School run anyone?

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[XAP]Bob
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Re: School run anyone?

Postby [XAP]Bob » 2 Jul 2020, 2:16pm

One of the families at my primary school has always walked.. I never quite worked out how far, but I used to see them whilst cycling to work and it was at least a mile and a half each way - from ager 4-5.

"miles" isn't a long way - shorter than a mile it's probably not worth getting the bike out.

How many kids go to a school that is more than 5 miles away from their house? That's 30 minutes of leisurely paced riding each way, which shouldn't be beyond the typical secondary student (primary schools should be even closer).

It's relevant to me because MiniBob is going to 2ry school this year, and the discussions around how she will make that trip are interesting - it's just shy of two miles, but some of the roads are made particularly unfriendly by inconsiderate motorists.
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
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Mike Sales
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Re: School run anyone?

Postby Mike Sales » 2 Jul 2020, 2:17pm

Nobody has mentioned the school bus.
I went to my secondary school by bus for most of my attendance.
School buses still run to secondaries in both of the nearby towns from this village.
I sometimes cycled, but of course roads were a lot safer then, less traffic.
Most villages had a primary school too. Many have been closed now, to save money. But the decision did not account for the time and money parents spend getting the children there, or the costs to society of the school run traffic.
The traffic which makes unattended walking or cycling to school too dangerous has a large proportion of driving to school.

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[XAP]Bob
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Re: School run anyone?

Postby [XAP]Bob » 2 Jul 2020, 2:20pm

atlas_shrugged wrote:Walking or cycling to most schools is completely viable. Anything under 10 miles each way should be possible for school kids.

What I might agree with (although the OP did not say) is that many of the trips would be very dangerous to cycle because of motor vehicles.


I think ten miles is probably a little excessive as a daily commute for a student... the day is long enough without adding 90-120 minutes of journeying on top (mind you many kids travel that long by bus).

Anyone with a long school commute probably has a bus option... many of which are paid for by the council if you live sufficiently far from the nearest suitable/available school.
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.

atoz
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Re: School run anyone?

Postby atoz » 2 Jul 2020, 2:35pm

atlas_shrugged wrote:Walking or cycling to most schools is completely viable. Anything under 10 miles each way should be possible for school kids.

What I might agree with (although the OP did not say) is that many of the trips would be very dangerous to cycle because of motor vehicles.


The local kids at our primary school walk there, as they live in our village. The local roads are very busy at peak, not recommended for rookie cyclists. My own work journey (8 miles) is now impossible by bike due to cut throat traffic. Sadly I am not convinced lots of kids and students will be riding to school and college in our locality

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Re: School run anyone?

Postby mjr » 2 Jul 2020, 3:25pm

Mike Sales wrote:Nobody has mentioned the school bus.
I went to my secondary school by bus for most of my attendance.

As I've mentioned before, the unpredictability of the school bus, getting stuck in the nearby city's car-commuters, is a key factor in why I started cycling further. My father worked in a factory across the road from the school, so showed me the ropes. That factory was bought by a transnational and closed and the roads are busier, but the traffic is still awful, so I wonder what happens there now. Probably the bus is cancelled in some "austerity" because it was 2.9 miles village edge to school.
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Oldjohnw
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Re: School run anyone?

Postby Oldjohnw » 2 Jul 2020, 4:01pm

In 1965 there were 10m cars on UK roads. By 2010 there were 35m. A factor parents may bear in mind.

Post 16 year olds in this area who don't do A levels mostly have a 100 mile round trip to a college.

My son never had less than 10 miles each way to school. Perhaps not typical but showing once again that everyone's circumstances are different. In our case neither mindset nor middle class choice came into it. These were the nearest schools.
John

Mike Sales
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Re: School run anyone?

Postby Mike Sales » 2 Jul 2020, 4:15pm

mjr wrote:
Mike Sales wrote:Nobody has mentioned the school bus.
I went to my secondary school by bus for most of my attendance.

As I've mentioned before, the unpredictability of the school bus, getting stuck in the nearby city's car-commuters, is a key factor in why I started cycling further. My father worked in a factory across the road from the school, so showed me the ropes. That factory was bought by a transnational and closed and the roads are busier, but the traffic is still awful, so I wonder what happens there now. Probably the bus is cancelled in some "austerity" because it was 2.9 miles village edge to school.


Sorry, I missed that bus mention.
A bike was a good alternative, but choosing to go by car because the bus is held up by traffic seems an odd choice for parents to make.

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Re: School run anyone?

Postby mattsccm » 2 Jul 2020, 8:50pm

The primary school that I work at has 55 kids from 4 to 11. Country village and there are 4 kids that walk to school. The rest live in the surrounding villages and towns. 2 miles minimum.Sadly the long hills either way would preclude all but the keenest cyclists. Country roads with not even a verge makes walking lethal. As many/most of these kids have either young siblings in tow or in the infant classes I suggest that realistically cycling or walking isn't an option. As much as anything the parents would then have to ride home and get the car out to go to work. Driving makes much more sense.
Of course in a city things may be different but Clarke Gable had the best answer for that as far as I am concerned. :D

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Re: School run anyone?

Postby Mike Sales » 2 Jul 2020, 8:54pm

mattsccm wrote:Country roads with not even a verge makes walking lethal.

The roads themselves are fine of course. The danger comes from the drivers.

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Re: School run anyone?

Postby Bmblbzzz » 2 Jul 2020, 8:59pm

mattsccm wrote:Of course in a city things may be different but Clarke Gable had the best answer for that as far as I am concerned. :D

Or was it John Denver?

(Seriously, no idea what Clarke Gable might have said about cities.)

Tangled Metal
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Re: School run anyone?

Postby Tangled Metal » 2 Jul 2020, 9:04pm

In the real world that makes no difference. It still makes it unsafe to use for young children whether cycling or walking.

Out of curiosity, what's the Danish or Dutch response? Would they say the road isn't unsafe is the drivers or perhaps provide safe provision for non motorized transportation? Basically I suspect those countries prefer the option of providing date options rather than trying to make drivers safer. Unfortunately our countryside isn't really the place for that hence more car use or public transport if there is any.

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Re: School run anyone?

Postby mjr » 2 Jul 2020, 9:34pm

Mike Sales wrote:Sorry, I missed that bus mention.

Wasn't in this discussion, so no worries. I was merely excusing me repeating an old post!
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Re: School run anyone?

Postby mjr » 2 Jul 2020, 9:37pm

Tangled Metal wrote:Basically I suspect those countries prefer the option of providing [safe] options rather than trying to make drivers safer. Unfortunately our countryside isn't really the place for that hence more car use or public transport if there is any.

How is our countryside any less the place for safe walking and cycling than in those other countries? Just because it's governed by short term idiots?
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gaz
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Re: School run anyone?

Postby gaz » 2 Jul 2020, 11:16pm

Mike Sales wrote:Nobody has mentioned the school bus.

Distancing due to Covid-19 currently reduces public transport capacity to about 15% of normal. In 2014 more secondary school pupils went to/from school by bus than by car.

Mini-me passed his Bikeability at primary. He showed no interest in cycling to secondary, about 4 miles of murder-strip alongside a 50mph road leading to a large 40mph roundabout and a final mile choked with school run traffic.

Bus1.png
What mode will those bus trips shift to?

Bus2.png
Can the infrastructure cope?

Following decades of 'encouraging' rather than 'enabling' cycling no amount of hi-vis and helmets will keep children walking or cycling to school safe from frustrated careless drivers on a dark winter's morning/evening.
2020 : To redundancy ... and beyond!

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Re: School run anyone?

Postby mjr » 2 Jul 2020, 11:38pm

And British parents haven't got the guts to demand government "Stop Murdering Our Children". Instead, they'll keep helping murder their children and everyone else by putting them in cars. :-(
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