What can we learn from LSBTIQ* campaigns?

brynpoeth
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What can we learn from LSBTIQ* campaigns?

Postby brynpoeth » 7 Jul 2019, 12:18pm

Gay Pride events are held all over, seems they have achieved quite a bit, nearly all (many?) politicians support them, legislation has been enacted but there is more to do
A 'minority' group like cyclists, the difference: many more politicians claim to be cyclists but many claim not to be gay

What can we learn from successes of the gay rights lobby?
Last edited by brynpoeth on 26 Jul 2019, 5:51pm, edited 1 time in total.
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landsurfer
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Re: What can we learn from LGBTx campaigns?

Postby landsurfer » 7 Jul 2019, 12:32pm

You'll have to try harder .... we're not falling for this trap ..... :roll:
Be a do'er, not a watcher.
Be a Sceaphierde, not a Sheep.
Mike Hall, Jenny Graham .. Respect. ....

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brynpoeth
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Re: What can we learn from LGBTx campaigns?

Postby brynpoeth » 7 Jul 2019, 12:40pm

landsurfer wrote:You'll have to try harder .... we're not falling for this trap ..... :roll:

Please to explain what you mean, trap?
I think cyclists and gays as minority groups can learn from each other
Are you a minority group member as an Ulsterperson in GoC?
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Cunobelin
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Re: What can we learn from LGBTx campaigns?

Postby Cunobelin » 7 Jul 2019, 12:53pm

You mean we should call ourselves


RTSFTCRU

(Roadie, Tourer, Shopper, Folder, Commuter, Recumbent, Utility)

Sorry - misses out unicyclists and School Run, so for all those I missed, would you accept :

RTSFTCRU +

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Mick F
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Re: What can we learn from LGBTx campaigns?

Postby Mick F » 7 Jul 2019, 3:25pm

Cunobelin wrote:You mean we should call ourselves


RTSFTCRU

(Roadie, Tourer, Shopper, Folder, Commuter, Recumbent, Utility)

Sorry - misses out unicyclists and School Run, so for all those I missed, would you accept :

RTSFTCRU +
+1
Mick F. Cornwall

Tangled Metal
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Re: What can we learn from LGBTx campaigns?

Postby Tangled Metal » 7 Jul 2019, 10:09pm

Critical mass events where cyclists meet to raise awareness of their issues. Is that not a little bit pride march in style?

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Wanlock Dod
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Re: What can we learn from LGBTx campaigns?

Postby Wanlock Dod » 8 Jul 2019, 1:39pm

brynpoeth wrote:...What can we learn from successes of the gay rights lobby?

I think that such comparisons are confounded somewhat by the fact that an “attack” on someone riding a bike, which may result in death, can often be explained away as an accident with “Sorry mate I didn’t see you” by the attacker. I’m not sure that there is anything comparable to that as an excuse for raping a woman or beating a gay person to death.
That’s not to say that there isn’t anything that can be learned from such movements, but that making real progress might be even more difficult.

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Re: What can we learn from LGBTx campaigns?

Postby fastpedaller » 8 Jul 2019, 3:25pm

Wanlock Dod wrote:
brynpoeth wrote:...What can we learn from successes of the gay rights lobby?

I think that such comparisons are confounded somewhat by the fact that an “attack” on someone riding a bike, which may result in death, can often be explained away as an accident with “Sorry mate I didn’t see you” by the attacker. I’m not sure that there is anything comparable to that as an excuse for raping a woman or beating a gay person to death.
That’s not to say that there isn’t anything that can be learned from such movements, but that making real progress might be even more difficult.


Agreed - and we have the over-riding thinking which comes from society and (more importantly the Courts) that despite sometimes multiple motoring offences, the offender has 'a right to drive a car', as if a train, bus or cycle would not be acceptable. There is also the twisted logic that because people are just 'going about their daily journey' that excuses their negligence/recklessness, where in other circumstances they would face a much harsher sentence.

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Re: What can we learn from LGBTx campaigns?

Postby GranvilleThomas » 8 Jul 2019, 5:46pm

The problem is of course that if you are a member of the LGBT community or are a Muslim or a Jew or a Sikh other religious denomination or are disabled or pregnant, then any form of discrimination or prejudicial behaviour is deemed to be illegal in part due to the 'Equality Act 2010' (as it should be, obviously!)

However anyone who listens to some of the speech based radio stations for example, on a regular basis such as Radio5 Live, LBC and Talkradio will hear anti cyclist and anti cycling comments from presenters on an almost daily basis.

Obviously this is all the usual stuff about ignoring red lights and riding down the middle of the road and cycling on the pavement etc and of course cyclist are seen as 'fare game' in this respect.

In talk radio circles, the topic of cycling have become the new 'dog mess on the pavement' or 'parking fines' subject where lazy presenters know they will attract callers if they are not getting many if they talk about these subjects.

A presenter on Talkradio was recently sacked for making what was deemed to be an anti Semitic comment on Twitter and another was sacked from 5live for a supposedly racist post, again on twitter, but it seems to be OK to encourage what I consider to be incitement to violence against cyclists on a regular basis, not just on the radio but in some of the daily newspapers as well as on social media.

In case you don't know, the 9 characteristics that are protected by the Equality Act 2010 are:

age
disability
gender reassignment
marriage or civil partnership (in employment only)
pregnancy and maternity
race
religion or belief
sex
sexual orientation

See, not a cyclist in sight, nor is there likely to be, unless something changes!

For 10 years I was an advisor for the Health and Safety Executive (HSE) and I regularly received communications from people who worked in the construction industry who wanted to know why Sikh's were exempt from having to wear a hard hat on a construction site, or a helmet whilst riding a motor bike?

Well obviously it's for religious reasons and the fact that they wear a Turban, but the reason it became UK law was because the 'Sikh Council UK' organised a massive campaign (in the 80's I think it was) and lobbied parliament so much that eventually laws were passed protecting Sikh's religious rights in this respect (and why not!)

Will this type of thing ever happen for cyclists, will we become the 10th protected characteristic in the Equality Act any time soon? I think you will probably agree that it is very unlikely. We just don't have the influence or status to lobby Parliament adequately to make the changes required.

Maybe we need a high profile cyclist to become an MP or even become Prime Minister, perhaps we should contact Geraint Thomas (he seems like a nice chap) and persuade him to show an interest in Politics?

Personally I think the motoring industry and community has far too many irons in the fire and far too many Parliamentary influences and cyclists have become the perfect 'outgroup' for people to direct their anger at because of the awfulness of their feeble existence, for there to be any light at the end of the tunnel in the foreseeable future, but hopefully i'm wrong, only time will tell.

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Re: What can we learn from LGBTx campaigns?

Postby fastpedaller » 8 Jul 2019, 7:09pm

So whilst at the National Road Race championship recently it was told by a dog-walker "You people should be off the road - I'll happily knock you down" it was a good job I didn't call him a "Stupid Old Fool and an advert for euthanasia" otherwise it would have been me that was locked up! Instead I just calmly asked him what his problem was, (it would appear an imminent stroke if he didn't calm down :shock: ) and another bystander said "you handled that well, I think I'd have punched him"

landsurfer
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Re: What can we learn from LGBTx campaigns?

Postby landsurfer » 8 Jul 2019, 8:56pm

"What can we learn from LGBTx campaigns?"

What can we learn ? How minorities can force their political agenda on the majority using fear and threats as a weapon.
How a tiny, unrepresentative percent of the population, less than 1% can use the law to threaten the other 99% and be supported by those who fear standing up for the majority.
Rotherham Syndrome .. all over again ...

What can we learn ? ..... to find our own way ... this is one bandwagon we should be happy we have missed ....
Be a do'er, not a watcher.
Be a Sceaphierde, not a Sheep.
Mike Hall, Jenny Graham .. Respect. ....

The Road Goes On Forever

Tangled Metal
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Re: What can we learn from LGBTx campaigns?

Postby Tangled Metal » 8 Jul 2019, 9:30pm

You could argue that apart from civil partnerships (in employment only) am those are some part of you that you could arguably not change. You can't change race, gender (is sex the right term not gender? Unless you go through reorientation which is kind of the same part of you that can't be changed), disability, etc.

Some might argue you can change religion but others argue if you truly believe in it then you can't change your religion.

Cycling you can choose not to do one day to the next. Many do such as the commuters that come out in the good weather but dissappear when summer rains come.

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Re: What can we learn from LGBTx campaigns?

Postby Bmblbzzz » 8 Jul 2019, 10:41pm

Cunobelin wrote:You mean we should call ourselves


RTSFTCRU

(Roadie, Tourer, Shopper, Folder, Commuter, Recumbent, Utility)

Sorry - misses out unicyclists and School Run, so for all those I missed, would you accept :

RTSFTCRU +

STUFCRRT!

brynpoeth
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Re: What can we learn from LGBTx campaigns?

Postby brynpoeth » 9 Jul 2019, 5:11am

Tangled Metal wrote:Critical mass events where cyclists meet to raise awareness of their issues. Is that not a little bit pride march in style?

There is a critical mass event in my small town, went to watch once but I am too scared to join in
It is just tokenism

There is a Gay Parade once a year, plus a whole week of events
A policeperson explained that she loved being on duty for the parade, everybody was friendly, there was no trouble, she had nothing to do
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Wanlock Dod
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Re: What can we learn from LGBTx campaigns?

Postby Wanlock Dod » 9 Jul 2019, 6:05am

brynpoeth wrote:What can we learn from successes of the gay rights lobby?

I think that one thing that we can learn from the LGBT+ movement is that by standing together with other groups with similar issues it is possible to make a much bigger impact. The whole issue here is that it is not just gay people making a stand, they have joined forces with all of the other groups that are viewed as outside of mainstream sexuality and are both stronger and more effective together.

People who ride bikes should join forces with any other groups who might share our aims, such as pedestrians, disabled people, air pollution campaigners, the liveable cities movement, people affected by road crimes, those suffering from noise pollution etc. to come together with a single and consistent message about better and safer conditions on the roads in our cities. So far I don’t see this happening to a sufficient extent to make any of the issues which these types of groups are concerned about heard above the constant din of motorised traffic and their lobbyists.