A place to record lenient sentencing for motorvehicle....

[Bonefishblues]

criminological research has shown for decades that prison is not a deterrent to criminals: being caught is. Only politicians want more and bigger prisons.

I think there's significant public support too.

Less than you imagine. Study after study demonstrate that the public, when given real scenarios, suggest lighter sentences than those actually given whilst assuming that the actual sentence would have been more lenient that it was.

Yet time after time the call is for tough sanctions and locking more people away - presumably, to your point, as long as they themselves don't have to do the deed?

[Jdsk]

It's fascinating: if you ask without specifics you can elicit desire for heavier sentences and if you show the sort of details that apply in individual cases with individual defendants you can get recommendations for lighter sentences than those actually imposed. As described above. Cognitive dissonance.

Jonathan

[Oldjohnw]

I think there's significant public support too.

Less than you imagine. Study after study demonstrate that the public, when given real scenarios, suggest lighter sentences than those actually given whilst assuming that the actual sentence would have been more lenient that it was.

Yet time after time the call is for tough sanctions and locking more people away - presumably, to your point, as long as they themselves don't have to do the deed?

Yes, you get calls for tougher sentences but people think sentences are getting lighter when the opposite is the case.

The scenario goes like this:

What should have received?
Public: 7 years.

What do you think he got?
Public: 5 years.

What he actually got: 8 years.

[Bonefishblues]

Less than you imagine. Study after study demonstrate that the public, when given real scenarios, suggest lighter sentences than those actually given whilst assuming that the actual sentence would have been more lenient that it was.

Yet time after time the call is for tough sanctions and locking more people away - presumably, to your point, as long as they themselves don't have to do the deed?

Yes, you get calls for tougher sentences but people think sentences are getting lighter when the opposite is the case.

The scenario goes like this:

What should have received?
Public: 7 years.

What do you think he got?
Public: 5 years.

What he actually got: 8 years.

I understand the point you're making

[Oldjohnw]

Apologies. I know I can be unclear sometimes and worried this was such a time.

[thirdcrank]

There can be few other areas of our society - and none that I can think of - where public perception and reality are more divided than penal policy. Unfortunately, many politicians of every stripe connive at this situation. Something to do with there being no votes in prisons.

[Bonefishblues]

Apologies. I know I can be unclear sometimes and worried this was such a time.

No, all good - it's just a very interesting dichotomy between the oft-heard public clamour/perception and what you report.

[thirdcrank]

Re prison conditions, it's reported that covid in prisons may skew the stats for the areas in which they are situated

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-d ... e-56405523

If you reflect on the different size of the population in a local government area as compared with even the biggest prisons, the covid casualties among inmates and staff must be big if they are sufficient to make a significant impact on the stats.

[Jdsk]

There can be few other areas of our society - and none that I can think of - where public perception and reality are more divided than penal policy.

That's an interesting point, and it entertained me on this morning's walk. (Around where the Expressway isn't now going to be!) Thank you.

There are quite a lot of topics on which public perception is a long way from reality (how the NHS is funded, the number of migrants, risks of cycling, nutritional supplements) but that's different from policy. I did come up with consumption of alcohol and other recreational drugs.

I think that you're right... unless there are other suggestions...

Jonathan

[Pastychomper]

Less than you imagine. Study after study demonstrate that the public, when given real scenarios, suggest lighter sentences than those actually given whilst assuming that the actual sentence would have been more lenient that it was.

I wonder how well the "more lenient" sentence expected correlates with the time actually served in a custodial sentence. I gather there is usually a difference between the two.

[Jdsk]

You be the Judge seems to be down:
http://ybtj.justice.gov.uk
https://www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk/research-and-resources/you-be-the-judge/

Jonathan

[simonhill]

Is this only for vehicles?

Reports in The Sun https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/14706514/ ... g-cyclist/

Man in park pushed ecyclist off his bike, then picked him up and dropped him. Guilty of GBH sentenced to 6 months in jail.

Given that will probably be only 3 months served it is very lenient for such an act.

[Jdsk]

Sounds like the Section 20 rather than the Section 18 offence.

Draft guidelines from the Sentencing Council:
https://www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk/of ... tion-only/

Jonathan

[fastpedaller]

Local Newspaper report nobody to face charges - Cyclist basically run down by car and no action taken, tragic for the family and made all the worse by lack of action. Police don't care IMHO.

https://www.edp24.co.uk/news/crime/deva ... -1-6698918

I posted the above note on page 29 (some may wish to read comments at the time)
here is a link to a report that I've only just become aware of.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... hears.html

This answers why no action occurred, but asks more questions than it answers. Police ineptitude? "Secret society" cover -up? who knows, but a tragic case with no justice. Heads should roll (but clearly didn't) Makes me very angry that victims are denied any justice in cases like this.

[NATURAL ANKLING]

Hi,
2 1/2 years is definitely not enough for this type of behaviour.
And a life ban for sure.
"His sentence was reduced for his early guilty plea."
https://www.theargus.co.uk/news/1931826 ... ate-pleas/
"He reversed over the boy, seriously injuring him and destroying his cycle helmet, before driving home with the bike still trapped beneath his car."