Greater Manchester to get huge increase in infrastructure
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Greater Manchester to get huge increase in infrastructure
… but not if you live in Rochdale. Linky
Anyone else living in Heywood, Middleton and Rochdale annoyed about the council’s complete lack of vision?
Anyone else living in Heywood, Middleton and Rochdale annoyed about the council’s complete lack of vision?
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Re: Greater Manchester to get huge increase in infrastructure
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Re: Greater Manchester to get huge increase in infrastructure
I must admit to being a bit underwhelmed with the Manchester Bee Network plans. Obviously, any investment is better than none, but it seems there is a bit too much emphasis on purely leisure cycling over commuting and utilitarian bike use. Also, town centre infrastructure is all well and good but getting into town centres is not really considered at all in my neck of the woods and that in my experience is where all the heavy traffic build up occurs.
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Re: Greater Manchester to get huge increase in infrastructure
I agree, the RMBC reliance on the canal is a case in point - fine for a Saturday afternoon pootle, but badly surfaced, narrow, shared use and with low bridges…
- The utility cyclist
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Re: Greater Manchester to get huge increase in infrastructure
An absolute criminal waste of a massive amount of money, tries to replicate a flawed system and does it badly to boot. Still not getting the root problems, ignores a huge % of people riding bikes and as far as I can see doesn't go remotely close enough to pushing people out of motors and utilising the existing infra to create motorvehicle free routes that means les exposure to same and are direct and WIDE.
If this is the way forward by Boardman then I want nothing to do with it!
This will have such a relatively small impact on cycling numbers, is the cost benefit ratio actually worth it? One should be aiming for 4,5, 6 fold increases, it won't get double journeys over the whole area.
If this is the way forward by Boardman then I want nothing to do with it!
This will have such a relatively small impact on cycling numbers, is the cost benefit ratio actually worth it? One should be aiming for 4,5, 6 fold increases, it won't get double journeys over the whole area.
Re: Greater Manchester to get huge increase in infrastructure
The utility cyclist wrote:This will have such a relatively small impact on cycling numbers, is the cost benefit ratio actually worth it?
An earlier round had a cost:benefit ratio better than 1:5, so yes, it seems worth it.
One should be aiming for 4,5, 6 fold increases, it won't get double journeys over the whole area.
Yes, but the politicians won't do that in a single step, so for now, we must try to keep them heading forwards and increasing numbers cycling, which should mean more support which then makes them go further next time.
If you want change faster, elect politicians that are better and braver.
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
All the above is CC-By-SA and no other implied copyright license to Cycle magazine.
All the above is CC-By-SA and no other implied copyright license to Cycle magazine.
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Re: Greater Manchester to get huge increase in infrastructure
FPTP mitigates against that, especially in Greater Manchester (it wasn't that long ago that 96/97 Manchester City councillors were Lab from 60% of the vote, and the one that wasn't had been kicked out of Lab for misconduct).
In the meantime if we can shift even a proportion of the short range journeys that could be done by walking/cycling, it's a win.
Wasn't it 75% of car journeys in London were <3 miles/5 km?
In the meantime if we can shift even a proportion of the short range journeys that could be done by walking/cycling, it's a win.
Wasn't it 75% of car journeys in London were <3 miles/5 km?
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Re: Greater Manchester to get huge increase in infrastructure
Which is most beneficial, slow but steady improvement now or some big and ideal improvement some time maybe never?
In the UK we're not into big, sudden cycling facility improvements in most places so removing support for modest improvements because they're not big enough is cutting our noses off to spite our face imho.
A long while ago I got told the difference between western and Japanese quality (back when TQM was a big acronym) in a TQM uni lecture that western is a bug jump in improvement that generally happened at regular intervals. Japan had those big jumps but between them there's a steady, small step improvement.
Example given was Nissan plants around the worldinstalled robot parts delivery system. 6 weeks after they'd first got installed in the UK and Japan plant the head of quality in the UK got called into the main Japanese plant. On their walk around he noticed the robots had a brush attached to the edge. This meant the plant was cleaner in a more efficient way. Big improvement was the robot, small step was the brush. Western plants simply didn't think that same way.
Wrt cycling I think the steady, improvement is kind of the only way in most places. Get what you can and try for the big step improvement.
In the UK we're not into big, sudden cycling facility improvements in most places so removing support for modest improvements because they're not big enough is cutting our noses off to spite our face imho.
A long while ago I got told the difference between western and Japanese quality (back when TQM was a big acronym) in a TQM uni lecture that western is a bug jump in improvement that generally happened at regular intervals. Japan had those big jumps but between them there's a steady, small step improvement.
Example given was Nissan plants around the worldinstalled robot parts delivery system. 6 weeks after they'd first got installed in the UK and Japan plant the head of quality in the UK got called into the main Japanese plant. On their walk around he noticed the robots had a brush attached to the edge. This meant the plant was cleaner in a more efficient way. Big improvement was the robot, small step was the brush. Western plants simply didn't think that same way.
Wrt cycling I think the steady, improvement is kind of the only way in most places. Get what you can and try for the big step improvement.
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Re: Greater Manchester to get huge increase in infrastructure
Underwhelming wherever you live......I am totally disallusioned with the bee network but I do think Chris Boardman is excellent.....Just make sure the politicians dont get away with saying they are doing a great job for cycling.
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Re: Greater Manchester to get huge increase in infrastructure
The weakest link with the Bee Network has always been expecting local authorities to proactively propose, develop and install schemes.
As an example of how crap GM local authorities can be, even when they're being funded to do stuff, Bolton Council have been installing wand orca segregated lanes on two ~5km major roads using emergency active travel funding. Both should have been completed by the end of September and we were given repeated assurances that they would be. Yet here we are in the middle of October and one scheme is around 10% complete and the other hasn't even started. And we're being told now that one will be finished by the end of October and the other 2 weeks later, yet they're taking a full day to just burn off 300m of old paint.
So it should surprise noone that the Bee Network is getting not very far at all at a snails pace.
As an example of how crap GM local authorities can be, even when they're being funded to do stuff, Bolton Council have been installing wand orca segregated lanes on two ~5km major roads using emergency active travel funding. Both should have been completed by the end of September and we were given repeated assurances that they would be. Yet here we are in the middle of October and one scheme is around 10% complete and the other hasn't even started. And we're being told now that one will be finished by the end of October and the other 2 weeks later, yet they're taking a full day to just burn off 300m of old paint.
So it should surprise noone that the Bee Network is getting not very far at all at a snails pace.
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Re: Greater Manchester to get huge increase in infrastructure
Has Bolton council got an active travel forum?
RMBC appear to think this isn’t really their problem, and want it to be run by a third party… which then means they won’t engage.
Salford seems to be really going for it, thought.
RMBC appear to think this isn’t really their problem, and want it to be run by a third party… which then means they won’t engage.
Salford seems to be really going for it, thought.
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Re: Greater Manchester to get huge increase in infrastructure
Yes there's an active travel forum in Bolton. Without it I doubt we'd have any significant Bee Network schemes in the pipeline. There are some great people in Bolton Council, but sadly most councillors are stuck in the past and want more roads and still think that somehow just one more road will solve all the congestion problems.