Kissing Gates

johncarnie
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Kissing Gates

Postby johncarnie » 9 Nov 2018, 4:20pm

Yesterday whilst cycling the "The Greenway" from Stratford Upon Avon to Long Marston, I came across several e-bike riders who were struggling to get their bikes through the "kissing gates" used on many shared cycle routes. Now many e-bikers are like me getting on in years and have found that an e-bike lets us rediscover the routes we used when we were younger. Trouble is, e-bikes are a tad heavier and offer a challenge to get them through such gates. I realise the gates are there to prevent "dirt-bike" riders, but surely there are better barrier gates for cyclists?

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Cugel
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Re: Kissing Gates

Postby Cugel » 9 Nov 2018, 4:58pm

johncarnie wrote:Yesterday whilst cycling the "The Greenway" from Stratford Upon Avon to Long Marston, I came across several e-bike riders who were struggling to get their bikes through the "kissing gates" used on many shared cycle routes. Now many e-bikers are like me getting on in years and have found that an e-bike lets us rediscover the routes we used when we were younger. Trouble is, e-bikes are a tad heavier and offer a challenge to get them through such gates. I realise the gates are there to prevent "dirt-bike" riders, but surely there are better barrier gates for cyclists?


You must go to the gymnasium and hoist weights about with the upper body until it matches the development of the lower bits. You may then hoist the e-bike over the whole kissy gate, whilst smiling manfully at watching ladies, who will all be coo-ing with admiration, wonder and perhaps some other emotions. You might even get a kiss!

The kissing gate does indeed stop the danged dirt bike, scooter and other churners of a path from accessing it. If the gates were made easy for your e-bike to get through, they too would find that advantage, since a dirt bike or scootery thing is about the same dimensions.

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gaz
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Re: Kissing Gates

Postby gaz » 9 Nov 2018, 5:13pm

johncarnie wrote:... surely there are better barrier gates for cyclists?

There are no barriers that allow access for cycles but prevent access for motorcycles. Whilst illegal and anti-social use of paths should be dealt with by enforcement, not restricting access for those who should have legitimate access, it's simpler to put up a barrier and say "something has been done" (even though it doesn't work).

MrsHJ
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Re: Kissing Gates

Postby MrsHJ » 10 Nov 2018, 12:29pm

All of the barriers are a pain in the bum for cyclists. The narrow ones are a problem with panniers, the wiggly ones are bad if you have a trailer or a kiddie towalong, many of them are bad for recumbents, almost all of them are terrible for disabled cyclists, difficult for bikes with kids seats etc. The planners really need to learn from far better approaches in some continental countries.

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Cugel
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Re: Kissing Gates

Postby Cugel » 10 Nov 2018, 12:38pm

MrsHJ wrote:All of the barriers are a pain in the bum for cyclists. The narrow ones are a problem with panniers, the wiggly ones are bad if you have a trailer or a kiddie towalong, many of them are bad for recumbents, almost all of them are terrible for disabled cyclists, difficult for bikes with kids seats etc. The planners really need to learn from far better approaches in some continental countries.


What are the "far better approaches in some continental countries"? Urls or pics would be good.

Cugel

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Audax67
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Re: Kissing Gates

Postby Audax67 » 10 Nov 2018, 1:57pm

Hah. Speaking as one who caught an enlightened French cycle-path barrier in the breadbasket some weeks back, the best approach is no <expletive> barrier at all.
Have we got time for another cuppa?

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meic
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Re: Kissing Gates

Postby meic » 10 Nov 2018, 2:20pm

In France the only barriers that I can recall were two offset single bar gates. That would slow you down to about 10mph as a cautious tourer but could probably be taken at full speed by a skilled racer.
Would probably bring me down to walking speed with the tandem and would no way prevent a motorcycle from passing, just cars.
There were also concrete bollards on occasions making the entrance to paths impossible for cars.
Yma o Hyd

pete75
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Re: Kissing Gates

Postby pete75 » 10 Nov 2018, 2:30pm

Cugel wrote:
MrsHJ wrote:All of the barriers are a pain in the bum for cyclists. The narrow ones are a problem with panniers, the wiggly ones are bad if you have a trailer or a kiddie towalong, many of them are bad for recumbents, almost all of them are terrible for disabled cyclists, difficult for bikes with kids seats etc. The planners really need to learn from far better approaches in some continental countries.


What are the "far better approaches in some continental countries"? Urls or pics would be good.

Cugel


An example of a fra better approach in a continental country is teh Netherlands where they generally have no barriers of any kind.

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Cugel
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Re: Kissing Gates

Postby Cugel » 10 Nov 2018, 3:27pm

pete75 wrote:
Cugel wrote:
MrsHJ wrote:All of the barriers are a pain in the bum for cyclists. The narrow ones are a problem with panniers, the wiggly ones are bad if you have a trailer or a kiddie towalong, many of them are bad for recumbents, almost all of them are terrible for disabled cyclists, difficult for bikes with kids seats etc. The planners really need to learn from far better approaches in some continental countries.


What are the "far better approaches in some continental countries"? Urls or pics would be good.

Cugel


An example of a fra better approach in a continental country is teh Netherlands where they generally have no barriers of any kind.

Do the motorbikes with yobs on not get in there and roar about?

Cugel

pete75
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Re: Kissing Gates

Postby pete75 » 10 Nov 2018, 5:20pm

Cugel wrote:
pete75 wrote:
Cugel wrote:
What are the "far better approaches in some continental countries"? Urls or pics would be good.

Cugel


An example of a fra better approach in a continental country is teh Netherlands where they generally have no barriers of any kind.

Do the motorbikes with yobs on not get in there and roar about?

Cugel

There are quite a few people riding small motorcycles on them especially near towns. I've no idea if they're yobs or not but it's legal there.

pwa
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Re: Kissing Gates

Postby pwa » 10 Nov 2018, 5:38pm

Has anyone got a serious suggestion for a way of stopping off-road motorbikes churning up fragile ridgeway tracks without completely obstructing legitimate use? Removing all barriers will just result in the loss of some tracks to legitimate users, such as walkers and MTBers, as the tracks become too rutted and boggy for non-motorised use. I've seen that happen. And does anyone really think that police forces that can't even deal with burglaries anymore will be able to supervise these locations enough to deal with and effectively deter offenders? Better policing is very desirable, but is it likely? Is it realistic?

I realise this post gives no answers. I just suggest that the alternatives to awkward barriers on potentially fragile paths are themselves problematic.

brynpoeth
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Re: Kissing Gates

Postby brynpoeth » 10 Nov 2018, 6:22pm

The banned vehicles are heavier

Barriers could create a hiatus to slow users down, at that point the outfit would be weighed, if it were over xxx kg the way would be blocked

xxx kg? Tandem plus riders and luggage (allowed) could exceed 200 kg

How heavy is a motorcycle or moped with rider + luggage?
Cycling-of course, but it is far better on a Gillott
We love safety cameras & STOP signs

pwa
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Re: Kissing Gates

Postby pwa » 10 Nov 2018, 7:21pm

https://www.google.com/maps/@52.1618858 ... 6?hl=en-GB

Not obviously designed for any cycle access at all. What is the status of that path/strack?
A separate access for horses and (with faff) bicycles.https://www.google.com/maps/@52.161838, ... 6?hl=en-GB

landsurfer
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Re: Kissing Gates

Postby landsurfer » 10 Nov 2018, 7:29pm

pwa wrote:https://www.google.com/maps/@52.1618858,-1.7518709,3a,75y,136.53h,88.07t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sJo-nKWWRK2MFVQxSa3jhHg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en-GB

Not obviously designed for any cycle access at all. What is the status of that path/strack?
A separate access for horses and (with faff) bicycles.https://www.google.com/maps/@52.161838, ... 6?hl=en-GB


Without being obvious, i would just lift my bicycle over the fence, enter through the kissing gate and ride off on my bike .... are we over thinking this ... i don't see how it is a problem. We have a number of kissing gates near me .. i usually rotate my bicycle onto its rear wheel and wheel it .. and myself , through ... So i have to get off my bike, i am slowed down, ... so what !
RSF.
Audax UK.
The road goes on forever.

pwa
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Re: Kissing Gates

Postby pwa » 10 Nov 2018, 7:33pm

landsurfer wrote:
pwa wrote:https://www.google.com/maps/@52.1618858,-1.7518709,3a,75y,136.53h,88.07t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sJo-nKWWRK2MFVQxSa3jhHg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en-GB

Not obviously designed for any cycle access at all. What is the status of that path/strack?
A separate access for horses and (with faff) bicycles.https://www.google.com/maps/@52.161838, ... 6?hl=en-GB


Without being obvious, i would just lift my bicycle over the fence, enter through the kissing gate and ride off on my bike .... are we over thinking this ... i don't see how it is a problem. We have a number of kissing gates near me .. i usually rotate my bicycle onto its rear wheel and wheel it .. and myself , through ... So i have to get off my bike, i am slowed down, ... so what !

If you look at the google images you will see alternative access for horses which you could get a bike over. I guess that is the cycle access, not the kissing gates.