jun 2018, 8:06am

Memories of all those riders on a Sunday morning with their best wheels in sprint carriers.

I had my own drive-cycling period when I bought the dreaded Berlingo as a mobile cycling shed and the one great commissaire in the sky penalised me with the biggest heap of junk ever to roll off a production line on a Friday afternoon.

pwa
Posts: 10283
Joined: 2 Oct 2011, 8:55pm

Re: The Tragic Proliferation of ‘Drive-Cycling’

Postby pwa » 12 Jun 2018, 8:19am

thirdcrank wrote:Memories of all those riders on a Sunday morning with their best wheels in sprint carriers.

I had my own drive-cycling period when I bought the dreaded Berlingo as a mobile cycling shed and the one great commissaire in the sky penalised me with the biggest heap of junk ever to roll off a production line on a Friday afternoon.


:lol:

pwa
Posts: 10283
Joined: 2 Oct 2011, 8:55pm

Re: The Tragic Proliferation of ‘Drive-Cycling’

Postby pwa » 12 Jun 2018, 8:33am

I can think of a few fellow cyclists who do a lot of Audax rides and sometimes get there by car. It is their passion. They probably do more cycling miles than 99% of people on this Forum. One I can think of cycles to and from work during the week, doing his bit in a town that is clogged with traffic. But at the weekend he tends to share a car to get to some difficult to reach place for the start of an epic ride. Nowt wrong with that. It is using a car when you need to and not when you don't.

User avatar
Audax67
Posts: 4499
Joined: 25 Aug 2011, 9:02am
Location: Alsace, France
Contact:

Re: The Tragic Proliferation of ‘Drive-Cycling’

Postby Audax67 » 12 Jun 2018, 1:11pm

I'd certainly drive several hundred km to do an Audax, but I've stopped doing any events from our regional FFCT calendar that are too far away to ride to. But I have no trouble with people driving to cycle tracks to ride if they can't get there any other way, e.g. if they're medically incapable. I'd far rather see that than hurtling pedestrians on eBikes.
Have we got time for another cuppa?

firedfromthecircus
Posts: 256
Joined: 23 Jan 2012, 7:50pm

Re: The Tragic Proliferation of ‘Drive-Cycling’

Postby firedfromthecircus » 12 Jun 2018, 5:05pm

recumbentpanda wrote:I am lucky to live close to some very good ( and practically useful ) off road cycle paths. It is very noticeable over the last ten years that there has been a significant increase in people driving to the paths in order to cycle, to the extent that on weekends and in school holidays, parking is becoming an issue.

Does any one agree with me that it is a thoroughly bad thing that cycling becomes a thing like skiing or kayaking, that you have to go somewhere to do, rather than something you do to go somewhere?


Yes. It is a bad thing, but there are worse things. We could be horse riders for instance. I live in an area where horse riding is popular and on many weekends people travel from who knows where in their horse boxes and 4x4s with trailers, clogging up the roads and then clogging up the trails. Or car enthusiasts who drive somewhere so they can go drive nowhere with lots of other people following them. Or a personal pet peeve for me, the leisure flyers. Microlights, small planes and helicopters just killing the planet and destroying the peace and quiet of some lovely countryside so they can see some lovely countryside! They would all face the chopping block before the drive cyclists if I were in charge of the revolution! :lol:

Tangled Metal wrote:There's nothing wrong with driving to cycle somewhere. There's many reasons why but tbh why should anyone have to justify their decisions to anyone.

However if you want to know my reasons they include safety for my 5 year old (and when he was younger). Not many off road cycleways nearby. The ones we have we've ridden so many times and even the local ones take time and distance to get to. If you're with a child who only has limited miles in his legs then skipping the closest parts to explore more is needed.

With a young child you have to keep their interest in the activities you like to do. Cycling the same, single off road route from our door we'd soon lose his interest in cycling. It's only the same as walking which we also do by driving places first. Only there's more walking routes from our house.

Any activity we do outside work is about enjoyment and release. Putting restrictions on how we go about our free time could affect that. If shopping is your thing then would you get your fix by going to the village shop or do you need to drive an hour to get to the Trafford Centre? How about holidays? We're an island nation so wherever you are you're not far from the sea, why fly to Spain for a beach holiday? Whatever your leisure activity the likelihood is you'll travel to do it at some point.



There is something wrong with driving to cycle somewhere, and it's called damaging the environment. Restricting peoples choices is going to have to happen if we want to leave behind a planet that will support your grandchildren.
Now I understand completely why some people do it. Especially when it comes to children. I even do it myself on rare occasions, but I at least have the good grace to feel guilty about it and also to wish dearly that it were not so!

brynpoeth wrote:Motor traffic is a curse, there is far too much of it, I hope most forum members agree with me?


Absolutely!

Bmblbzzz wrote:Better to cycle without driving but better to drive then ride rather than drive then drive some more.


Indeed!

pwa
Posts: 10283
Joined: 2 Oct 2011, 8:55pm

Re: The Tragic Proliferation of ‘Drive-Cycling’

Postby pwa » 12 Jun 2018, 7:46pm

I did a lovely 35 miler today, up hill and down dale, taking in several villages along the way. I even did a bit of business en route, calling in at a joinery place to order a large quantity of firewood to be delivered a couple of months from now. All on the bike with no car involved. I haven't touched the car all day. But I am lucky. I have countryside and quiet lanes from my doorstep. And I currently favour solo cycling rather than "events". I am not going to criticise people who live in cities and don't want to waste some of their cycling time just escaping the urban sprawl, or those who value the social event that is an Audax or sportive. For all I know they use their cars sparingly when it comes to other things. And maybe some of them don't fly to their holiday destinations. Who knows? If you don't know the circumstances of individuals very well it is better to keep the pointy finger to yourself.

User avatar
661-Pete
Posts: 9121
Joined: 22 Nov 2012, 8:45pm
Location: Sussex

Re: The Tragic Proliferation of ‘Drive-Cycling’

Postby 661-Pete » 12 Jun 2018, 9:08pm

landsurfer wrote:It's probably just me, but ...... this post seems to be"Troll Powered" .

Dunno about that, but even trolls - well some of them at least - have got the right idea:
Image
Suppose that this room is a lift. The support breaks and down we go with ever-increasing velocity.
Let us pass the time by performing physical experiments...
--- Arthur Eddington (creator of the Eddington Number).

brynpoeth
Posts: 11021
Joined: 30 Nov 2013, 11:26am

Re: The Tragic Proliferation of ‘Drive-Cycling’

Postby brynpoeth » 16 Jun 2018, 8:09am

Mark R wrote:Park and pedal clearly the way forward for cash strapped LAs. They just need to make sure the routes from the parking into the city are safe, convenient, and stress free - e.g. off road - if they want to attract new people to cycle commuting.

Wonder what the "April 1 - November 30" bit is referring to? Do they think people will suddenly choose to stop cycling in winter?!

Winter is the best time for cycling
Does the text mean 0500 - 2100? :?
Entertainer, juvenile, curmudgeon
Cycling-of course, but it is far better on a Gillott
We love safety cameras, we love life

brynpoeth
Posts: 11021
Joined: 30 Nov 2013, 11:26am

Re: The Tragic Proliferation of ‘Drive-Cycling’

Postby brynpoeth » 16 Jun 2018, 8:15am

pwa wrote:
brynpoeth wrote:Do sportives cause more tragic drive-cycling?


How would you get to such events if you wanted to take part? Don't say train, because thousands of participants are not going to be able to get their bikes there at the same time. Or would you just not take part and stay home and read a book instead? These events are important to some cyclists. They are highlights of their cycling year. Some car share with friends.

I've driven to cycling events in the past, and I don't regret it. It was at a time when long distance Audax rides were my passion. Great memories.

There is a puritanical streak in this Forum sometimes and it is now being used to attack fellow cyclists.

Puritanical? That is a good word for me :wink:
I put a high weight or cost on motor journeys when making decisions, I choose to miss events rather than go by car
For example there is a really interesting-looking mill museum some way from home, has a huge collection of flour sacks +1
But there is no station there and it is a bit far to cycle
So I wait until I can combine the visit with something else, or get someone to take me when going by. Might be years until I go there

I would not stay home and read a book, I would go cycling with a book and stop to read somewhere

I am ashamed to admit I am driving to work now (not for much longer :D) so using my vehicle for fun is NOT allowed! (puritanical? +1!)
Entertainer, juvenile, curmudgeon
Cycling-of course, but it is far better on a Gillott
We love safety cameras, we love life

pwa
Posts: 10283
Joined: 2 Oct 2011, 8:55pm

Re: The Tragic Proliferation of ‘Drive-Cycling’

Postby pwa » 16 Jun 2018, 10:05am

brynpoeth wrote:
pwa wrote:
brynpoeth wrote:Do sportives cause more tragic drive-cycling?


How would you get to such events if you wanted to take part? Don't say train, because thousands of participants are not going to be able to get their bikes there at the same time. Or would you just not take part and stay home and read a book instead? These events are important to some cyclists. They are highlights of their cycling year. Some car share with friends.

I've driven to cycling events in the past, and I don't regret it. It was at a time when long distance Audax rides were my passion. Great memories.

There is a puritanical streak in this Forum sometimes and it is now being used to attack fellow cyclists.

Puritanical? That is a good word for me :wink:
I put a high weight or cost on motor journeys when making decisions, I choose to miss events rather than go by car
For example there is a really interesting-looking mill museum some way from home, has a huge collection of flour sacks +1
But there is no station there and it is a bit far to cycle
So I wait until I can combine the visit with something else, or get someone to take me when going by. Might be years until I go there

I would not stay home and read a book, I would go cycling with a book and stop to read somewhere

I am ashamed to admit I am driving to work now (not for much longer :D) so using my vehicle for fun is NOT allowed! (puritanical? +1!)


So we both try to curb our car use, but use the car when we feel a need. With some reluctance. And I know an Audaxer who does that, using his bike to get to work and saving his car use for Audax rides that would otherwise be out of reach. And for those car journeys he does tend to car share. To me that is a balanced approach. His car sits idle most of the week when he can get his business done without it, and he uses it (or gets a lift with a friend) when the car is the only practical way of doing what he wants to do.

brynpoeth
Posts: 11021
Joined: 30 Nov 2013, 11:26am

Re: The Tragic Proliferation of ‘Drive-Cycling’

Postby brynpoeth » 16 Jun 2018, 10:09am

You are lucky, you can park you vehicle on a hill, so you can start it if it has been standing for months
No hills in my leafy suburb

Are we agreeing? :wink:
Entertainer, juvenile, curmudgeon
Cycling-of course, but it is far better on a Gillott
We love safety cameras, we love life

thirdcrank
Posts: 28648
Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 2:44pm

Re: The Tragic Proliferation of ‘Drive-Cycling’

Postby thirdcrank » 16 Jun 2018, 10:12am

There seems to be some blurring of the lines between people who use a bike for part of a journey and those travelling by some other means to go cycling. I seem to see quite a lot of informal park-and-riding where people drive to the edge of the paid on-street parking area and then ride into the city centre, presumably to work. That seems to be a means of increasing the attraction of motorised commuting: cycling a couple of miles saves the cost of city-centre parking without having to pay for the official bus-based park-and-ride either. I don't know much about the Leeds park-and-ride but when they launched the one on King Lane they provided cycle lockers in the belief that people would ride-and-ride ie cycle from home in the surrounding suburbs then get the bus. They didn't allow for people just walking to the nearest suburban bus stop. :roll:

Driving to somewhere like a Sustrans trail seems to be a sign that people don't consider cycling as a transport option. Horse boxes have been mentioned and I think it's a good comparison. In the past I've compared it with swimming. Few people can travel somewhere by swimming so most go to a swimming pool by one means or another and swim around or to-and-fro.

We've been reminded above that most car journeys are said to be under five miles. My impression is that the main incentive for people to change travel mode for these shorter journeys is the growing problems of making them by car: congestion and difficulty parking, with parking a stronger deterrent effect than congestion.