Trucks Do Not Have Cyclist-Obscuring Blind Spots

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mjr
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Re: Trucks Do Not Have Cyclist-Obscuring Blind Spots

Postby mjr » 11 Jan 2019, 7:45pm

reohn2 wrote:I'll leave it at that,we disagree 'nough said.

I buy groceries online and don't often care when they arrive on a given day, as long as I know when, so we clearly exist! To be frank, it'd be nice to have concern for my local environment as a reason for picking a timeslot, instead of trying to guess when I'm least likely to be working!
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Re: Trucks Do Not Have Cyclist-Obscuring Blind Spots

Postby Vorpal » 11 Jan 2019, 8:19pm

I'm sure that some people would pay for convenience, whilst others would rather save money, if offered a discount for a delivery time that is more convenient for the delivery firm.
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Re: Trucks Do Not Have Cyclist-Obscuring Blind Spots

Postby reohn2 » 11 Jan 2019, 8:26pm

mjr wrote:
reohn2 wrote:I'll leave it at that,we disagree 'nough said.

I buy groceries online and don't often care when they arrive on a given day, as long as I know when, so we clearly exist! To be frank, it'd be nice to have concern for my local environment as a reason for picking a timeslot, instead of trying to guess when I'm least likely to be working!

People pick a time slot to fit in with their schedule,like you do.
If you're not there the groceries don't get delivered,so you choose your time slot when you are at home,you don't go checking if your time slot fits in with other customers in the neighbourhood,like they don't with yours.
You pick your items and are offered a choice of time slots if non fit in with your schedule you make other arrangements,it's not rocket science.
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Re: Trucks Do Not Have Cyclist-Obscuring Blind Spots

Postby reohn2 » 11 Jan 2019, 8:30pm

Vorpal wrote:I'm sure that some people would pay for convenience, whilst others would rather save money, if offered a discount for a delivery time that is more convenient for the delivery firm.

Only if the money saving outweighs the inconvenience.If say delivery costs £5 and they offer a a £3 reduction for a given slot it's then upto the you,but a £3 saving or even a £5 saving isn't much on a £ 100 shopping bill,and I very much doubt it'd more than a portion of delivery cost.
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Re: Trucks Do Not Have Cyclist-Obscuring Blind Spots

Postby Vorpal » 11 Jan 2019, 8:50pm

reohn2 wrote:
Vorpal wrote:I'm sure that some people would pay for convenience, whilst others would rather save money, if offered a discount for a delivery time that is more convenient for the delivery firm.

Only if the money saving outweighs the inconvenience.If say delivery costs £5 and they offer a a £3 reduction for a given slot it's then upto the you,but a £3 saving or even a £5 saving isn't much on a £ 100 shopping bill,and I very much doubt it'd more than a portion of delivery cost.

Obviously any supermarkets & delivery firms would have to do cost benefit analysis, but I would think that the discount would have to be rather more substantial than that, and may require some government incentives to make it work.
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Re: Trucks Do Not Have Cyclist-Obscuring Blind Spots

Postby [XAP]Bob » 11 Jan 2019, 9:20pm

reohn2 wrote:
Vorpal wrote:I'm sure that some people would pay for convenience, whilst others would rather save money, if offered a discount for a delivery time that is more convenient for the delivery firm.

Only if the money saving outweighs the inconvenience.If say delivery costs £5 and they offer a a £3 reduction for a given slot it's then upto the you,but a £3 saving or even a £5 saving isn't much on a £ 100 shopping bill,and I very much doubt it'd more than a portion of delivery cost.

How many weeks shopping is that?
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Re: Trucks Do Not Have Cyclist-Obscuring Blind Spots

Postby mjr » 11 Jan 2019, 9:56pm

Vorpal wrote:
reohn2 wrote:Only if the money saving outweighs the inconvenience.If say delivery costs £5 and they offer a a £3 reduction for a given slot it's then upto the you,but a £3 saving or even a £5 saving isn't much on a £ 100 shopping bill,and I very much doubt it'd more than a portion of delivery cost.

Obviously any supermarkets & delivery firms would have to do cost benefit analysis, but I would think that the discount would have to be rather more substantial than that, and may require some government incentives to make it work.

Seriously? If I'm here from 10 until 4 anyway, I don't care which hour and will probably take whichever's cheaper.
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Re: Trucks Do Not Have Cyclist-Obscuring Blind Spots

Postby Vorpal » 11 Jan 2019, 10:14pm

mjr wrote:
Vorpal wrote:
reohn2 wrote:Only if the money saving outweighs the inconvenience.If say delivery costs £5 and they offer a a £3 reduction for a given slot it's then upto the you,but a £3 saving or even a £5 saving isn't much on a £ 100 shopping bill,and I very much doubt it'd more than a portion of delivery cost.

Obviously any supermarkets & delivery firms would have to do cost benefit analysis, but I would think that the discount would have to be rather more substantial than that, and may require some government incentives to make it work.

Seriously? If I'm here from 10 until 4 anyway, I don't care which hour and will probably take whichever's cheaper.

Not that many people are home during the day.
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Re: Trucks Do Not Have Cyclist-Obscuring Blind Spots

Postby mjr » 11 Jan 2019, 10:33pm

Vorpal wrote:Not that many people are home during the day.

They are on day offs, which is better to get shopping delivered. Also, same thing often applies for the fewer evening slots.
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
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Re: Trucks Do Not Have Cyclist-Obscuring Blind Spots

Postby Tangled Metal » 11 Jan 2019, 11:40pm

If you think DHL are bad then parcel force won't be too your liking.

A couple of postie friends once told me that the parcelforce drivers in their delivery patch are dodgy as hell. They collect their packages from the same royal mail DO as the royal mail posties and deliver to the same areas. This allows for a few short cuts for them.

The first thing they do is offload as much of v their packages into the normal royal mail delivery piles.

The second is to hide other parcels to be delivered to put off the way places. In their patch there's a few remote farms for example.

Third thing is they have a favourite layby that they take breaks at. However these breaks often operate as hiding out to avoid making deliveries. If they run out of time to make their deliveries they can offload them to other drivers or to royal mail.

Fourth dodge is to throw the parcels they don't want to deliver in the bin at that layby or even over the wall there. The local DO manager got a complaint when a package didn't arrive. He hopled into his car and drove to that layby. He found all the missing packages in and around the bin. He put them in his car and delivered them himself. No action taken against the drivers.

Royal mail posties get vetted for security and offences. They also have standards of behaviour! Postie friends have told me that parcelforce don't have this vetting process so they are often staffed by sacked royal mail workers. As you can tell posties don't like parcelforce workers.

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Re: Trucks Do Not Have Cyclist-Obscuring Blind Spots

Postby The utility cyclist » 12 Jan 2019, 3:05am

MikeF wrote:The real issue is that cyclists and lorries (motor vehicles) should not be using or trying to use the same piece of road (highway) space. People will make mistakes, but these mistakes should not lead to injury.


Don't agree, I'm comfortable with HGVs for the most part, I have far fewer issues than with cars/vans, massively so, even taking into account overall their % of vehicles on the road.
I first started commuting in 1987 as a teen, 5 miles into the city centre and passing straight down the middle of a major industrial area on an arterial route. Train people well enough, have people continually thinking and assessing and their 'mistakes' are very infrequent, they should also be at a level that because of the care and attention and leeway they've given that it won't physically harm someone even if the other (vulnerable) person does make an error in judgement. Pretty much what the bike riding HGV driver does.

The sick thing about most HGV incidents with people on bikes, in fact a significant proportion of all KSIs, is that police are bias, discriminatory and unable or unwilling to apply the law and the rules that they apply elsewhere. Put themselves in that same situation and the attitude would be totally the opposite. Frankly these people are no longer fit for purpose in assessing RTCs, not when they display such poor judgement and understanding.
This dereliction of duty quite literally punishes all people riding bikes, indeed pedestrians too.

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Re: Trucks Do Not Have Cyclist-Obscuring Blind Spots

Postby pwa » 12 Jan 2019, 10:53am

All this talk about keeping HGVs and cyclists apart is only relevant in big towns and cities and on major arterial roads. It isn't relevant to me in my village or in the small towns nearby. The cycle network and the network for HGVs is and will remain the same, except for a few urban roads that have been made into cul-de-sacs for motor traffic.

My worry is that unsuitable narrow footways alongside roads will have the cycle symbol painted on them, putting pressure on me to abandon the fast road descents I have used for decades and slow down to share a totally unsuitable footpath with pedestrians, giving way at every side road. Few local roads have space at the side for a real new cycle way, so a stupid paint effort is the only thing that could be done. I'd stop using the bike in protest.

I know you can ignore unsuitable facilities, but that is what we will be given here if there is a concerted effort for traffic free routes where there is a shortage of money. And the existence of rubbish facilities does embolden a minority of anti-bike motorists.

I am sharing roads with HGVs now and I will be for the rest of my life, unless I stop cycling. I am interested in anything that makes the best of that less than perfect reality.

Thinking back over more than fifty years of cycling on roads, I have had no very worrying incidents with HGVs. None in fifty plus years that I have been aware of. There may have been some going on behind me that I haven't seen, but none that I have noticed. Grannies in cars have scared me a few times, and dopey caravan towers.

This is not to deny the real dangers that exist on city streets when HGVs and cyclists share spaces, but that isn't the cycling that I do. I'll leave the city street situation for others to talk about.
Last edited by pwa on 12 Jan 2019, 11:04am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Trucks Do Not Have Cyclist-Obscuring Blind Spots

Postby reohn2 » 12 Jan 2019, 11:01am

[XAP]Bob wrote:
reohn2 wrote:
Vorpal wrote:I'm sure that some people would pay for convenience, whilst others would rather save money, if offered a discount for a delivery time that is more convenient for the delivery firm.

Only if the money saving outweighs the inconvenience.If say delivery costs £5 and they offer a a £3 reduction for a given slot it's then upto the you,but a £3 saving or even a £5 saving isn't much on a £ 100 shopping bill,and I very much doubt it'd more than a portion of delivery cost.

How many weeks shopping is that?

OK then a £50 shopping bill.
Shopping bill for two of us is £70 per week at Sainsburys,a family of four say,would be considerably more I think.
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Re: Trucks Do Not Have Cyclist-Obscuring Blind Spots

Postby reohn2 » 12 Jan 2019, 11:04am

mjr wrote:
Vorpal wrote:
reohn2 wrote:Only if the money saving outweighs the inconvenience.If say delivery costs £5 and they offer a a £3 reduction for a given slot it's then upto the you,but a £3 saving or even a £5 saving isn't much on a £ 100 shopping bill,and I very much doubt it'd more than a portion of delivery cost.

Obviously any supermarkets & delivery firms would have to do cost benefit analysis, but I would think that the discount would have to be rather more substantial than that, and may require some government incentives to make it work.

Seriously? If I'm here from 10 until 4 anyway, I don't care which hour and will probably take whichever's cheaper.

But you're only one household,the discussion is about coordinating multiple households time schedules which isn't so simple whose reasons are varied and many,and all to save the households £3(?) a week.
It doesn't stack up.
Last edited by reohn2 on 12 Jan 2019, 11:17am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Trucks Do Not Have Cyclist-Obscuring Blind Spots

Postby reohn2 » 12 Jan 2019, 11:06am

mjr wrote:
Vorpal wrote:Not that many people are home during the day.

They are on day offs, which is better to get shopping delivered. Also, same thing often applies for the fewer evening slots.

Not all people have the same days off and many people work shifts.
What's a simple thing for one household isn't when many are in the mix
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