When do you know you should stop driving ( a car )?

[millimole]

There's certainly the 'stick' for elderly đ drivers to stop driving - but where's the carrot?
Driving is expensive, but a generous 'buy-back' scheme (possibly linked to a taxi firm) might be all that's needed to help some make the final decision.

I'm a trendy consumer. Just look at my Xtouch using hovercraft full of eels.

[ThePinkOne]

The carrot is important. Our society has become so organised around an assumption of car transport that an elderly person (or anyon else who cannot drive) is at a distinct disadvantage in most places outside London just for basics of shopping, social activity, work etc.

More local services and employment plus better public transport is needed if people are to be honest in giving up driving as they become less able to. A bike is not always the answer to such needs for everyone.

That approach would benefit everyone, but unfortunately if anything trends are in the opposite direction.

TPO

[mercalia]

I really can't believe there's not compulsory eyesight tests at set intervals, maybe 5 years, unless you've poor/deteriorating eyesight, in which case more often, surely opticians could log it directly on a DVLA website, much like garages log MOTs.?

I lived in Jerusalem years ago and needed to get a local, Israeli, driving licence. I was told that to get an application form I had to go and get my eyes tested and the optician would give me the application form if my eye sight was good enough.
I think that was a great way to stop people starting driving with poor eyesight.

nothing though to make them wear glasses when they are driving? just for the test. I think it is slow reactions that the main issue? even healthy young people dont realise there is a delay between noting a situation and reacting on it? eg you knock some thing off a table you see it fall but are helpless to grab it, you just stare at it falling? With old people I suspect it is worse? I think there needs to be a reaction test?

[Rob Archer]

I really can't believe there's not compulsory eyesight tests at set intervals, maybe 5 years, unless you've poor/deteriorating eyesight, in which case more often, surely opticians could log it directly on a DVLA website, much like garages log MOTs.?

I lived in Jerusalem years ago and needed to get a local, Israeli, driving licence. I was told that to get an application form I had to go and get my eyes tested and the optician would give me the application form if my eye sight was good enough.
I think that was a great way to stop people starting driving with poor eyesight.

nothing though to make them wear glasses when they are driving? just for the test. I think it is slow reactions that the main issue? even healthy young people dont realise there is a delay between noting a situation and reacting on it? eg you knock some thing off a table you see it fall but are helpless to grab it, you just stare at it falling? With old people I suspect it is worse? I think there needs to be a reaction test?

I'm following this thread with personal interest. Until about 7 years ago I was a regular driver, driving up to 5 000 miles a year for both personal use and work. A change in personal circumstances and work meant that I rarely drove - usually only about once every couple of months if that. After several months away from the wheel I found myself driving the family to a wedding. I suddenly felt very nervous and unhappy with handling traffic and the responsibility of having my wife and two young children in the car. On arrival I handed the keys to my wife saying 'I don't think I can hack this any more'. I haven't driven since although at the time I was considering taking refresher lessons. The decision was finally made for me a few months later when I had to surrender my licence for medical reasons.
I'm a confident, on road cyclist and can handle most situations. It's just that driving my family in two tons of high power machinery is no longer for me.
I gave up driving as I was no longer confident that I was up to modern - day driving. I just wish that more people would realise that and either get refresher lessons or hand over the keys.

I'm a trendy consumer. Just look at my GT-S7275R using hovercraft full of eels.

[Tangled Metal]

Curious about a few things related to this but don't know the answers so will ask here.

We all know how.important sight is but what importance, if any, does hearing have on safe driving?

If someone is deemed unsafe to drive is it likely that they're safe to ride a bicycle?

If glasses are needed to meet the necessary distance vision test (IIRC it was a case of pointing to a car and asking what the number plate was in my day). Is there any reason why they do not record this on the licence? I've still got a paper licence so there's no photograph of me with my glasses on. Should the licence state glasses are required to drive? That way any interaction with police due to bad driving and they're without glasses there's potential to take action. Sight being so important and all.

There's discussion over age earlier and I think.many would think older drivers are safer than young drivers based on statistics of road accidents or perception of that. However what about 70 year olds and 50 year olds? Which, on gut feeling without looking it up, would you expect one to be safer than the other? Would you feel safer in one car over the other?

[nosmarbaj]

Curious about a few things related to this but don't know the answers so will ask here.

We all know how.important sight is but what importance, if any, does hearing have on safe driving?

Hearing can add to the information about your surroundings that you have as a driver, but IMO it's possible to drive safely without good hearing (whether because the driver is deaf, or because they have the windows closed, or the radio/CD player on or whatever). It's not possible to drive safely without good vision.

If someone is deemed unsafe to drive is it likely that they're safe to ride a bicycle?

Depending on lots of factors it's quite likely they're not "safe" to cycle, but as always when discussing cycling competence, it has to be noted the chief danger is to the cyclist him/herself. Bad driving is also a danger to others.

If glasses are needed to meet the necessary distance vision test (IIRC it was a case of pointing to a car and asking what the number plate was in my day). Is there any reason why they do not record this on the licence? I've still got a paper licence so there's no photograph of me with my glasses on. Should the licence state glasses are required to drive? That way any interaction with police due to bad driving and they're without glasses there's potential to take action. Sight being so important and all.

Wouldn't work - driver could be wearing contact lenses. Maybe police could administer a quick roadside test (using number plates as in the driving test) - if driver fails they are taken to the police station for a formal test, or must visit an optician and pass a test before they are legally allowed to drive again. (I think police do have some such power already?)

There's discussion over age earlier and I think.many would think older drivers are safer than young drivers based on statistics of road accidents or perception of that. However what about 70 year olds and 50 year olds? Which, on gut feeling without looking it up, would you expect one to be safer than the other? Would you feel safer in one car over the other?

IMO I'm a better driver in my sixties than I was when 50 but I would say that, wouldn't I ... It's not just about eyesight; reaction time and the ability to make the correct decision quickly are as important. In an ideal world, maybe some sort of objective (likely computer-based) test of sight, and speed and appropriateness of reaction, would work. Taken say every 10 years until age 65, then every 2 years. Paid for by the driver so no extra cost to the state.

[Tonyf33]

Everybody to have eyesight tests as part of your annual tax/MOT/Insurance, obviously those dodgers which number over a million in the UK won't bother with this in any case.
Make driving with a medical condition a criminal offence with automatic jail sentences for those caught driving with X undeclared medical issue that cause anything other than a minor bump, any injury to an innocent party should be sentenced as aggravated assault ABH/GBH etc. Deliberate act of using a known killing weapon whilst you have such a condition that can effect your control of killing weapon.
OR
Doctors to reveal medical issues to DVLA, doesn't have to have specifics, just X person has a condition, this is likely to make them susceptible to X, lose control, not react/see etc. Is the life of another human being worth that small amount of privacy, no it absolutely is not.

The carrot for older drivers is called a FREE bus pass, the carrot for any driver that is not capable of being in full control/be able to react/understand hazards is that they won't kill/seriously injure anyone, what bigger carrot do you need than that?

Driving is taken almost as a god given right, it's too easy to get a license in the first place and then no testing/medical checks afterwards is a culpable act that kills and injures far too many! It's disgusting that government just ignore these deaths/serious injuries and will not do a single thing to change things.
The sooner we make laws to stop so many poor drivers allowed on the road the better it will be for everyone, it'll certainly increase cycling numbers.

[resus1uk]

In my Blue light drivers training we were warned about old men wearing a cap behind the wheel.
I came up behind one slowly driving into a village on an A road straddling the white line . I was in a big yellow truck, lit up like a Christmas tree and on siren/bullhorn.
He only moved over when his dog in the front passenger seat pawed his arm after looking back at us.

[mercalia]

In my Blue light drivers training we were warned about old men wearing a cap behind the wheel.
I came up behind one slowly driving into a village on an A road straddling the white line . I was in a big yellow truck, lit up like a Christmas tree and on siren/bullhorn.
He only moved over when his dog in the front passenger seat pawed his arm after looking back at us.

hmm seems like the dog should have been driving? seemed to have more wits than the old codger?

[Audax67]

I've done about 30 km on Autobahn with a puncture in one wheel - the car had handled so well it was hardly noticeable. Once I did notice it I drove to a friend's house, and there we found a neat slash in the sidewall: that's how I knew how far I had driven that way, since I had last been parked in Mannheim. I was about 45 at the time - maybe a bit young to stop driving for ever.

I would suspect that the Austrian, and maybe the German, police would lift the licence of anyone for driving a dangerous vehicle. If that person then appeared unfit to hold a licence it might be suspended permanently. Much the same anywhere, I suspect.

[Audax67]

In my Blue light drivers training we were warned about old men wearing a cap behind the wheel.

I shall make a point of wearing my Stetson in future.

[MikeF]

Then what effect do these slow drivers have on other road users? Whilst not condoning it there will be frustrated drivers taking risks to get past. Things like that happening around such drivers. How safe is that?

It's not slow drivers that are the problem. It's those that see it as a problem who are the problem. Substitute "slow driver" for cyclist.

[Tangled Metal]

Aaah but cyclists generally have no.ability to accelerate to the typical road speed but car drivers do. Cycling along at 10-15mph on a single carriageway a road is different from driving it at that speed when other vehicles could potentially do up to 60mph. As a cyclist I expect to be passed by cars, as a driver it is not as common on single carriageway roads. If you're driving at significantly below the speed of other road users there is a risk. Two metal boxes colliding or getting in contact. At least cyclists aren't going to damage the passengers and driver in a car that they contact.

A car is a big piece of machinery. You'd not operate a combine harvester or industrial machinery if your reactions are slow. Most people would accept they're past it. Driving is the one exception to this. It's because we are too reliant on personal transportation of the motorised format. It's allowed communication links to become greater but we haven't got the responsibility needed yet. Responsibility to accept we're a danger and try to change or give up on driving. Young or old irrelevant, if you're not safe you should take action yourself.

[Flinders]

The carrot for older drivers is called a FREE bus pass


Bu unfortunately that isn't much help when the local bus service has just been cut to nothing.

[Tonyf33]

The carrot for older drivers is called a FREE bus pass


Bu unfortunately that isn't much help when the local bus service has just been cut to nothing.

What, absolutely nothing? it must be a very small isolated location and small in number that has no bus service at all.
For the vast majority of pensioners there is a regular bus service, similarly as some people pick and choose what day they decide to do X, if they are not capable of driving safely I'd rather they took public transport or a private hire vehicle or cadge a lift from a friend/relative who can drive properly.