Bedford turbo roundabout - it is done

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gaz
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Re: Bedford turbo roundabout - BMF wades in

Postby gaz » 14 Nov 2014, 11:56am

Streetview shows works were in progress in September.

Have they finished yet?

Has anyone actually experienced it?

Found this short blog and video from someone who has, although not as a regular user.
There'll be tarmac over, the white cliffs of Dover ...

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mjr
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Re: Bedford turbo roundabout - BMF wades in

Postby mjr » 14 Nov 2014, 1:04pm

I understand that it's finished. A supporter (as far as I know) of the scheme reports that it works well (but they would say that wouldn't they?). I may be able to ride it myself in a couple of weeks, making a small detour on a journey. We won't really know who was right until the novelty wears off and there's a year or two of collision data (or non-collision data, hopefully) and traffic data, plus whether the council upgrade the zebras to zebra-toucans when regulations permit (as CCNB seem to think they will).
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BSRU
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Re: Bedford turbo roundabout - BMF wades in

Postby BSRU » 14 Nov 2014, 2:16pm

It's finished and apparently cycling friendly, doesn't look it to me.

http://www.transportxtra.com/magazines/ ... /?id=39719

thirdcrank
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Re: Bedford turbo roundabout - BMF wades in

Postby thirdcrank » 18 Nov 2014, 8:06am

It would be interesting to have feedback from riders who use this junction, or anybody else living near enough to have a look at the finished product. In particular, it would be good to know what's the farcility provision for cyclists crossing the approaches.

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Re: Bedford turbo roundabout - BMF wades in

Postby SA_SA_SA » 18 Nov 2014, 12:00pm

And how much the zebras affect the capacity when busy with motor traffic, as the capacity calculations seem to pretend they will have no effect thus unfairly favouring this test layout over the tried and tested single lane continental style roundabout:

do drivers stop for waiting pedestrians when the roundabout is operating at full capacity?
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[XAP]Bob
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Re: Bedford turbo roundabout - BMF wades in

Postby [XAP]Bob » 18 Nov 2014, 12:02pm

SA_SA_SA wrote:And how much the zebras affect the capacity when busy with motor traffic, as the capacity calculations seem to pretend they will have no effect thus unfairly favouring this test layout over the tried and tested single lane continental style roundabout:

do drivers stop for waiting pedestrians when the roundabout is operating at full capacity?

No, of course not, and at lower capacity pedestrians will have to take their chance...
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mjr
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Re: Bedford turbo roundabout - BMF wades in

Postby mjr » 18 Nov 2014, 12:16pm

SA_SA_SA wrote:And how much the zebras affect the capacity when busy with motor traffic, as the capacity calculations seem to pretend they will have no effect thus unfairly favouring this test layout over the tried and tested single lane continental style roundabout

This seems to be standard practice: capacity is only reduced by standalone Toucans or if the crossing time is longer than the red phase needed for motorists to make the complementary movement (which explains why we usually get those nasty two-stage crossings of roads at junctions).
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Pete Owens
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Re: Bedford turbo roundabout - BMF wades in

Postby Pete Owens » 19 Nov 2014, 2:02am

BSRU wrote:It's finished and apparently cycling friendly, doesn't look it to me.


Of course it isn't - all the cycle friendly features were ditched at the behest of the motor cyclists.

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Re: Bedford turbo roundabout - BMF wades in

Postby mjr » 19 Nov 2014, 10:23am

Pete Owens wrote:Of course it isn't - all the cycle friendly features were ditched at the behest of the motor cyclists.

Did the previously-praised-by-Pete geometry slacken as well then?
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TonyR
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Re: Bedford turbo roundabout - BMF wades in

Postby TonyR » 19 Nov 2014, 1:21pm

Pete Owens wrote:
BSRU wrote:It's finished and apparently cycling friendly, doesn't look it to me.


Of course it isn't - all the cycle friendly features were ditched at the behest of the motor cyclists.


Never mind. The local facilities campaigners like it. http://www.ccnb.org.uk/responsesb.html

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BSRU
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Re: Bedford turbo roundabout - BMF wades in

Postby BSRU » 19 Nov 2014, 1:29pm

Pete Owens wrote:
BSRU wrote:It's finished and apparently cycling friendly, doesn't look it to me.


Of course it isn't - all the cycle friendly features were ditched at the behest of the motor cyclists.


It was never cycle friendly.

thirdcrank
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Re: Bedford turbo roundabout - BMF wades in

Postby thirdcrank » 20 Nov 2014, 12:44pm

Apologies for blatantly bouncing this in the hope of hearing from somebody who's seen it since it was finished.

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Re: Bedford turbo roundabout - BMF wades in

Postby Tonyf33 » 20 Nov 2014, 1:36pm

thirdcrank wrote:Apologies for blatantly bouncing this in the hope of hearing from somebody who's seen it since it was finished.

IF (that's a big IF BTW) I can be bothered and the weather holds out I might have a trundle that way next week, think there are a few on here closer though.

It'd be interesting to see if it has had any impact on kids cycling to/from school, tbh i just don't think there's enough within this to make that much of a difference (to cyclists), it certainly isn't going to get droves of people onto bikes (because they'll feel or actually be safer) because beyond the roundabout there's nothing that screams lots of space & 'safe' cycling anyways.

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Re: Bedford turbo roundabout - BMF wades in

Postby thirdcrank » 20 Nov 2014, 2:15pm

Tonyf33

I'll look forward to your review.

The things which at some time or other have been going to make this development more cycle-friendly and therefore appropriate for funding from some cycling money or other have been IIRC

Tighter, speed reducing geometry
"Turbo" lanes on the carriageway of the roundabout
The ability of cyclists to benefit from the pedestrian crossings without the requirement to dismount.

There are probably others that I've forgotten. I've tried to use the most general language to avoid any dispute with anybody about what may have been promised / hoped for / not a chance in hell of. IMO, if there's to be any further fruitful discussion of this, we need to know what's been provided.

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Re: Bedford turbo roundabout - BMF wades in

Postby thirdcrank » 20 Dec 2014, 4:48pm

Can anybody say what arrangements have been made for cyclists at the pedestrian crossings? I ask because it seems that pedestrian crossings with an adjacent cycle path are being installed elsewhere. Earlier in the thread there was a link to the CTC website where it said something along the lines that the regulations would be changed but not in time for this scheme.

I've tried to check if there are new regultions or amendments to the 1997 regs and I've been unsuccessful.

The Bedford Borough Council page titled Pedestrian Crossings (which also has information about toucan crossings and equestrian crossings) just lists the standard menagerie.

http://www.bedford.gov.uk/transport_and ... sings.aspx
======================================================================
Edit to add: I've answered my own question by looking in the obvious place - the Bedford BC www

Can I cycle across the zebra crossings?

Cyclists should dismount and push their bikes across zebra crossings giving them right of way. A national consultation has been carried out on a new form of zebra crossing which will allow cyclists to cycle across with right of way over motorists. At the time of construction the new design had not been approved to allow us to install this form of crossing. We have constructed the crossings in such a way that when these crossings are approved next year, as we are given to understand, we can easily install them without the need to remove existing lines. Should this crossing not be approved we will widen the stripes on the zebra crossings to the full width giving more room to accommodate pedestrians and those cyclists pushing their bikes.


http://www.bedford.gov.uk/council_and_d ... wered.aspx

NB Written by somebody who doesn't understand the difference between right-of-way and precedence.