Page 1 of 17

Swapping penalty points

Posted: 21 Jun 2018, 9:34pm
by thirdcrank
It's been widely reported today that research by Co-operative Insurance suggests that a fifth of drivers have falsely admitted to being the driver of a motor vehicle during the investigation of an alleged offence to shelter another driver from the penalty points.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/motors/6588748 ... motorists/

:shock:

Re: Swapping penalty points

Posted: 21 Jun 2018, 10:02pm
by gaz
For those who do not wish to follow the above link: https://www.co-operative.coop/media/new ... meone-else

Scary reading.

Re: Swapping penalty points

Posted: 21 Jun 2018, 10:27pm
by gaz
A fifth (19%) of UK motorists have broken the law by taking penalty points for another driver,

A quarter (23%) said they had to swap points to avoid the other motorist being banned from driving.

Simple maths suggests up to 1 in 25 drivers should be banned if they had not swapped points. I do realise that the reality won't be that simple but as I said above, scary reading.

Re: Swapping penalty points

Posted: 21 Jun 2018, 10:33pm
by Barks
And ban everyone who exceeds 12 points - stop giving any consideration for hardship, if these people genuinely would be inconvenienced then they can simply drive properly.

Re: Swapping penalty points

Posted: 21 Jun 2018, 10:41pm
by Bonefishblues
I can't drucpve at all, I'm afraid!

Re: Swapping penalty points

Posted: 21 Jun 2018, 10:43pm
by landsurfer
Barks wrote:And ban everyone who exceeds 12 points - stop giving any consideration for hardship, if these people genuinely would be inconveniced then they can simply drucpve properly.


Until it's you of course, then it's different ...

Re: Swapping penalty points

Posted: 21 Jun 2018, 10:47pm
by landsurfer
If you drive 12,000 miles a year and get 12 points you are a bad driver.
If you drive 120,000 miles a year and get 12 points does that make you 10 times less bad than the 12000 miles driver ??

Or 10 times safer ?

Re: Swapping penalty points

Posted: 21 Jun 2018, 11:01pm
by gaz
Getting 12 points makes them both bad drivers, one bad driver has driven 10x further than the other bad driver.

Re: Swapping penalty points

Posted: 22 Jun 2018, 12:41am
by Barks
And has 10 times the opportunity to inflict serious damage to other road users due to their lack of consideration for others.

Re: Swapping penalty points

Posted: 22 Jun 2018, 5:34am
by brynpoeth
I wonder whether a poll could be done among fora members: how many points do you have? :?

I have none. Never had any. Was stopped by the cops once for driving slowly, I am very proud of that. Has it happened to anyone else?

Re: Swapping penalty points

Posted: 22 Jun 2018, 6:13am
by thirdcrank
It's the extent to which this is said to occur which startles me.

I appreciate that not all adults hold a driving licence but that doesn't necessarily define the extent of those who see this as ok. It suggests, for example, that in trials of more serious cases, at least a couple of jurors may typically have done this. There's nothing to suggest that this is confined to a part of society when such a big number is involved. It takes two to tango: if one-in-five drivers have wrongly accepted points, it implies that a similar number have avoided them.

I spotted this in a small item in the Daily T. Objectively, it's not front page headline stuff but it suggests a part of the system is rotten but few are worried. :(

===================================================================
PS

Thanks to gaz for digging out a more comprehensive link.

Re: Swapping penalty points

Posted: 22 Jun 2018, 7:37am
by millimole
I suspect there's two issues at work here. Firstly that driver crime isn't taken seriously by a large part of the population; secondly an increasing acceptance of society of minor lawbreaking.
Criminal behaviour by drivers is discussed on here at length, as is the strange approach to sentencing. Points aren't seen as punishment, they are a minor inconvenience, and there is no incentive to change behaviour.
Society accepts things today which would have been frowned on, or unacceptable, a couple of decades ago - parking on pavements, cycling on pavements come to that, street drinking, minor shoplifting (self service checkouts), playing music on buses etc etc. All of which compounds the idea that 'it's only speeding' and 'what's the matter with a few points on my licence'.

As I've said before, the route into tackling the drivers with the points is through insurance costs - the insurance companies are complicit in allowing these people to continue to drive on our roads.
The way to deal with the points takers is a change in attitude in society, and that will be a long time coming.

I'm a trendy consumer. Just look at my gormless idiot phone.

Re: Swapping penalty points

Posted: 22 Jun 2018, 7:40am
by thelawnet
thirdcrank wrote:It's been widely reported today that research by Co-operative Insurance suggests that a fifth of drivers have falsely admitted to being the driver of a motor vehicle during the investigation of an alleged offence to shelter another driver from the penalty points.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/motors/6588748 ... motorists/

:shock:


This is not research, it is PR.
http://www.atomikresearch.co.uk/media-research/

"
RESEARCH THAT HITS NATIONWIDE HEADLINES
We know what creative angles work for the media and understand what makes journalists tick, ensuring our research hits the headlines."

Fake News!

Re: Swapping penalty points

Posted: 22 Jun 2018, 7:49am
by thirdcrank
It's clearly not peer-reviewed academic research, but unless this is to be dismissed outright as a publicity stunt - and one which might backfire - then I still find it disturbing. It's hard to see that insurance companies have an interest in normalising lawbreaking.

Re: Swapping penalty points

Posted: 22 Jun 2018, 8:16am
by pwa
Barks wrote:And has 10 times the opportunity to inflict serious damage to other road users due to their lack of consideration for others.


But a driver with 3 points cannot criticise a driver with 9 points who drives three times as far (possibly in their job) because they are both driving to the same standard.