“virtually indistinguishable” in the dark

Steady rider
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Re: “virtually indistinguishable” in the dark

Postby Steady rider » 2 Oct 2018, 6:37pm

I think nearly all none light colours can be considered useless in the dark.

look behind, signal, turn, preferable turning with both hands on the bars


May be I should have included positioning, this would depend on traffic to some degree. The look behind informs when to signal or move, timing. Occasionally I use a 'hook turn' but not very often. The road situation would have to quite bad for me to use this method.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?source= ... z_FaNWZ2co

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Cugel
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Re: “virtually indistinguishable” in the dark

Postby Cugel » 2 Oct 2018, 9:30pm

meic wrote:
A right turn whilst looking over your shoulder is perhaps one of the most dangerous manoeuvres there is on a bike, especially on those country lanes with a blind bend in front. A momentary failure to look fo'rrard whilst looking backwards during the critical moment whilst performing such a right turn can mean you miss the emergence from the blind bend ahead of the speeding Toad-loon.


Which is one reason why you look backwards before making your turn.
Of course the main reason that you look before making your turn is that it would be too late to make use of your look if you look during the turn. You are looking to see if it is safe to turn or not.


Mirror.

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meic
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Re: “virtually indistinguishable” in the dark

Postby meic » 2 Oct 2018, 10:07pm

I have two car sized mirrors on my BMW fairing and they are pretty good at keeping me informed at what goes on behind. Not good enough to make a lifesaver redundant though.
Yma o Hyd

thirdcrank
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Re: “virtually indistinguishable” in the dark

Postby thirdcrank » 28 Feb 2019, 7:25am

Mike Hall: UK endurance cyclist's death in Australia 'avoidable'

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-australia-47396799

scrumpydave
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Re: “virtually indistinguishable” in the dark

Postby scrumpydave » 28 Feb 2019, 9:25am

thirdcrank wrote:Mike Hall: UK endurance cyclist's death in Australia 'avoidable'

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-australia-47396799


I don't know what to make of this... The victim blaming is strong.

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NATURAL ANKLING
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Re: “virtually indistinguishable” in the dark

Postby NATURAL ANKLING » 28 Feb 2019, 10:00am

Hi,
I’m not victim blaming here just something I’ve noticed recently.
Whilst cycling at night I have noticed that when I come up on pedestrians on cycle path that’s shared paths, I have a very short time to change direction if the clothing is dark and bland, They blend into the background too well.

My lights are concentrated on the path, well the one on the bike is, I have a powerful light on my helmet which I can direct anywhere.
But it’s dark and you’re concentrating on the way ahead you have limited field of View.

In contrast anyone wearing reflective clothes I noticed very early even 200 yards away the glint catches your eyes and you concentrate on what exactly it is, even incredibly small reflective bits of debris on the path, the other day I picked up at three inch long spoke reflector half the diameter of a pen even smaller items I noticed reflected from my strong lights.

On Mike Hall There Appears to be scant information on his clothing and lights?
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PDQ Mobile
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Re: “virtually indistinguishable” in the dark

Postby PDQ Mobile » 28 Feb 2019, 10:09am

Two questions remain for myself.
Firstly.That the police have not retained Mr Hall's clothing seems extraordinary.
Secondly. It is stated that the driver was distracted "as he turned out of a junction" by a parked car.
Yet he was travelling at 62 mph?
Doesn't seem to tally.

thirdcrank
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Re: “virtually indistinguishable” in the dark

Postby thirdcrank » 28 Feb 2019, 10:35am

The official report of the Australian coroner is here as a PDF.

There's more detail available than we often get about inquests in this country. The coroner's conclusion is at para 61, with loads more after that.

Mr Hall’s death was avoidable, which makes the loss of this remarkable person even more keenly felt by his family and the community. It is unfortunate that the investigation into his death has been to some degree compromised by the loss of significant evidence in the form of his clothing and bicycle accoutrements. There is, however, sufficient evidence for his death to be the catalyst for changes that will enhance rider safety into the future.


https://courts.act.gov.au/__data/assets ... 5/Hall.pdf

reohn2
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Re: “virtually indistinguishable” in the dark

Postby reohn2 » 28 Feb 2019, 10:43am

NATURAL ANKLING wrote:Hi,
I’m not victim blaming here just something I’ve noticed recently.
Whilst cycling at night I have noticed that when I come up on pedestrians on cycle path that’s shared paths, I have a very short time to change direction if the clothing is dark and bland, They blend into the background too well.

My lights are concentrated on the path, well the one on the bike is, I have a powerful light on my helmet which I can direct anywhere.
But it’s dark and you’re concentrating on the way ahead you have limited field of View.

In contrast anyone wearing reflective clothes I noticed very early even 200 yards away the glint catches your eyes and you concentrate on what exactly it is, even incredibly small reflective bits of debris on the path, the other day I picked up at three inch long spoke reflector half the diameter of a pen even smaller items I noticed reflected from my strong lights.

On Mike Hall There Appears to be scant information on his clothing and lights?

Here's a link to footage of his night time lighting:- https://youtu.be/PvZpUjEfU74
The only person who wouldn't see him was someone who wasn't looking.
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NATURAL ANKLING
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Re: “virtually indistinguishable” in the dark

Postby NATURAL ANKLING » 28 Feb 2019, 11:12am

Hi,
If you look at the video and pause it around about the time the passengers says slow down, then pause Again up to all their alongside.
Earlier on he is hard to see against the white lines of the road.?
I like to think I was a bit more visible than that on my own bike.
But I’ve never seen myself from behind at all.

I don’t wanna get into blaming anybody, it’s just my own personal observations as critical as they can be.
NA Thinks Just End 2 End Return + Bivvy
You'll Still Find Me At The Top Of A Hill
Please forgive the poor Grammar I blame it on my mobile and phat thinkers.

paddler
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Re: “virtually indistinguishable” in the dark

Postby paddler » 28 Feb 2019, 11:18am

reohn2 wrote:
NATURAL ANKLING wrote:Hi,
I’m not victim blaming here just something I’ve noticed recently.
Whilst cycling at night I have noticed that when I come up on pedestrians on cycle path that’s shared paths, I have a very short time to change direction if the clothing is dark and bland, They blend into the background too well.

My lights are concentrated on the path, well the one on the bike is, I have a powerful light on my helmet which I can direct anywhere.
But it’s dark and you’re concentrating on the way ahead you have limited field of View.

In contrast anyone wearing reflective clothes I noticed very early even 200 yards away the glint catches your eyes and you concentrate on what exactly it is, even incredibly small reflective bits of debris on the path, the other day I picked up at three inch long spoke reflector half the diameter of a pen even smaller items I noticed reflected from my strong lights.

On Mike Hall There Appears to be scant information on his clothing and lights?

Here's a link to footage of his night time lighting:- https://youtu.be/PvZpUjEfU74
The only person who wouldn't see him was someone who wasn't looking.


I've noticed this when camping it's pitch black with a head torch. Anything outside of the spread of the beam I can't see.
Presumably our eyes adjust to the brightness of the light, and it's only when that light is removed that they slowly then re-adjust to the lower light level.

irc
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Re: “virtually indistinguishable” in the dark

Postby irc » 28 Feb 2019, 11:22am

No excuse for the driver but s red flasher as well as the steady red and a scotchlite patch n the back of his too or a hi viz reflective bib would have made him more visible.
When I regularly commuted at night I had 3 rear flashers. Two of them on an aluminium strip putting them 18 inches apart at the rear of the bike. A Scotchlite patch on a rucsac. Scotchlite spoke reflectors. Twin front lights. Overkill? Perhaps. But I never had a crash or a near miss.

reohn2
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Re: “virtually indistinguishable” in the dark

Postby reohn2 » 28 Feb 2019, 11:59am

NATURAL ANKLING wrote:Hi,
If you look at the video and pause it around about the time the passengers says slow down, then pause Again up to all their alongside.
Earlier on he is hard to see against the white lines of the road.?
I like to think I was a bit more visible than that on my own bike.
But I’ve never seen myself from behind at all.

I don’t wanna get into blaming anybody, it’s just my own personal observations as critical as they can be.

TBH,if a drive can't see that cyclist from any distance on that road they're not looking,and I'd be driving on mainbeam on a road like that with no oncoming traffic dipping the headlights when I saw his tail light.
In that clip the beam of his front light on the road was as visible as his rear.

Another point,the driver said in his defence that he initially thought he'd hit Kangaroo.I've never been to Australia but if I were driving there and was aware that there could be a chance of hitting a Kangaroo or a Wallaby,I'd be even more vigilant driving at night if only because of the damage hitting one would do to my car or me.
It seems to me the driver was driving without due care and attention at the least and wrecklassly dangerous at worst.
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