Police etc Bill - proposed amendments.

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thirdcrank
Posts: 36776
Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 2:44pm

Police etc Bill - proposed amendments.

Post by thirdcrank »

I think we've discussed the Police, Crime, Sentencing and Courts Bill before in respect of demo's but it's coming up again in its tortuous trip through Parliament at the Report Stage. As well as debate on various government proposals already in the Bill, this is the opportunity for others to propose amendments and it seems there are stacks, most of which will not have a price.

Of particular interest to cycle campaigners is this:-
Labour MP for Exeter Ben Bradshaw wants to create a new offence for failing to stop or report an accident where the driver knew there had been a serious or fatal injury - with a maximum sentence of 14 years.

The change would need cross-party support to become law and Cycling UK has written to MPs urging them to support the amendment.

Duncan Dollimore, head of campaigns at Cycling UK said offenders of road crime can be given "chance after chance to keep their licence yet go on to offend again".

"Harm caused to others should trump the predictable consequences of accruing penalty points, and the fact that it doesn't is an insult to victims that makes a mockery of our road traffic laws," he said.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-57680917

Failing to stop is a very emotive subject, but even if it's passed into law - which may be doubtful - I can't see it working in the way intended.

I'd have thought that the very real concerns expressed by Duncan Dollimore would be more likely to be achieved by strengthening of the totting-up scheme, in particular "special reasons" based on hardship to avoid disqualification.
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PS Before anybody else mentions it, here's CUk on the subject, and it does cover totting up.

https://www.cyclinguk.org/article/cycli ... iling-laws
Stevek76
Posts: 2086
Joined: 28 Jul 2015, 11:23am

Re: Police etc Bill - proposed amendments.

Post by Stevek76 »

Well it's just been voted through it's 3rd reading and I'm not sure if there's any easy summary anywhere of what the individual votes for the gazillion different amendments were (what a daftly large bill!)

As for that particular amendment, there seems to be a rather obvious loop hole in the "where the driver knew there had been a serious or fatal injury" part. I'd have thought a better approach would be just to have the penalty for hit & run to be whatever penalty was effectively run from, much as I was under the impression the owner refusing to name the driver works.
The contents of this post, unless otherwise stated, are opinions of the author and may actually be complete codswallop
Steady rider
Posts: 2749
Joined: 4 Jan 2009, 4:31pm

Re: Police etc Bill - proposed amendments.

Post by Steady rider »

If a driver passes too close and dangerously, or has frequent traffic violations, or drives a type of vehicle that poses a higher risk to other road users, could the bill include a requirement for their vehicle to have cameras fitted and the police be able to access their recordings in the event of a complaint?

ps I would require all HGV vehicles to have cameras fitted and anyone more than 3 points.
bjlabuk
Posts: 63
Joined: 9 Jul 2021, 1:44pm

Re: Police etc Bill - proposed amendments.

Post by bjlabuk »

I don't know whether Ben Bradshaw is a lawyer or not but I think the phrase ""where the driver knew there had been a serious or fatal injury" is fraught with problems - which of course defence lawyers will love! How, for example, can a motorist 'know' that he had left a seriously or fatally injured person in his wake? How can the prosecution prove, more importantly, that the driver "knew" anything?

A standard defence to 'fail to stop, fail to report' is that the driver had no knowledge that an accident had occurred which, when minor incidents happen, is quite common. If the contact between vehicles is minimal, and the damage to the defendents vehicle in particular is minimal, then the prosecution will find it difficult to prove 'beyond a reasonable doubt' that the driver 'knew' an accident had occurred.

Even in the case of serious or fatal injury there might be little contact between vehicles or damage to the defendent's vehicle, so the standard defence will still apply.
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