'Swerve the car' footage shows dangers of 'stupid' game

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thirdcrank
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Re: 'Swerve the car' footage shows dangers of 'stupid' game

Postby thirdcrank » 13 Mar 2018, 10:21am

Many years ago, my chief superintendent was a career traffic officer, out to grass on divisional policing. He used to chat with me about cycling but I don't think he had any interest other than from a traffic POV.

At that time the BMX craze was just starting, but it was only an extension of what was called "dirt tracking" around here.

His point was that there had been a time when quite young people had been able to set off on day trips on bikes, perhaps to the seaside, perhaps more locally, but riding with a purpose: to get somewhere. Hanging about in groups on street corners, with or without a bike, was aimless and likely to end in mischief. His feeling was that this start sometimes continued as people grew older so some became serious motor cyclists and others sat on their machines in the street, revving up pointlessly and being a pita. Also, cycling to destinations by road gave people a sound foundation as road users, which would serve them well later. In my capacity as someone who went riding all over the place as a teenager, I could only agree on that bit.

The real story here is that the huge increase in motor traffic has curtailed the freedom of not only young people to use the roads. If they cannot realistically go further than the end of the street whether they would like to or not, it's not suprising that some exploit and defend that space. We live in a cul-de-sac on a bit of a slope. When our children were small, one of the games they played was "wacky races" where children of all ages raced downhill on a range of bogeys (local term for soap box cart) and a book on a roller-skate (fore runner of the skateboard) etc. We dare not allow our grand children out onto the street unsupervised.

And the results of young people not getting that grounding as road users before they learn to drive are the subject of discussion on here daily.

reohn2
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Re: 'Swerve the car' footage shows dangers of 'stupid' game

Postby reohn2 » 13 Mar 2018, 10:29am

It seems about the stupidest thing you can do on a bike,as the caption in the video says,who's going to come off worst?
There's numerous threads on the forum about cars overtaking too close and the possible dangers,but it seems some folk think to challenge a car driver by playing chicken whilst wheeling is a challenge to the system,sorry but IMO it's more than stupid :?
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kwackers
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Re: 'Swerve the car' footage shows dangers of 'stupid' game

Postby kwackers » 13 Mar 2018, 10:46am

reohn2 wrote:It seems about the stupidest thing you can do on a bike,as the caption in the video says,who's going to come off worst?
There's numerous threads on the forum about cars overtaking too close and the possible dangers,but it seems some folk think to challenge a car driver by playing chicken whilst wheeling is a challenge to the system,sorry but IMO it's more than stupid :?

Of course it is; but they're kids.

Kids don't understand consequence and the adrenalin rush is simply a drug for them.
They're one of the reasons we have 20mph limits and one of the reasons the local FB page drives me nuts with their continual complaints about kids and the advice for dealing with them - advice such as "well I just drive at them and they either get out of the way or get hit".
What's funny is how the parents on that group have convinced themselves that those kids are from outside the area because "little Johnny wouldn't do that".

As a kid I used to specialise in cycling along the bridge wall over the railway and the more of my peers were about the faster I'd go. Stupid beyond belief - now, but back then it was exciting and I wasn't going to fall...

Kids do stupid things but it's easy to deal with. Just stop, they'd get bored within 20 seconds and move on. The more folk create about it the more the kids like doing it.

Bmblbzzz
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Re: 'Swerve the car' footage shows dangers of 'stupid' game

Postby Bmblbzzz » 13 Mar 2018, 11:04am

AlaninWales wrote:A fair way from home last summer with a multi-hour motorway journey ahead of me, kids on the local access road were doing this in front of me. I slowed and covered the brake. The whole group span around and cycled slowly (several doing wheelies) ahead of me. So I maintained a slow speed, smiled and shrugged. The one cycling beside me called out, they all got off the road and let me through (and got a thumbs up out of the window when I was past). In that case they were (I believe) deliberately slowing cars in their area, using cycling skill to do so.

bovlomov wrote:
AlaninWales wrote:In that case they were (I believe) deliberately slowing cars in their area, using cycling skill to do so.

I wasn't expecting that final conclusion.

This is worth pursuing - promoting children's naturally disruptive tendencies to challenge antisocial adult behaviours.

Interesting idea. It seems unlikely to me that they were doing this with "traffic calming" in mind, more likely engaging in that oldest of teenagers' and kids' games, winding up the grown ups. You were not wound up, so they treated you well, respected you. This doesn't mean they can't have been influenced by news of traffic calming etc in their choice of way to wind up the big stiff people, of course.

AlaninWales
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Re: 'Swerve the car' footage shows dangers of 'stupid' game

Postby AlaninWales » 13 Mar 2018, 11:06am

kwackers wrote:
reohn2 wrote:It seems about the stupidest thing you can do on a bike,as the caption in the video says,who's going to come off worst?
There's numerous threads on the forum about cars overtaking too close and the possible dangers,but it seems some folk think to challenge a car driver by playing chicken whilst wheeling is a challenge to the system,sorry but IMO it's more than stupid :?

Of course it is; but they're kids.

Kids don't understand consequence and the adrenalin rush is simply a drug for them.
They're one of the reasons we have 20mph limits and one of the reasons the local FB page drives me nuts with their continual complaints about kids and the advice for dealing with them - advice such as "well I just drive at them and they either get out of the way or get hit".
What's funny is how the parents on that group have convinced themselves that those kids are from outside the area because "little Johnny wouldn't do that".

As a kid I used to specialise in cycling along the bridge wall over the railway and the more of my peers were about the faster I'd go. Stupid beyond belief - now, but back then it was exciting and I wasn't going to fall...

Kids do stupid things but it's easy to deal with. Just stop, they'd get bored within 20 seconds and move on. The more folk create about it the more the kids like doing it.

Precisely!
One of the things I noticed about the footage released by the police, is that the "responsible" adults driving the cars did not stop: Yet it was the kids who were blamed! Had I collided with one of the kids doing this to me, it would (for me) have been entirely my fault. Apparently the police believe otherwise and continuing to drive into a child pulling a wheelie is acceptable :twisted: .

AlaninWales
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Re: 'Swerve the car' footage shows dangers of 'stupid' game

Postby AlaninWales » 13 Mar 2018, 11:20am

Bmblbzzz wrote:
AlaninWales wrote:A fair way from home last summer with a multi-hour motorway journey ahead of me, kids on the local access road were doing this in front of me. I slowed and covered the brake. The whole group span around and cycled slowly (several doing wheelies) ahead of me. So I maintained a slow speed, smiled and shrugged. The one cycling beside me called out, they all got off the road and let me through (and got a thumbs up out of the window when I was past). In that case they were (I believe) deliberately slowing cars in their area, using cycling skill to do so.

bovlomov wrote:
AlaninWales wrote:In that case they were (I believe) deliberately slowing cars in their area, using cycling skill to do so.

I wasn't expecting that final conclusion.

This is worth pursuing - promoting children's naturally disruptive tendencies to challenge antisocial adult behaviours.

Interesting idea. It seems unlikely to me that they were doing this with "traffic calming" in mind, more likely engaging in that oldest of teenagers' and kids' games, winding up the grown ups. You were not wound up, so they treated you well, respected you. This doesn't mean they can't have been influenced by news of traffic calming etc in their choice of way to wind up the big stiff people, of course.

Oh I doubt they were 'Green activists', their decision to slow the cars down was a wind-up (as you say) but also a territorial thing (as TC implies). It was deliberate and slowed cars: So fine by me, particularly as (you noticed) they reacted with respect when treated with such. Avsolutely no reason to drive at them as in the released footage. Kids will (and should) play and it is down to the drivers to control their vehicles responsibly.

thirdcrank
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Re: 'Swerve the car' footage shows dangers of 'stupid' game

Postby thirdcrank » 13 Mar 2018, 12:03pm

It's reminded me that when cars were a rarity in the cobbled streets where I lived from 1944 to 1954, if occasionally we saw one coming along the road which passed the end of our street, we'd all run backwards and forwards to see how many times we cross before the car reached us. I don't remember any stopping for us or even slowing down. It certainly never occurred to us that a car might be coming the other way. (I feel like Clive Dunn. :oops: )

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.79988 ... 312!8i6656

That streetview is during the day, but at night and weekends, these streets are now solid with parked cars. No games of cricket going on all day and certainly no street football: too much likelihood of damage to cars.

reohn2
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Re: 'Swerve the car' footage shows dangers of 'stupid' game

Postby reohn2 » 13 Mar 2018, 12:09pm

kwackers wrote:
reohn2 wrote:It seems about the stupidest thing you can do on a bike,as the caption in the video says,who's going to come off worst?
There's numerous threads on the forum about cars overtaking too close and the possible dangers,but it seems some folk think to challenge a car driver by playing chicken whilst wheeling is a challenge to the system,sorry but IMO it's more than stupid :?

Of course it is; but they're kids.

Kids don't understand consequence and the adrenalin rush is simply a drug for them.
They're one of the reasons we have 20mph limits and one of the reasons the local FB page drives me nuts with their continual complaints about kids and the advice for dealing with them - advice such as "well I just drive at them and they either get out of the way or get hit".
What's funny is how the parents on that group have convinced themselves that those kids are from outside the area because "little Johnny wouldn't do that".

As a kid I used to specialise in cycling along the bridge wall over the railway and the more of my peers were about the faster I'd go. Stupid beyond belief - now, but back then it was exciting and I wasn't going to fall...

Kids do stupid things but it's easy to deal with. Just stop, they'd get bored within 20 seconds and move on. The more folk create about it the more the kids like doing it.

I've done some stupid things as a child,playing chicken with cars on my bike isn't one of them,it isn't one of thembecause I respected my own mortality.
That said,I broke my arm a couple of times and spent 3months in hospital with a broken neck of the femur,and numerous other scrapes etc,none of which involved any other vehicles,though I was knocked down by a car when I was 5 and broke my collar bone.
Perhaps I see the world differently due to losing a granddaughter aged 19 to a lunatic motorcyclist aged 17,which was a direct extension of the kind of stunts in the linked article,and wouldn't want anyone to go through what our family has suffered as a result.

As for stopping should one of these children pull the same stunt on me when i was driving it would be an emergency stop.
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The utility cyclist
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Re: 'Swerve the car' footage shows dangers of 'stupid' game

Postby The utility cyclist » 13 Mar 2018, 1:19pm

Why didn't the driver come to a complete stop instead of driving toward them? Surely the law demands that the motorist has the lawful responsibility to try to avoid the collision by stopping?
Or does the application of the law only apply to Charlie Alliston and others on bikes when presented with another whom makes an error/mistake/does something 'stupid'?

Hertfordshire constabulary seem to have a lot of resources to make this video but when you are rear ended in a hit and run they won't do jack, except blame the victim.
They won't do anything when you report an assault by a bus driver and a further threat to put you in hospital but will threaten you with public order offence when you strike the bus with your fist after being driven at with said 10 ton bus!

They will openly make threatening and intimidatory calls to try to pursuade you that being driven at deliberately is a non event perverting the course of justice.
Herts police will blow you off when asking you to attend an interview over your complaint to the point you're waiting outside in the rain at an unmanned station.
Herts police will protect their own criminals within their force by lying and using excuses for their criminal behaviour and breaches of their sworn oath.
Herts police will fail/not be bothered to prosecute despite a Constable witnessing a confession of guilt when side swiped.

Herts police don't have the resources to keep the peace when it comes to people on bikes being attacked by motorists ... but they do have resources for this load of old pony. :twisted:
Oh and ehhshell bs, yet more pony, ghe human skull being less fragile than a cycle helmet.

Sorry but Herts police need to spend their money promoting safe driving and catching criminals behind the wheel.

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The utility cyclist
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Re: 'Swerve the car' footage shows dangers of 'stupid' game

Postby The utility cyclist » 13 Mar 2018, 1:38pm

Comparing kids on bikes as an extension to a lunatic motorcyclist who kills is so far removed.
How many children on bikes even acting stupidly have killed others ...ever?
I did plenty of stupid things, climbed into a power station to get a football back, jumped off an HGV and promptly knackered my ankle, I even played rugby as a kid and saw stuff just as "stupid" as what the kids on bikes are doing.
Dangling off the small bridge over the old dried up drain, sitting on it watching the cars go past, making pointy 'javelins' and chucking them at each other, riding on a main A road 30miles to the seaside and so on.

Wheelies down the street when there was a car coming down was common place, why, because we were there by right, this was our playground.

Take the motorist and their killing machine away and this is a non event.
I see this Incident as an extension of how we've taken virtually everywhere away from kids to play outside and/or space to cycle/play like kids with abandon and all the risks that that comes with.
Less risk than kids sitting indoors destined for a life of obesity and ill health with an attitude that it's the vulnerable that should always defer to might, always get out the way, always dress up in special gear so you don't get killed.

We constantly tell kids they should do this and shouldn't do that, indoctrinating them to lead their lives as motorists who don't give a monkeys, don't consider that it's they who are the hazard, that it's they who should make the sacrifice to get out the way or stop because without them there the harm would not be occuring, we know this for a fact.

I applaud these kids, taking back their streets, and the police are a disgrace for not prosecuting the motorist for dangerous driving.
We can't have a two tier system can we, we either prosecute all or none.

reohn2
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Re: 'Swerve the car' footage shows dangers of 'stupid' game

Postby reohn2 » 13 Mar 2018, 2:19pm

The utility cyclist wrote:Comparing kids on bikes as an extension to a lunatic motorcyclist who kills is so far removed.....

Read the post again.
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brynpoeth
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Re: 'Swerve the car' footage shows dangers of 'stupid' game

Postby brynpoeth » 13 Mar 2018, 4:58pm

TC mentioned Wacky Races, +1!
Dick Dastardly, the Arkansas Chugabug, there was a dog too I think (not ScoobyDo)
Had some happy times watching tivi when I was a yob
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cyclemad
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Re: 'Swerve the car' footage shows dangers of 'stupid' game

Postby cyclemad » 13 Mar 2018, 5:05pm

Feral Kids !!!

tatanab
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Re: 'Swerve the car' footage shows dangers of 'stupid' game

Postby tatanab » 13 Mar 2018, 5:35pm

brynpoeth wrote:There was a dog too I think (not ScoobyDo)
Mutley

thirdcrank
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Re: 'Swerve the car' footage shows dangers of 'stupid' game

Postby thirdcrank » 13 Mar 2018, 5:45pm

tatanab wrote:
brynpoeth wrote:There was a dog too I think (not ScoobyDo)
Mutley


Asd it was a mutt, it was Muttley :wink: