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Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Posted: 23 Jan 2018, 1:33pm
by brynpoeth
GBP 220 in 2008, how much now?

Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Posted: 23 Jan 2018, 1:36pm
by pwa
[XAP]Bob wrote:
pwa wrote:
Pete Owens wrote:If you were to ask, I'm sure someone from the Cycling UK forum might be able to suggest to you an environmentally sustainable and healthy means of transport, ideally suited to short journeys of this length. Any ideas folks?


And is that form of transport suitable for the 80 something year old lady, with her newly fitted pacemaker, who is the person I take on that journey? I'm taking my Mum down there later, by car, as I have every day for almost two weeks, for her to spend about seven hours at my Dad's bedside. He has impaired vision and finds it difficult to eat without making a mess, so she helps him.

And when I was at the hospital a few days ago I was talking to a lady aged about 60 who had two restless boys with her, both in school uniform. She was their Grannie and had picked the kids up from school. They had been expecting their Mum, but she had been rushed into hospital with a sudden illness. The boys were clearly upset. Grannie was trying to get them to see their Mum, then she was going to take them to their home to pick up spare clothes, then back to her home for the night.

This is what hospitals are about. Sick people, worried people, people in a vulnerable state. Not people to be despised for their use of what seems to them to be the easiest transport choice at a difficult time in their life. I would expect anyone to do what is easiest in such a situation, and I would not dream of putting obstacles in their way.


Pretty sure the original conversation was about staff...
Who don't fall into the above categories.

5 miles for a doctor or nurse shouldn't be inconceivable...


The thread drifted, Bob.

Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Posted: 23 Jan 2018, 1:58pm
by Cunobelin
Don’t forget the other issues

NuLabour who built PFI Hospitals where by design the car parks where part of the profit making process


“Green” policies where the amount of parking was restricted

Policies where motorway acccess was more important than being available to a local population

There are multiple issues

Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Posted: 23 Jan 2018, 2:10pm
by reohn2
Cunobelin wrote:Don’t forget the other issues

NuLabour who built PFI Hospitals where by design the car parks where part of the profit making process


“Green” policies where the amount of parking was restricted

Policies where motorway acccess was more important than being available to a local population

There are multiple issues

Agreed.

Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Posted: 23 Jan 2018, 2:45pm
by [XAP]Bob
Cunobelin wrote:Policies where motorway acccess was more important than being available to a local population

Get lower road deaths that way - because they can keep the body alive in the ambulance to let people die in a hospital...

Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Posted: 23 Jan 2018, 2:55pm
by pwa
[XAP]Bob wrote:
Cunobelin wrote:Policies where motorway acccess was more important than being available to a local population

Get lower road deaths that way - because they can keep the body alive in the ambulance to let people die in a hospital...


Look at Morriston Hospital north of Swansea. Beside the M4. It is designed to be a regional facility, with casualties / patients coming in from places quite far away, not just from Swansea. It isn't actually very conveniently positioned for the people of Swansea itself, but it was never intended to be. Its catchment is much wider and the motorway is key to its positioning.

Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Posted: 23 Jan 2018, 6:42pm
by mjr
PH wrote:
reohn2 wrote:
pwa wrote:......... I'm not aware of an employer that charges employees for parking in their own car park.

Other than the NHS :?

I'm aware of plenty that don't provide free parking.

I don't think our borough council's employees get free parking in the borough council's car parks (the three around the council head offices and the two around the town hall are public pay and displays these days) unless they're required to use their car for work (there are smaller car parks at each for official-work vehicles like the mayoral black maria), but I've not checked that recently. So yes, there's another employer that charges employees for parking in their own car park, although it's also public-sector.

Large private-sector employers around here that I can think of mostly have no car park or free car parks, but not always enough parking spaces for all workers. I suspect they only allow certain workers to park on the site, probably based on need and/or seniority.

Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Posted: 23 Jan 2018, 8:41pm
by landsurfer
Unions ....
There is a Union that is so powerful that every London Underground Train has a guy or girl sat i the front reading a book ... because the train is wholly automatic and the Union has won a place for a highly paid Drone to sit in the cab ....

But the NHS .. HAVE SUCH A PI** POOR Union that they will give way about parking fees for staff that don't even have cars .......

If i worked for the NHS i would be paying my fees to ALSEF et al ......

Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Posted: 23 Jan 2018, 9:06pm
by Mark R
I have to say I am amazed to see plenty of people arguing against employers charging for parking as if this is a fundamentally bad thing.

Its essentially a pro cycling policy isn't it?

I happen to know that our local hospital charges for parking according to the employee's pay scale. E.g. a cleaner would expect to pay less than a doctor. The car parks are still full to bursting though. Would suggest the charges are set at less than the market will bear :wink:

Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Posted: 23 Jan 2018, 9:16pm
by landsurfer
Mark R wrote:I have to say I am amazed to see plenty of people arguing against employers charging for parking as if this is a fundamentally bad thing.

Its essentially a pro cycling policy isn't it?

I happen to know that our local hospital charges for parking according to the employee's pay scale. E.g. a cleaner would expect to pay less than a doctor. The car parks are still full to bursting though. Would suggest the charges are set at less than the market will bear :wink:


I think your missing the point ... charged even if not even a car owner .....

Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Posted: 23 Jan 2018, 9:35pm
by pwa
Mark R wrote:I have to say I am amazed to see plenty of people arguing against employers charging for parking as if this is a fundamentally bad thing.

Its essentially a pro cycling policy isn't it?

I happen to know that our local hospital charges for parking according to the employee's pay scale. E.g. a cleaner would expect to pay less than a doctor. The car parks are still full to bursting though. Would suggest the charges are set at less than the market will bear :wink:


I have to correct you on one point. Being pro-cycling does not mean being anti-car driving. Not for everyone. I have known cyclists as keen on cycling as anyone here, but who also love classic cars. I've known a few who also love motorcycling. I'd like to see fewer cars on the road, but I don't assume that everyone who drives to work should be getting there another way. I don't despise everyone who drives to work. I've just returned from a hospital where the ambulances were queuing up this morning, and the staff have had a hard day. They had to re-open a ward that has not been used for months. I'd not want to be the one to tell those tired and weary people that they are going to be charged for parking at their place of underpaid work.

Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Posted: 23 Jan 2018, 9:45pm
by Mark R
Back in the day New Labour actually wanted to bring in a workplace parking levy. (For a while it did actually look like they wanted to do something about car dependency).

Of course the right wing tabloids started howling - so the proposal got quietly dropped.

Interestingly Nottingham does administer a workplace parking levy but IMO it is probably set too low to make a difference.

http://www.bettertransport.org.uk/blog/better-transport/winning-policy-nottinghams-workplace-parking-levy

charged even if not even a car owner

Simply not true. If you don't park a car there is no need to pay.

Call me a troll if you want but the fact is the countries in Europe which have achieved respectably high rates of cycling have made conscious decisions to actually disincentivise driving.

The problem here is that ALL large employers should be charging for the perk of car parking and not just a few progressive ones such as universities and the NHS.

Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Posted: 23 Jan 2018, 10:03pm
by Mark R
I'd not want to be the one to tell those tired and weary people that they are going to be charged for parking at their place of underpaid work.


Having as I do relatives who work in the NHS, I have to question the premise that they are all underpaid. Compared to those who do similar work in the private sector the pay is considerably higher.

Of course the work of NHS staff deserves the highest respect but if you are looking for an overworked, underpaid section of the workforce - focus on those staffing private nursing homes - they get a much rougher deal.

Back to hospital parking. My personal observation is that the car parks are always full to bursting and that many, many of the staff concerned could easily walk, cycle, car share, use motorcycles, use public transport etc, etc. Making a charge for parking is a disincentive to driving to work, and currently there aren't enough of those.

Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Posted: 23 Jan 2018, 10:13pm
by Bonefishblues
Mark R wrote:
I'd not want to be the one to tell those tired and weary people that they are going to be charged for parking at their place of underpaid work.


Having as I do relatives who work in the NHS, I have to question the premise that they are all underpaid. Compared to those who do similar work in the private sector the pay is considerably higher.

Of course the work of NHS staff deserves the highest respect but if you are looking for an overworked, underpaid section of the workforce - focus on those staffing private nursing homes - they get a much rougher deal.


Indeed. And with glorious irony, the truly private resident/patient actually subsidises public sector-funded residents, since Local Authorities unilaterally withold or constrain rate increases. Broken system alert (again...).

Re: £220 per year to park you car at work, the joys of the NHS.

Posted: 23 Jan 2018, 10:31pm
by reohn2
Mark R wrote:
I'd not want to be the one to tell those tired and weary people that they are going to be charged for parking at their place of underpaid work.


Having as I do relatives who work in the NHS, I have to question the premise that they are all underpaid. Compared to those who do similar work in the private sector the pay is considerably higher.

Of course the work of NHS staff deserves the highest respect but if you are looking for an overworked, underpaid section of the workforce - focus on those staffing private nursing homes - they get a much rougher deal.

Back to hospital parking. My personal observation is that the car parks are always full to bursting and that many, many of the staff concerned could easily walk, cycle, car share, use motorcycles, use public transport etc, etc. Making a charge for parking is a disincentive to driving to work, and currently there aren't enough of those.

Whilst I agree some of those who work in the private sector are underpaid,could you give details of those relatives of yours who are overpaid and under worked and the jobs they do?