CTC and cycling to school

MikeL
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CTC and cycling to school

Post by MikeL »

Nice to see the CTC get a piece of the guardian today on the subject of cycling to school.

The comment section is mostly from people talking sense as well, which is refreshing.

One of the commenters pointed out the problem of girls and skirts. This was the major bone of contention in our family in those days. The idiot (secondary) school would not allow pupils to travel to school out their very bike unfriendly uniform, so the simple expedient of wearing something suitable for the weather and changing on arrival was strictly disallowed. The grounds were some stupidity about 'image'. Amazing set of priorities :evil:
fatboy
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Re: CTC and cycling to school

Post by fatboy »

I cycled to school daily from the age of around 13 to 17. We had to wear school uniform but overcoats were allowed. I used to ride in a gabardine (sure that's not how you spell it) "flasher mac" which wasn't practical, was very stealthy in colour but was very waterproof and breathed well.
"Marriage is a wonderful invention; but then again so is the bicycle puncture repair kit." - Billy Connolly
thirdcrank
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Re: CTC and cycling to school

Post by thirdcrank »

You have to accept that the great majority of head teachers seem to be opposed to allowing cycling to school. You have to ask yourself why such a body of intelligent, rational, well-educated and trained people, pre-emininent among a profession shaping the future should be so strongly opposed to something so valuable for the health, safety, self-esteem, well-being etc of the nation's youth.

I can only assume that they have a subconscious fear of what might be going on in that hotbed of iniquity - that mythical area "behind the bikesheds." :shock: (Amazement - the word bikesheds is not auto edited :wink: )
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EdinburghFixed
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Re: CTC and cycling to school

Post by EdinburghFixed »

I've got a friend who teaches at one of Edinburgh's more prestigious fee-paying schools. They have a policy against cycling to work for similar (apparent) reasons - the kids need to travel to school in uniform looking immaculate.

What the true reason is, I'm not so sure. You'd think schools would have everything to gain from having kids race into school on bikes instead of being dropped off from the Chelsea tractor full of energy!
MikeL
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Re: CTC and cycling to school

Post by MikeL »

EdinburghFixed wrote:the kids need to travel to school in uniform looking immaculate.


And the teachers! Playground wisdom (fwiw) was that a very popular (and unusually well qualified) teacher was harassed into leaving on 'face does not fit' grounds, in part at least due to his insistence in cycling to work in cycling gear.

I suppose its about preparing the kids for the 'real world': where appearance is 99% and substance 1%
Flinders
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Re: CTC and cycling to school

Post by Flinders »

I always reckon a good school needs no uniform. In my experience, schools only make a fuss about small things like sock colour etc. when other things (discipline, education, little things like that) are out of control.
I had bad knee joints as a kid, and my doc had to write a letter to my school so I didn't have to wear a skirt in the freezing winter weather. Staff would stop me in the corridor and I'd have to produce my letter of permission from the school, which I had to carry around with me all the time. In the meantime, physical violence could be going on within about five feet of us, and the whole school was out of control. It was easier to pick on a four-foot-ten 4-stone little girl for her uniform than sort out the fight between two fifteen-year-olds.

As for girls being forced to wear skirts when boys aren't forced to wear skirts, I've always assumed that this was due solely to an unhealthy interest in young girls' legs on the part of the adults taking the decisions about what girls should wear. Why else would girls not be allowed to wear trousers? (or boys to wear skirts if they want to- that's fine by me too.)
skrx
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Re: CTC and cycling to school

Post by skrx »

Flinders wrote:I always reckon a good school needs no uniform. In my experience, schools only make a fuss about small things like sock colour etc. when other things (discipline, education, little things like that) are out of control.


I think the theory is that uniform is the root of good discipline, so get that sorted and everything else will follow.

(Having said that, my dad taught at a Posh Girls School. He said if he enforced the uniform strictly (no coats in class etc) then all was well, but if you didn't then the girls would see what else they could get away with, and that could be more disruptive than "Gemma, take your coat off".
He frequently said it was a world away from Inner City Comprehensive, where he taught for 20 years.)
Flinders
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Re: CTC and cycling to school

Post by Flinders »

It is just a theory, though.
As almost no secondary schools, or even primary schools, now go without a horrible uniform of some sort, most of which are demeaning to those female pupils who don't conform to a 'girly' image, it is difficult to test the theory.

As an ex-teacher of mostly older teenage students, I didn't find having a uniform made any difference at all to the discipline of my classes. I was perfectly able to exact strict class discipline either with or without it in a variety of settings, good and bad, though in some places now I doubt that would be possible, uniform or not. I also felt that had I involved myself in such nonsense as telling people what to wear, other than for safety reasons, it would have undermined my authority, and rightly so.

I stuck to my proper business, making sure they learned my subject, and minded my own about what they wore. It seemed to work- and I think they felt that in not interfering with things that were their own affair, I was showing appropriate respect for them as individuals. The fact that I also dressed like Compo out of Last of the Summer Wine myself didn't stop them working silently in my classes and handing their homework in on time, either. I certainly got more respect and obedience than some power-dressing colleagues.

But to return to the topic, I think schools should be compelled by law to provide cycle parking, which would get round their weaseling about it. I can't see how they could possibly get sued for providing cycle parking, even in this age- that's just being used a a particularly lame excuse.
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Phil_Lee
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Re: CTC and cycling to school

Post by Phil_Lee »

I think that preventing children from partaking in healthy exercise is child abuse, and any teacher doing so should be charged accordingly.

And if any of those bigoted folk out there who prevent children from cycling read this and object to it, feel free to try nailing me for libel - I'm up for it, if you are!
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Cunobelin
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Re: CTC and cycling to school

Post by Cunobelin »

Flinders wrote:I always reckon a good school needs no uniform. In my experience, schools only make a fuss about small things like sock colour etc. when other things (discipline, education, little things like that) are out of control.
I had bad knee joints as a kid, and my doc had to write a letter to my school so I didn't have to wear a skirt in the freezing winter weather. Staff would stop me in the corridor and I'd have to produce my letter of permission from the school, which I had to carry around with me all the time. In the meantime, physical violence could be going on within about five feet of us, and the whole school was out of control. It was easier to pick on a four-foot-ten 4-stone little girl for her uniform than sort out the fight between two fifteen-year-olds.

As for girls being forced to wear skirts when boys aren't forced to wear skirts, I've always assumed that this was due solely to an unhealthy interest in young girls' legs on the part of the adults taking the decisions about what girls should wear. Why else would girls not be allowed to wear trousers? (or boys to wear skirts if they want to- that's fine by me too.)


I must admit that I have mixed feelings. A local School near here had all sorts of problems and a new Headmistress arrived. To her uniform was a tool that could be used to establish the basic discipline, standards and remove many of the more rebellious and bizarre fashions.

It certainly worked and the School (and local areas) has improved.

Having said that her uniform was a simple badge!

Blue sweatshirt and dark trousers / skirts (length restrictions) biught from wherever the parents could get the best value and sew the badge on the left breast!
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Cunobelin
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Re: CTC and cycling to school

Post by Cunobelin »

We also have a need for the local Councils to be coherent.

In Gosport we have a busy cycle track that serves several schools. It is to become a Bus route with pedestrians banned from it. At the moment there are hundreds walking to school who will be unable to do so as the alternative route is much longer and involves crossing several busy and fast roads.

We had to campaign against ban on bicycles (successfully) but the Council is effectively stopping these children from walking to School!
Flinders
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Re: CTC and cycling to school

Post by Flinders »

Cunobelin wrote:
I must admit that I have mixed feelings. A local School near here had all sorts of problems and a new Headmistress arrived. To her uniform was a tool that could be used to establish the basic discipline, standards and remove many of the more rebellious and bizarre fashions.

It certainly worked and the School (and local areas) has improved.

Having said that her uniform was a simple badge!

Blue sweatshirt and dark trousers / skirts (length restrictions) biught from wherever the parents could get the best value and sew the badge on the left breast!


But I wonder- has anyone tried to do all this without a uniform? That always seems to be part of the deal, so we have no stats without it!
Having to wear a uniform made me much more stroppy as a teenager. Yes, I wore it, but for seven years i used regularly to remove it on the mat behind the front door at home and stamp on it, so as to wear it for as short a time as possible, and have it look a bad as possible whilst still being within the rules,and it was a continual affront to my comfort and my self-respect. I've never let anyone tell me what to wear since. :wink:
thirdcrank
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Re: CTC and cycling to school

Post by thirdcrank »

We seem to be drifting away from encouraging cycling to school, to chuntering about uniform. IMO it's something that can be a force for good and bad. It can foster a team spirit and encourage the attainment of common goals and standards. OTOH it can be a way of suppressing individuality and then it's nothing more than official bullying. This is not just uniform, it's also things like haircuts. It's not easy to draw the line but military standards are probably OTT for school pupils.

Females not being allowed to wear trousers is one of those absurdities which took a long time to eliminate. Forty years ago, my wife worked for the Supplementary Benefits Commission - the predecessor of Income Support. In the mornings she trudged the streets of Leeds visiting claimants and even in the winter she was required to wear a skirt. (As an established civil servant she was also required to set an example to her staff.) In fact, horror of horrors, she used to wear trousers in the morning when she was visiting then change in a pub lavatory or similar before going into the office in the afternoon. In many, perhaps all police forces in the 1970's policewomen were only allowed to wear skirts even though by then they were engaged on the same duties as men. Around here, for a period of several years, their uniform skirts were cut so tight at the knee that it was impossible to run in them. That sort of thing might be alright in Carry On films, but to expect a woman to hoist up her skirt before she can tackle somebody threatening violence is appalling. The eventual concession was culottes and it was well into the 1980's before there was an outbreak of practicality.
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Cunobelin
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Re: CTC and cycling to school

Post by Cunobelin »

The uniform I referred to was simply a badge on appropriately coloured and designed clothing...... eminently suited to a cycling option
Flinders
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Re: CTC and cycling to school

Post by Flinders »

Still OT, sorry, but coincidentally I heard this week that many European countries don't have school uniforms at all, and at least anectdotal evidence suggests they have better discipline in their schools than we do.
Hmn. We must be a conformist lot in clothing over here.
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