Nick Freeman Attacks "exceptional hardship"

reohn2
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Re: Nick Freeman Attacks "exceptional hardship"

Postby reohn2 » 7 Nov 2018, 10:14pm

Bonefishblues wrote:I don't have a problem with the ability to make the plea, but its application needs better scrutiny and clearer criteria, perhaps.

Could you explain what you mean please?
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Bonefishblues
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Re: Nick Freeman Attacks "exceptional hardship"

Postby Bonefishblues » 7 Nov 2018, 11:15pm

reohn2 wrote:
Bonefishblues wrote:I don't have a problem with the ability to make the plea, but its application needs better scrutiny and clearer criteria, perhaps.

Could you explain what you mean please?

The ability to plead thus should be maintained but there should be clearer instructions to Magistrates as to what constitutes exceptional hardship.

reohn2
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Joined: 26 Jun 2009, 8:21pm

Re: Nick Freeman Attacks "exceptional hardship"

Postby reohn2 » 7 Nov 2018, 11:34pm

Bonefishblues wrote:
reohn2 wrote:
Bonefishblues wrote:I don't have a problem with the ability to make the plea, but its application needs better scrutiny and clearer criteria, perhaps.

Could you explain what you mean please?

The ability to plead thus should be maintained but there should be clearer instructions to Magistrates as to what constitutes exceptional hardship.

Agreed.
Throughout this thread I've been waiting for someone to define 'exeptional hardship',it hasn't been forthcoming.
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9494arnold
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Re: Nick Freeman Attacks "exceptional hardship"

Postby 9494arnold » 8 Nov 2018, 8:04am

Exceptional Hardship : Classic Law , not defined , a matter of opinion . That's how the Lawyers make their money. :x

reohn2
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Re: Nick Freeman Attacks "exceptional hardship"

Postby reohn2 » 8 Nov 2018, 8:11am

9494arnold wrote:Exceptional Hardship : Classic Law , not defined , a matter of opinion . That's how the Lawyers make their money. :x

I should've known it'd be a scam for the lawyers to exploit :wink: :?
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thirdcrank
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Re: Nick Freeman Attacks "exceptional hardship"

Postby thirdcrank » 9 Nov 2018, 10:34pm

He also said he suffered from "terrible motion sickness" when sitting anywhere but the driver's seat.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-n ... e-46157817

Bonefishblues
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Re: Nick Freeman Attacks "exceptional hardship"

Postby Bonefishblues » 9 Nov 2018, 11:03pm

thirdcrank wrote:
He also said he suffered from "terrible motion sickness" when sitting anywhere but the driver's seat.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-n ... e-46157817

Law properly applied.

thirdcrank
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A classic case

Postby thirdcrank » 8 Apr 2019, 5:08pm

If anybody wanted to start a campaign about this, here's a case to quote
Dartford Crossing death crash lorry driver watching TV

Jurors heard he had twice been caught using his phone while driving and had 12 penalty points on his licence before the crash.
He had been allowed by magistrates to continue driving due to extreme hardship.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-kent-47857774

Bonefishblues
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Re: Nick Freeman Attacks "exceptional hardship"

Postby Bonefishblues » 8 Apr 2019, 5:14pm

That's a poignant case, clearly, and he has gone to prison for a very long time.

Are there any statistics as to the propensity of drivers to be involved in accidents when they continue to drive after establishing exceptional hardship?

pwa
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Re: Nick Freeman Attacks "exceptional hardship"

Postby pwa » 8 Apr 2019, 5:22pm

thirdcrank wrote:
He also said he suffered from "terrible motion sickness" when sitting anywhere but the driver's seat.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-n ... e-46157817

I don't think you do 77 in a 40 limit by accidentally losing concentration. You do it because of an attitude. A ban is the only thing that is likely to prove effective on that sort of mentality.

Bonefishblues
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Re: Nick Freeman Attacks "exceptional hardship"

Postby Bonefishblues » 8 Apr 2019, 5:31pm

pwa wrote:
thirdcrank wrote:
He also said he suffered from "terrible motion sickness" when sitting anywhere but the driver's seat.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-n ... e-46157817

I don't think you do 77 in a 40 limit by accidentally losing concentration. You do it because of an attitude. A ban is the only thing that is likely to prove effective on that sort of mentality.

He was. He was talking nonsense. The Magistrate saw through it.

pete75
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Re: Nick Freeman Attacks "exceptional hardship"

Postby pete75 » 8 Apr 2019, 5:57pm

pwa wrote:
thirdcrank wrote:
He also said he suffered from "terrible motion sickness" when sitting anywhere but the driver's seat.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-n ... e-46157817

I don't think you do 77 in a 40 limit by accidentally losing concentration. You do it because of an attitude. A ban is the only thing that is likely to prove effective on that sort of mentality.

Yes but three months is too short - the default for twelve points is six months so he was treated leniently. With his existing eleven points and another six for this offence he now has a grand total of seventeen. Next time he's up in court with some more points the default is a 12 month ban based on the not unreasonable assumption he's there within three years of this ban.

mattsccm
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Re: Nick Freeman Attacks "exceptional hardship"

Postby mattsccm » 8 Apr 2019, 8:05pm

How about something more reasonable? Say a years ban for every mph over the limit? No exceptions whatsoever. An idiot is still an idiot even if he thinks he has an excuse.

mattsccm
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Re: Nick Freeman Attacks "exceptional hardship"

Postby mattsccm » 8 Apr 2019, 8:06pm

Any driving unlicenced or insured obviously means you don't care so prison. The idea is to scare people into behaving.

Bonefishblues
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Re: Nick Freeman Attacks "exceptional hardship"

Postby Bonefishblues » 8 Apr 2019, 8:13pm

But it's the probability of being caught, not the severity of the punishment that drives behavioural compliance.