Self driving car kills pedestrian.

Vorpal
Moderator
Posts: 20720
Joined: 19 Jan 2009, 3:34pm
Location: Not there ;)

Re: Self driving car kills pedestrian.

Post by Vorpal »

Mike Sales wrote:There seems some confusion here. News media are calling the woman a pedestrian and a cyclist. It is not specified whether she was pushing the bike or riding it, but agreed that she was crossing the road outside a crosswalk.

She was walking and pushing her bike.
The Volvo was in self-driving mode with a human backup driver at the wheel when it hit 49-year-old Elaine Herzberg as she was walking a bicycle outside the lines of a crosswalk, police said.

Read more here: http://www.fresnobee.com/news/business/ ... rylink=cpy
“In some ways, it is easier to be a dissident, for then one is without responsibility.”
― Nelson Mandela, Long Walk to Freedom
User avatar
craigbroadbent
Posts: 48
Joined: 10 Aug 2017, 8:26am

Re: Self driving car kills pedestrian.

Post by craigbroadbent »

I trust Volvo not Uber. Volvo have delayed road testing for 3 years mainly due to difficulties in detecting cyclists. They have a sight more experience in these things.

https://www.theverge.com/2017/12/14/16776466/volvo-drive-me-self-driving-car-sweden-delay

I expect some lawyers in the US are sharpening their pencils
User avatar
Wanlock Dod
Posts: 577
Joined: 28 Sep 2016, 5:48pm

Re: Self driving car kills pedestrian.

Post by Wanlock Dod »

thirdcrank wrote:...increasingly depending on the system to avoid crashing...

Guardian wrote:...The 2017 Volvo SUV was traveling at roughly 40 miles an hour, and it did not appear that the car slowed down as it approached the woman...

Also had an operator on board who presumably just left it to it... :(
Bonefishblues
Posts: 11043
Joined: 7 Jul 2014, 9:45pm
Location: Near Bicester Oxon

Re: Self driving car kills pedestrian.

Post by Bonefishblues »

craigbroadbent wrote:I trust Volvo not Uber. Volvo have delayed road testing for 3 years mainly due to difficulties in detecting cyclists. They have a sight more experience in these things.

https://www.theverge.com/2017/12/14/16776466/volvo-drive-me-self-driving-car-sweden-delay


Not words you'll often see on here.

Given that an XC90 was the vehicle involved, then probably a smart move. They allowed Uber to carry on with the programme though.
Vorpal
Moderator
Posts: 20720
Joined: 19 Jan 2009, 3:34pm
Location: Not there ;)

Re: Self driving car kills pedestrian.

Post by Vorpal »

Bonefishblues wrote:
craigbroadbent wrote:I trust Volvo not Uber. Volvo have delayed road testing for 3 years mainly due to difficulties in detecting cyclists. They have a sight more experience in these things.

https://www.theverge.com/2017/12/14/16776466/volvo-drive-me-self-driving-car-sweden-delay


Not words you'll often see on here.

Given that an XC90 was the vehicle involved, then probably a smart move. They allowed Uber to carry on with the programme though.

It's a joint project. https://www.media.volvocars.com/global/ ... iving-cars

Not just Uber.
“In some ways, it is easier to be a dissident, for then one is without responsibility.”
― Nelson Mandela, Long Walk to Freedom
Bonefishblues
Posts: 11043
Joined: 7 Jul 2014, 9:45pm
Location: Near Bicester Oxon

Re: Self driving car kills pedestrian.

Post by Bonefishblues »

Vorpal wrote:
Bonefishblues wrote:
craigbroadbent wrote:I trust Volvo not Uber. Volvo have delayed road testing for 3 years mainly due to difficulties in detecting cyclists. They have a sight more experience in these things.

https://www.theverge.com/2017/12/14/16776466/volvo-drive-me-self-driving-car-sweden-delay


Not words you'll often see on here.

Given that an XC90 was the vehicle involved, then probably a smart move. They allowed Uber to carry on with the programme though.

It's a joint project. https://www.media.volvocars.com/global/ ... iving-cars

Not just Uber.

Interesting that it's Uber which is taking all the flack.
thirdcrank
Posts: 36781
Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 2:44pm

Re: Self driving car kills pedestrian.

Post by thirdcrank »

I trust Volvo ...


Car manufacturers similar to all the others. It's a while ago now - early 1980's - when Volvo ran an advertising campaign here based on the life expectancy of their vehicles: "if they typically survive 23 years (IIRC) in Sweden with all that snow, just think how long they will last here." That was in spite of the grim corrosion experience of Brits who bought them. They were forced to pull that campaign by the toothless advertising watchdoggy. A late friend worked at their Leeds dealership and he explained that the life expectancy figures were correct, based on official Swedish govt., data, for Volvo's home market, but that cars in Sweden benefited from a version of Trigger's Broom treatment.

The Swedish motor industry's attitude to the safety of those outside the vehicle is typified by the so-called Elk Test.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moose_test

That doesn't explain the origin which AFAIK, is that somebody - a celebrity IIRC - is said to have crashed into an elk and was killed when it came in through the windscreen - involuntarily of course. The logic to me is drive so you can stop in the distance you can see to be clear.
pwa
Posts: 17428
Joined: 2 Oct 2011, 8:55pm

Re: Self driving car kills pedestrian.

Post by pwa »

I have only once been in a car that has lost all grip and spun on a wet road (just outside Pisa), and that was a Volvo. It lost grip at a relatively modest speed and I remember making a mental note not to buy a car like that. That moment is the most unsafe I have ever felt in a car.
thirdcrank
Posts: 36781
Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 2:44pm

Re: Self driving car kills pedestrian.

Post by thirdcrank »

On the subject of not trusting Uber, who on Earth devised the name?

Complete the following well-known phrase or saying

Deutschland **** alles


I do know what it's supposed to mean, but that's not how it's interpreted.
User avatar
mjr
Posts: 20337
Joined: 20 Jun 2011, 7:06pm
Location: Norfolk or Somerset, mostly
Contact:

Re: Self driving car kills pedestrian.

Post by mjr »

thirdcrank wrote:On the subject of not trusting Uber, who on Earth devised the name?

Complete the following well-known phrase or saying

Deutschland **** alles


I do know what it's supposed to mean, but that's not how it's interpreted.

Or the Nietzschean Übermensch, hijacked by a failed German regime that was the last to use that part of the song in the anthem.

Apparently in the late naughties, young cluebies were using it to mean "cool" :roll:
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
All the above is CC-By-SA and no other implied copyright license to Cycle magazine.
Vorpal
Moderator
Posts: 20720
Joined: 19 Jan 2009, 3:34pm
Location: Not there ;)

Re: Self driving car kills pedestrian.

Post by Vorpal »

mjr wrote:Or the Nietzschean Übermensch, hijacked by a failed German regime that was the last to use that part of the song in the anthem.

Apparently in the late naughties, young cluebies were using it to mean "cool" :roll:

It started as an adjective, as in "Uber cool, dude!"
“In some ways, it is easier to be a dissident, for then one is without responsibility.”
― Nelson Mandela, Long Walk to Freedom
0xymoron
Posts: 81
Joined: 28 Sep 2010, 8:10pm

Re: Self driving car kills pedestrian.

Post by 0xymoron »

But . . . but . . . but . . .

How many thousands (hundreds of thousands?) of miles of testing have driverless cars done on public roads to date, and how many pedestrians (and cyclists) would have died if those miles had been travelled under human, rather than computer, control?
Barks
Posts: 310
Joined: 14 Oct 2016, 5:27pm

Re: Self driving car kills pedestrian.

Post by Barks »

And and and... we have been given no information of the broader circumstances other than the poor lady was not on the sidewalk and was walking with her bike, it infers she was in the roadway. She may have simply walked out in front of the car for some odd reason which means it is probably irrelavent whether or not it was an autonomous car or being driven/minded by a human.
Vorpal
Moderator
Posts: 20720
Joined: 19 Jan 2009, 3:34pm
Location: Not there ;)

Re: Self driving car kills pedestrian.

Post by Vorpal »

as she was walking a bicycle outside the lines of a crosswalk

Read more here: http://www.fresnobee.com/news/business/ ... rylink=cpy


Implies to me that she was crossing the street near a pedestrian crossing (crosswalk), likely cutting a corner off, or following a desire line.

Since this is the most information given about her road position, we don't actually know even that much. It could be the police officer's polite way to say that she was 'jaywalking', that is, nowhere near a formal crossing. But if so, it seems an odd way to say it.
“In some ways, it is easier to be a dissident, for then one is without responsibility.”
― Nelson Mandela, Long Walk to Freedom
Cyril Haearn
Posts: 15215
Joined: 30 Nov 2013, 11:26am

Re: Self driving car kills pedestrian.

Post by Cyril Haearn »

craigbroadbent wrote:I trust Volvo not Uber. Volvo have delayed road testing for 3 years mainly due to difficulties in detecting cyclists. They have a sight more experience in these things.

https://www.theverge.com/2017/12/14/16776466/volvo-drive-me-self-driving-car-sweden-delay

I expect some lawyers in the US are sharpening their pencils

I do not trust either
volvo plans to make vehicles so 'safe' that no-one INSIDE one will be killed
Entertainer, juvenile, curmudgeon, PoB, 30120
Cycling-of course, but it is far better on a Gillott
We love safety cameras, we hate bullies
Post Reply