Pavement Parking

reohn2
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Re: Pavement Parking

Postby reohn2 » 5 Mar 2019, 8:52pm

Bmblbzzz wrote:Also great for encouraging head-on confrontations as drivers of larger vehicles use their bulk to force others out of their way.

Especially cyclists :?
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kwackers
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Re: Pavement Parking

Postby kwackers » 5 Mar 2019, 9:43pm

Wanlock Dod wrote:I expect that for most drivers their main concern is not “blocking” the road, and so impending the progress of other motorists. Plenty of residential streets with a decent pavement on each side and in principle a road wide enough for two large cars to pass easily have been reduced to parking right the way down the pavement at both sides and a central roadway which is only wide enough for a single vehicle. I think you’ll find it’s called progress...

Nah.

Folk park on the pavements because that's what they do. They do it outside their own houses whilst their drives remain empty. They do it on wide roads where parking on the road wouldn't even require an overtaking car to cross the middle.
Then there are those that park completely on the pavement, those who think yellow lines don't count if you're on the pavement (why are they never ticketed?), those who park on corners over the pavement ramps etc etc.

For 95% it's nothing other than habit and as we allow more and more folk to get away with it then it becomes more and more entrenched.

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mjr
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Re: Pavement Parking

Postby mjr » 5 Mar 2019, 10:02pm

kwackers wrote:
Wanlock Dod wrote:I expect that for most drivers their main concern is not “blocking” the road, and so impending the progress of other motorists.

Nah.

Folk park on the pavements because that's what they do. [...]

The road in my picture is maybe 15m across at the point where the tractor parked. It could probably park in the middle of the road and cars could pass either side. I'm with kwackers - it's just an antisocial habit.
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Cyril Haearn
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Re: Pavement Parking

Postby Cyril Haearn » 6 Mar 2019, 4:06am

The traffic/parking warders issue tickets for vehicles parked legally but too long, without paying
Vehicles parked illegally are not ticketed :?
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Cunobelin
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Re: Pavement Parking

Postby Cunobelin » 6 Mar 2019, 6:45am

We have prolems with a local Car Boot Sale..........

The most effective way of forcing them to do something was to start putting all the illegally parked vehicles on their Facebook page!

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Cunobelin
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Re: Pavement Parking

Postby Cunobelin » 6 Mar 2019, 6:49am

THe biggest single step would be to clarify the offence and responsinbility

In most places it is the responsinbility of the Council.... unless on the pavement, crossing etc which is an obstruction so the resonsibilty of the POlice

However as parking is decriminalised, they cannot deal with it as it is a parking offence - so the Council's responsibility
Except that because it is on a pavement it is an obstruction so the Council have no jurisdiction... it is up to the Police

.... and so it continues

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Cunobelin
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Re: Pavement Parking

Postby Cunobelin » 6 Mar 2019, 6:55am

mjr wrote:
kwackers wrote:
Wanlock Dod wrote:I expect that for most drivers their main concern is not “blocking” the road, and so impending the progress of other motorists.

Nah.

Folk park on the pavements because that's what they do. [...]

The road in my picture is maybe 15m across at the point where the tractor parked. It could probably park in the middle of the road and cars could pass either side. I'm with kwackers - it's just an antisocial habit.


Can I invite anyone who thinks that this is simply antisocial to join us for a quick spin one day?

My wife is in a whelchair, and this is far from "just an antisocial habit"

You need to find a dropped kerb, exit the pavement, travel along a busy road, often agaainst the traffic flow, then find another drop kerb to rejoin the pavement... and that is only if the drop kerb isn't obstructed as well and you have to backtrack a hunderd yards to find ine that is not

Now repeat every few hundred yards

We are lucky in that neither of us has impaired vision, but why should someone blind be forced to walk along a busy road becase of the laziness and stupidty of some arrogant (insert expletive of choice)

Illegal obstruction of the pavement is dangerous and causes unneccessary risk to vulnerable people

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Patrickpioneer
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Re: Pavement Parking

Postby Patrickpioneer » 6 Mar 2019, 7:16am

One of my pet hates is people who park on the pavement forcing me to walk in the road, it comes across to me as 'my car is more important than your life' sort of attitude. I used to think it was illegal to park on the pavement but its not in a lot of circumstances, The world is ruled by tin boxes on rubber wheels.
Pat
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pwa
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Re: Pavement Parking

Postby pwa » 6 Mar 2019, 7:43am

Patrickpioneer wrote:One of my pet hates is people who park on the pavement forcing me to walk in the road, it comes across to me as 'my car is more important than your life' sort of attitude. I used to think it was illegal to park on the pavement but its not in a lot of circumstances, The world is ruled by tin boxes on rubber wheels.
Pat
https://www.askthe.police.uk/content/Q387.htm

It isn't illegal unless there is a by-law locally. But it has always been my understanding that it is illegal if you actually block the pavement, which to me means making it impossible or awkward for legitimate pavement users upto and including those on mobility scooters. In mjr's pic the pavement parking seems pointless. The road looks wide enough anyway.

tatanab
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Re: Pavement Parking

Postby tatanab » 6 Mar 2019, 7:58am

Patrickpioneer wrote:I used to think it was illegal to park on the pavement but its not in a lot of circumstances,
Parking on the pavement is not illegal because driving on the pavement IS. How else do they get there? Are they lifted on by invisible cranes? The law is the same article that is so often quoted about pavement cycling.

I might understand if a driver assesses a situation and makes a decision, but these days it is just routine to bump up onto the pavement - no thought involved.

If I think a vehicle is far enough on the pavement to cause me a problem I will make a point of walking in the road.

pwa
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Re: Pavement Parking

Postby pwa » 6 Mar 2019, 8:02am

I was trying to think of a place where some degree of pavement parking might have some possible justification, and I decided on this housing estate.

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.5801135 ... 6?hl=en-GB

Now I'm not excusing every instance of pavement parking you can see on Streetview there, but the cameras were there at a quiet time of day when a lot of folk are at work so later in the day it becomes harder to park. The roads are very narrow, often too narrow for a vehicle to park entirely on the road without forcing passing traffic to mount the pavement. There are legitimate off-road parking places, but too few at times when most people are at home. The only solution that would work would be removing the segregation (i.e. the footway) and making the whole carriageway into a shared use space with a very low speed limit. And I think that might work well. Traffic already moves around there slowly. The streets are purely residential, with no through traffic. Any thoughts?

kwackers
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Re: Pavement Parking

Postby kwackers » 6 Mar 2019, 8:19am

pwa wrote:I was trying to think of a place where some degree of pavement parking might have some possible justification, and I decided on this housing estate.

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.5801135 ... 6?hl=en-GB

Now I'm not excusing every instance of pavement parking you can see on Streetview there, but the cameras were there at a quiet time of day when a lot of folk are at work so later in the day it becomes harder to park. The roads are very narrow, often too narrow for a vehicle to park entirely on the road without forcing passing traffic to mount the pavement. There are legitimate off-road parking places, but too few at times when most people are at home. The only solution that would work would be removing the segregation (i.e. the footway) and making the whole carriageway into a shared use space with a very low speed limit. And I think that might work well. Traffic already moves around there slowly. The streets are purely residential, with no through traffic. Any thoughts?

In some cases it is justified-ish.
But you know what I'd do in cases where we want to allow it? Remove the pavement completely and make the road shared space. 5mph limit, pedestrians have absolute right of way no questions asked.

If you think about it that's what you've done anyway, if cars are on the pavement and ped's having to use the road why bother with pavements?

reohn2
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Re: Pavement Parking

Postby reohn2 » 6 Mar 2019, 8:39am

kwackers wrote:.........For 95% it's nothing other than habit and as we allow more and more folk to get away with it then it becomes more and more entrenched.

And that goes for most crime in modern day UK,it's become a right to break any law Joe/ess public sees fit to break because it's been let happen.
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Patrickpioneer
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Re: Pavement Parking

Postby Patrickpioneer » 6 Mar 2019, 8:43am

Up the road from me is part of an old estate, the roads are narrow, if they parked on both sides on the road, the road would be blocked and there is no room for everyone to park on one side of the road so its understandable they park as they do, but also near me is a wide main road and they still park on the pavement and I think its because they don't want to take the risk of the car getting scratched or bumped, I'm alright Jack sort of thing?
Pat

pwa
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Re: Pavement Parking

Postby pwa » 6 Mar 2019, 9:28am

kwackers wrote:
pwa wrote:I was trying to think of a place where some degree of pavement parking might have some possible justification, and I decided on this housing estate.

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.5801135 ... 6?hl=en-GB

Now I'm not excusing every instance of pavement parking you can see on Streetview there, but the cameras were there at a quiet time of day when a lot of folk are at work so later in the day it becomes harder to park. The roads are very narrow, often too narrow for a vehicle to park entirely on the road without forcing passing traffic to mount the pavement. There are legitimate off-road parking places, but too few at times when most people are at home. The only solution that would work would be removing the segregation (i.e. the footway) and making the whole carriageway into a shared use space with a very low speed limit. And I think that might work well. Traffic already moves around there slowly. The streets are purely residential, with no through traffic. Any thoughts?

In some cases it is justified-ish.
But you know what I'd do in cases where we want to allow it? Remove the pavement completely and make the road shared space. 5mph limit, pedestrians have absolute right of way no questions asked.

If you think about it that's what you've done anyway, if cars are on the pavement and ped's having to use the road why bother with pavements?

Yes, that's the solution I was thinking of. The only real problem with that is that it could make things worse for the blind. Not the moving traffic, which is already very slow and (believe it or not) mostly patient around there, but the parked vehicles making moving in a straight line less easy.