£220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

reohn2
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Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Postby reohn2 » 22 Jan 2018, 1:33pm

Tangled Metal wrote:
brynpoeth wrote:
reohn2 wrote:If the cap fits :wink:


Do we have a tory, a nasty tory on here?
Willy Whitelaw was a nice tory from up there, I think he had a moderating influence on SWMBO Thatcher :)

I'm no more nasty than the Lefties are. Just another human being making their way in life. It's just easier to take the nasty tory tag than argue sometimes. It's all just opinions afterall.

All the nice politicians left the house of commons years ago. Well I suppose Tim Farron is nice but not sure I know of any other nice MPs.


Wait a minute,it was you who attributed the title of 'nasty tory' to yourself,all I did was agree with your definition,upto that point we were discussing car parking,you dragged politricks into it.
Sheesh,make your mind up
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Tangled Metal
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Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Postby Tangled Metal » 22 Jan 2018, 3:27pm

First off I not attributing nasty tory comment as something directed at me. It was a tongue in cheek poking of fun at myself whilst mirroring the nasty tory comment that's been often bandied about to tories in Westminster. I didn't accuse anyone of using it directed at me. It was just that anyone with strong feelings that ppl including nhs workers should be self reliant with regards to a wide variety of topics rather than relying on handouts, subsidies and perks on top of pay is often labelled nasty and tory.

As for parking, have you thought that a lot of ppl working on private sector don't get subsidized or free parking. It's a perk because employers are well within their rights to charge the going rate for parking.

I find it amusing that big public sector employers like hospitals feel the need to cave in under pressure when they try to charge even a small amount for parking. And unions and employees seem so bothered by loss of free parking. There's so much going wrong in the nhs and they would rather complain about parking fees.

As for betting about what I do now, well let's just say it wasn't so long ago I did 17 hours straight then rode home early morning after 1am. Manual work too. Yes I'm an office worker but in manufacturing so often I just get stuck in with shopfloor for rush orders. I value highly the principle of being in a team and that's the way with our whole management too (well almost all).

As for 60 year olds working long shifts. We've got about 8% 60 or older. Not one can't manage 12 hours plus manual work. In some cases they'll walk home (a mile + in one case) too. Exceptional ppl I reckon. Although in the history of the company not. Oldest was late 80s, reduced hours fortunately.

Whatever the case, how many 60 year old nurses are there anyway? Also, are you saying a public sector employer is going to leave an older employee to do more than they can manage? I doubt there's really a big issue over age or getting to work. It's just convenience of using cars. If parking fees were forced through they'd pay or take other transport options. It's at least a case of ppl using cars hating to pay for parking. I think every b driver has had that feeling before.

pwa
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Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Postby pwa » 22 Jan 2018, 3:34pm

There was a news item a few days ago about nurses choosing to leave the NHS because of the stresses of the job. The NHS is having difficulty retaining and recruiting staff. Does anyone think that requiring staff to pay for parking won't make things worse?

Tangled Metal
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Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Postby Tangled Metal » 22 Jan 2018, 3:45pm

Undoubtedly it won't help but they should focus on the causes of stress. Carparking is at worst a very small part of any decision to leave. They need to address the key causes of them leaving. Do you really think free carparking will keep them in the nhs?

reohn2
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Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Postby reohn2 » 22 Jan 2018, 3:55pm

Tangled Metal wrote:Undoubtedly it won't help but they should focus on the causes of stress. Carparking is at worst a very small part of any decision to leave. They need to address the key causes of them leaving. Do you really think free carparking will keep them in the nhs?

Ever heard the story of the camel and some straws?
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pwa
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Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Postby pwa » 22 Jan 2018, 3:59pm

Tangled Metal wrote:Undoubtedly it won't help but they should focus on the causes of stress. Carparking is at worst a very small part of any decision to leave. They need to address the key causes of them leaving. Do you really think free carparking will keep them in the nhs?


I think telling your staff that you are going to charge them to park in the car park outside your building is a good way to demotivate them, and convince them that you are not on their side.

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[XAP]Bob
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Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Postby [XAP]Bob » 22 Jan 2018, 4:29pm

I cycled to my last hospital appointment - 12 miles away.

I'm not suggesting that that should be normal, but between the hospital site entrance and the point at which the incoming road has a dedicated bus/ambulance lane (a few hundred yards) I overtook multiple ambulances (not with blue lights on) and several busses.
When I have driven there I have left an additional hour, and still been late.

Cycling there, I was a bit early (but not too much, cycling time is predictable in a way that driving isn't), and was actually seen and out of my appointment before my appointment time.

There were, as usual, no motor vehicle spaces left (hence the stupid queues). The cycle racks *right by the front door* were completely empty.
It would have been a bit easier with a cycle lane alongside the 'entrance road', but actually there were only two vehicles I had to wait for in any way (a bus turning in, and a delivery lorry)...


There were no busses at the dedicated bus stop by the hospital...
There is *no* alternative access, other than the air ambulance...

This is just horribly bad planning - if nothing else the busses and ambulances should have their own access for safety and sanity.

But the state of parking... it's horrible. I spent a few weeks having to go regularly when MiniBob was born. SCBU was brilliant - parking was a nightmare (and with a wife who had recently undergone major surgery was really the only viable means of transport...)
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.

reohn2
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Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Postby reohn2 » 22 Jan 2018, 4:33pm

Tangled Metal wrote:First off I not attributing nasty tory comment as something directed at me. It was a tongue in cheek poking of fun at myself whilst mirroring the nasty tory comment that's been often bandied about to tories in Westminster. I didn't accuse anyone of using it directed at me. It was just that anyone with strong feelings that ppl including nhs workers should be self reliant with regards to a wide variety of topics rather than relying on handouts, subsidies and perks on top of pay is often labelled nasty and tory.

As for parking, have you thought that a lot of ppl working on private sector don't get subsidized or free parking. It's a perk because employers are well within their rights to charge the going rate for parking.

I find it amusing that big public sector employers like hospitals feel the need to cave in under pressure when they try to charge even a small amount for parking. And unions and employees seem so bothered by loss of free parking. There's so much going wrong in the nhs and they would rather complain about parking fees.

As for betting about what I do now, well let's just say it wasn't so long ago I did 17 hours straight then rode home early morning after 1am. Manual work too. Yes I'm an office worker but in manufacturing so often I just get stuck in with shopfloor for rush orders. I value highly the principle of being in a team and that's the way with our whole management too (well almost all).

As for 60 year olds working long shifts. We've got about 8% 60 or older. Not one can't manage 12 hours plus manual work. In some cases they'll walk home (a mile + in one case) too. Exceptional ppl I reckon. Although in the history of the company not. Oldest was late 80s, reduced hours fortunately.

Whatever the case, how many 60 year old nurses are there anyway? Also, are you saying a public sector employer is going to leave an older employee to do more than they can manage? I doubt there's really a big issue over age or getting to work. It's just convenience of using cars. If parking fees were forced through they'd pay or take other transport options. It's at least a case of ppl using cars hating to pay for parking. I think every b driver has had that feeling before.


You brought up politricks,with a snide boomerang comment :wink:

I mentioned 50 to 60 year old nurses with regards to transport and being charged unnecessarily for parking in the sense that life's hard enough and nursing can be a stressful job,to say there's no big issue with manual work older workers is bonkers,I've had two workmates in there late 50's die in my arms whilst at work.

Your last point about forcing through parking fees,it seems to me that many things being forced through onto NHS staff is having a devastating effect on nurses and other NHS staff not least no pay rises for the past five years as part of the government's austerity plan,yet the same government can give big tax cuts to the highest earnerns.

I'm beginning to repeat myself to a deaf ear so I'll leave it at that.
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reohn2
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Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Postby reohn2 » 22 Jan 2018, 4:38pm

pwa wrote:
Tangled Metal wrote:Undoubtedly it won't help but they should focus on the causes of stress. Carparking is at worst a very small part of any decision to leave. They need to address the key causes of them leaving. Do you really think free carparking will keep them in the nhs?


I think telling your staff that you are going to charge them to park in the car park outside your building is a good way to demotivate them, and convince them that you are not on their side.

Spot on,It doesn't help one bit.
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PH
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Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Postby PH » 22 Jan 2018, 5:22pm

pwa wrote:
Tangled Metal wrote:Undoubtedly it won't help but they should focus on the causes of stress. Carparking is at worst a very small part of any decision to leave. They need to address the key causes of them leaving. Do you really think free carparking will keep them in the nhs?


I think telling your staff that you are going to charge them to park in the car park outside your building is a good way to demotivate them, and convince them that you are not on their side.

The other side of that is the expectation that an employer should obtain land and give it over for free to one form of transport for their employees. I don't understand how anyone could not see that as a perk, where's the incentive to find alternatives?

reohn2
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Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Postby reohn2 » 22 Jan 2018, 5:54pm

PH wrote:
pwa wrote:
Tangled Metal wrote:Undoubtedly it won't help but they should focus on the causes of stress. Carparking is at worst a very small part of any decision to leave. They need to address the key causes of them leaving. Do you really think free carparking will keep them in the nhs?


I think telling your staff that you are going to charge them to park in the car park outside your building is a good way to demotivate them, and convince them that you are not on their side.

The other side of that is the expectation that an employer should obtain land and give it over for free to one form of transport for their employees. I don't understand how anyone could not see that as a perk, where's the incentive to find alternatives?

It depends on the location of the workplace,if an employer decides to sight their premises off regular and frequent bus routes and employ people to work unsocial hours(some hospitals are situated in such places believe it or not)and employ say a hundred staff is it not reasonable for the employees to expect to be able to park their means of transport on their employer's premises without charge and not block up surrounding roads and streets?
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pwa
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Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Postby pwa » 22 Jan 2018, 6:37pm

Staff who work at Morriston Hospital, on the northern edge of Swansea, could face an enormously convoluted and impractical journey to get home by public transport, even if they only live in Swansea. Some will live in suburbs nearby and could cycle, but most won't. Add to that the funny hours they start and finish work, and the idea of trying to force them not to use their cars becomes impractical. Especially at a time when we need to be doing things to retain experienced staff, not driving them away.

Free parking at work is not unusual. Supermarket employees get it. Workers at our Ford Engine Plant get it. Ditto Tata Steel in Port Talbot. I'm not aware of an employer that charges employees for parking in their own car park.

reohn2
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Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Postby reohn2 » 22 Jan 2018, 7:21pm

pwa wrote:......... I'm not aware of an employer that charges employees for parking in their own car park.

Other than the NHS :?
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Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Postby PH » 22 Jan 2018, 7:22pm

Just to give one example - Where is the incentive to car share?
If we start with the idea that the only way to get to work is to drive, then that becomes reality.

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Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Postby PH » 22 Jan 2018, 7:22pm

reohn2 wrote:
pwa wrote:......... I'm not aware of an employer that charges employees for parking in their own car park.

Other than the NHS :?

I'm aware of plenty that don't provide free parking.