LEDs and PCs
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axel_knutt
LEDs and PCs
Has you read the thread on the C+ board from a POLICEMAN wanting to know what the law on LED cycle lights is!!!!!!!!!
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zeb
Re:LEDs and PCs
At last years York Rally there was a contingent of police from around the country with their flash new bikes. (Quite a few different designs).
I tried to discuss the legality of LEDs with them but the most I could get was that they wouldn't nick me for having them. After all all their bikes had LED lights.
Of course things have moved on since then and I've taken to using continental LEDs and trusting EC law will cover me. Got my old BS Opticubes stolen along with attached bike.
I tried to discuss the legality of LEDs with them but the most I could get was that they wouldn't nick me for having them. After all all their bikes had LED lights.
Of course things have moved on since then and I've taken to using continental LEDs and trusting EC law will cover me. Got my old BS Opticubes stolen along with attached bike.
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Yorkshireman
Re:LEDs and PCs
Well at least he`s trying to find out! Good for him.
Ive also seen (and participated in) the topic on cycle paths/lanes and signs on acf.
Anyway the policeman wasn`t the only one who didn`t know or understand about the recent changes including many CTC members and posters on here, despite the explanations by Chris Juden.
Colin N.
Ive also seen (and participated in) the topic on cycle paths/lanes and signs on acf.
Anyway the policeman wasn`t the only one who didn`t know or understand about the recent changes including many CTC members and posters on here, despite the explanations by Chris Juden.
Colin N.
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axel_knutt
Re:LEDs and PCs
As I understand it LEDs are legal so long as they're BS approved. However, when I pointed to the row of LEDs in the LBS and asked which were BS approved, the assistant said "they all are now- the law's been changed". I think he's confusing a law with a British Standard, it's still illegal to use a non-approved LED, just like it's always been illegal to use a non-approved tungsten lamp.
What interests me is the lamps that say they're BS approved, claim up to 100 hours battery life, and are switchable between two brightness levels. I assume they'll only do 100 hours on low, and only meet BS on high.
What interests me is the lamps that say they're BS approved, claim up to 100 hours battery life, and are switchable between two brightness levels. I assume they'll only do 100 hours on low, and only meet BS on high.
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axel_knutt
Re:LEDs and PCs
As I understand it LEDs are legal so long as they're BS approved. However, when I pointed to the row of LEDs in the LBS and asked which were BS approved, the assistant said "they all are now- the law's been changed". I think he's confusing a law with a British Standard, it's still illegal to use a non-approved LED, just like it's always been illegal to use a non-approved tungsten lamp.
What interests me is the lamps that say they're BS approved, claim up to 100 hours battery life, and are switchable between two brightness levels. I assume they'll only do 100 hours on low, and only meet BS on high.
What interests me is the lamps that say they're BS approved, claim up to 100 hours battery life, and are switchable between two brightness levels. I assume they'll only do 100 hours on low, and only meet BS on high.
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axel_knutt
Re:LEDs and PCs
This mesage board needds an edit/erase function. I've ended up with two copies here because the site appeared to crash after I pressed the submit button....
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Yorkshireman
Re:LEDs and PCs
If you click on Search (top r/h corner of this page) it is possible to (enter flashing lights) see past postings by CJ (and others) and find out what the actual legal position is...just takes a bit of effort on the keyboard.
Colin N.
Colin N.
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Yorkshireman
Re:LEDs and PCs
Such as this....
AUTHOR Re:Lights - definitive information
CJ
Posted:Friday, 21 October 2005 14:15 Sigh … Mr Web, Roadrunner, TyreDocter (sic) or whoever you are, please check your facts before posting. As of today, flashing lights are permitted on bikes, provided they emit between 1 and 4 flashes per second. Even better: provided a flashing lamp is not also capable of showing a steady light, the only technical requirement it has to satisfy in order to be "approved" (so you don't need another BS-compliant lamp to back it up and be totally legal) is that it emits at least 4 candela.
For confirmation of this fact you are welcome to read Statutory Instrument 2005 No.2559 and its Explanatory Memorandum, that may be downloaded from here. Or for an easy-reading interpretation of cycle lighting law as it now stands: visit this CTC webpage.
Colin N.
AUTHOR Re:Lights - definitive information
CJ
Posted:Friday, 21 October 2005 14:15 Sigh … Mr Web, Roadrunner, TyreDocter (sic) or whoever you are, please check your facts before posting. As of today, flashing lights are permitted on bikes, provided they emit between 1 and 4 flashes per second. Even better: provided a flashing lamp is not also capable of showing a steady light, the only technical requirement it has to satisfy in order to be "approved" (so you don't need another BS-compliant lamp to back it up and be totally legal) is that it emits at least 4 candela.
For confirmation of this fact you are welcome to read Statutory Instrument 2005 No.2559 and its Explanatory Memorandum, that may be downloaded from here. Or for an easy-reading interpretation of cycle lighting law as it now stands: visit this CTC webpage.
Colin N.
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Andy Tallis
Re:LEDs and PCs
What a shame about the rule of "if it is only capable of emitting a flashing light" - all my LED lights are able to do both steady and flashing, so I can't be technically legal up the front - I can't find a nice reliable BS lamp that doesn't weigh a tonne and guzzle batteries, don't know of a flasher that doesn't also emit steady and my solidlights running off the dynamo (despite being awesome) is not BS. Does anyone know if it is legal to use a flashing light at all if it is also capable of emitting a steady beam?
Andy
Andy
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Yorkshireman
Re:LEDs and PCs
As I understand it Andy, a light that can be switched between flashing and steady would`nt be strictly legal, but who`s to spot something like that ? I can`t find a single supplier of a lamp with flashing only mode and I can`t remember if CJ found one either. Lets face it, most police are happy enough if you are showing any sort of light. it looks as if this is a bit more rule `inventing` by the uninformed again !
Colin N.
Colin N.
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Andy Tallis
Re:LEDs and PCs
That's the general conclusion I came to. As I use clipless pedals I will never be legal anyway as I can't have pedal reflectors, but if someone tries to say they didn't see me from the front (I have BS rear) I think they'd be laughed out of the courtroom when I showed them what a solidlights 1203d can do. I have been told BS requires sideways output of light to be of a certain level too, but that would be restricted if fitten to drop bars by my arms and the bars themselves anyway.
Andy
Andy
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PW
Re:LEDs and PCs
Police MTBs in Sheffield use diode rear, twin Lumicycles with bottle Li-Ion battery at the front & the one I saw had no reflectors anywhere. I doubt anyone will get stopped to test the modes on a rear diode!
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Elucasr
Re:LEDs and PCs
For my winter lights I used to use a Smart twin headlamp Lead/acid battery set. Not legal, but last year (due to the refectors deteriorating) I fitted a Union BS compliant dynamo front lamp to it.
Now that the clocks have changed I have hung up my winter bike and got my lightweight mixte out. I have a 1 watt LED front lamp (not legal) which I back up with an old Cateye BS lamp. I wouldn't be able to see by the cateye but it makes it legal, whereas I can see fairly well with the 1 watt LED. Nobody gives a damn if you can see or not, only if they can see you.
Shouldn't the lighting regulations require that all motor vehicles parked on the carriageway should have lights on (LED's are now available for motors).
Now that the clocks have changed I have hung up my winter bike and got my lightweight mixte out. I have a 1 watt LED front lamp (not legal) which I back up with an old Cateye BS lamp. I wouldn't be able to see by the cateye but it makes it legal, whereas I can see fairly well with the 1 watt LED. Nobody gives a damn if you can see or not, only if they can see you.
Shouldn't the lighting regulations require that all motor vehicles parked on the carriageway should have lights on (LED's are now available for motors).
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Andy Tallis
Re:LEDs and PCs
Highway code rules about parking at night:
222 - You MUST NOT park on a road at night facing the flow of traffic unless in a recognised parking space
223- All vehicles MUST display parking lights when aprked on a road or a lay-by on a road with a sped limit greater than 30mph.
224- Cars, goods vehicles not exceeding 1525kg unladen, invalid carriages and motorcycles may be parked without lights on a road (or lay-by) with a speed limit or less if they are
-at least 10m away from any junction, closeto the kerb and facing in the direction of the traffic flow
-In a recognised parking place or lay-by.
All other vehicles and trailers, and all vehicles with projecting loads, MUST NOT be left on a road at night without lights.
So we're almost there already, but these rules do of course get broken a lot. In the same way as the rule about it being illegal to drive on a pavement or park on double yellows get broken a lot - it is the divine right to park somewhere convenient! Why shouldn;t we have the right to use decent lights without having to carry around some heavy and unreliable BS thing to convert expensive batteries into chemical waste at an unecessartily fast rate?
Andy
222 - You MUST NOT park on a road at night facing the flow of traffic unless in a recognised parking space
223- All vehicles MUST display parking lights when aprked on a road or a lay-by on a road with a sped limit greater than 30mph.
224- Cars, goods vehicles not exceeding 1525kg unladen, invalid carriages and motorcycles may be parked without lights on a road (or lay-by) with a speed limit or less if they are
-at least 10m away from any junction, closeto the kerb and facing in the direction of the traffic flow
-In a recognised parking place or lay-by.
All other vehicles and trailers, and all vehicles with projecting loads, MUST NOT be left on a road at night without lights.
So we're almost there already, but these rules do of course get broken a lot. In the same way as the rule about it being illegal to drive on a pavement or park on double yellows get broken a lot - it is the divine right to park somewhere convenient! Why shouldn;t we have the right to use decent lights without having to carry around some heavy and unreliable BS thing to convert expensive batteries into chemical waste at an unecessartily fast rate?
Andy
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axel_knutt
Re:LEDs and PCs
As ever, the problem is not what happens if you're stopped by police, but what happens if you have an accident. The motorist's barrister will be looking for any excuse not to cough up, such as non BS lamps.
I went for a trip over a car bonnet in the dark a couple of months ago. Fortunately the driver didn't start asking whether the lights were BS approved, unfortunately he b*ggered off without paying anyway.....
I went for a trip over a car bonnet in the dark a couple of months ago. Fortunately the driver didn't start asking whether the lights were BS approved, unfortunately he b*ggered off without paying anyway.....