Cyclists in Stealth Mode.

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ACyclingRooster
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Cyclists in Stealth Mode.

Postby ACyclingRooster » 17 Dec 2016, 7:03pm

As a cyclist of many many years - indeed 56+yrs but more importantly as a driver that covers many thousands of miles each year and a great many hauling a 26ft twin axle caravan on the back of a large estate car - I see many many;far to many sights that really beggar belief.

The current one is cyclists of all ages with very poor lighting or absolutely no lighting at all on their bikes or even fastened to their bodies.

Why is this so ?

Are some of those bikes so expensive that there is no money left for protective High-Vis clothing and decent lights ?
Many are riding solo and without any High-Vis clothing at-all and often in country lanes and rural locations on filthy roads with hedgerows lining the road
which they blend into better than the birds that use them for shelter and gathering the last of the berries.
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reohn2
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Re: Cyclists in Stealth Mode.

Postby reohn2 » 17 Dec 2016, 7:23pm

But you saw them right?
If you see someone they're visible,if you don't they're not.
Whilst I agree there are some idiots with poor or no lighting,and I do wear bright clothing when cycling and use bright lights at night or in low light.
It's more idiotic drivers too busy texting or phoning someone or the many other things drivers do instead concentrating on actually driving.
But it doesn't stop at that,some of these morons overtaking me on blind bends or far too close,ie;< 0.6m too close,or driving far to fast for road conditions.

What's needed is a police force to deal with moronic and life threatening drivers which far out weigh and endanger the few moronic cyclists.

PS,I also drive a car and have towed caravans and trailers for over 40 years.
Last edited by reohn2 on 18 Dec 2016, 9:46am, edited 1 time in total.
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gaz
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Re: Cyclists in Stealth Mode.

Postby gaz » 17 Dec 2016, 7:28pm

ACyclingRooster wrote:Why is this so ?

Because unlit cyclists can still be seen and you are driving with an awareness that not every hazard on the road will be lit. You drive at a speed where you are sure you can stop within the distance you can see to be clear.

I am glad that you are still able to see these unlit cyclists on country lanes, not unlike seeing unlit pedestrians walking on country lanes, potholes, fallen trees, livestock, ...

I have no wish to condone unlit cycling, I have no wish to cycle unlit.

Edit: I assume the OP is referring to the hours of darkness when cycles are legally required to be lit.
Last edited by gaz on 18 Dec 2016, 8:16am, edited 1 time in total.
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tatanab
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Re: Cyclists in Stealth Mode.

Postby tatanab » 17 Dec 2016, 7:35pm

gaz wrote:I am glad that you are still able to see these unlit cyclists on country lanes, not unlike seeing unlit pedestrians walking on country lanes, potholes, fallen trees.
Not to mention unlit motor vehicles parked at the roadside. Isn't this why motor vehicles are equipped with 120 watts of blinding white light to illuminate their way?

Note - I am not condoning stealth cycling, just pointing out the primary purpose of lighting.

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gaz
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Re: Cyclists in Stealth Mode.

Postby gaz » 17 Dec 2016, 7:43pm

Some relevant history on CTC's stance here from Admin.

admin wrote:This is an interesting one from a cycling point of view. CTC was one of the first organisations to campaign for lights to be legally required on vehicles:

Winged Wheel by William Oakley wrote:In fact the CTC had been among the first to demand lights on vehicles, but just front lights to fix the onus of avoiding accidents on the overtaking vehicle. CTC members considered that drivers must see where they are were going and regulate their speed accordingly, and that red rear lights would only tend to invalidate the responsibility of the overtaker. And after years of agitation by the Club the Lights on Vehicles Act, 1907, did compel every vehicle to carry a white light in front at night.


Rear lights on bicycles were required in the First World War but CTC strongly campaigned to have this requirement removed in 1918 at the end of the war, and they continued to campaign against rear bicycle lights through the 1920's and 1930's. The Road Transport Lighting Act 1927 (discussion of the Bill in Parliament, and cyclists' rear lights is in Hansard) required cyclists to have either a rear light or a rear reflector.

Apart from periods during the world wars, bicycles were not required to have rear lights until the Road Transport Lighting (Cycles) Act 1945 became law on 7 March 1945.
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Cunobelin
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Re: Cyclists in Stealth Mode.

Postby Cunobelin » 17 Dec 2016, 7:49pm

As a cyclist of many many years - indeed 50+yrs but more importantly as a driver that covers many thousands of miles each year I see many many;far too many sights that really beggar belief.

The current one is vehicles of all ages with very poor / detective lighting or absolutely no lighting at all on their vehicles ...... and don't even mention the orange flashy things that are disabled as cars leave the sales room

As for the "ninja" vehicles that are dark colours parked in dark spaces and practically invisible

Why is this so ?

Are some of those cars so expensive that there is no money left for visible paint colours, decent lighting and working indicators ?

Many are driving and without any bright colouring or even Hi-Viz at-all on their vehicles

It is about time that cars were made to have working lights, have Hi-Viz markings and working indicators!d often in country lanes and rural locations on filthy roads with hedgerows lining the road which they blend into

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Spinners
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Re: Cyclists in Stealth Mode.

Postby Spinners » 17 Dec 2016, 8:18pm

Cunobelin wrote:
It is about time that cars were made to have working lights, have Hi-Viz markings and working indicators!d often in country lanes and rural locations on filthy roads with hedgerows lining the road which they blend into


And make the drivers wear helmets also :wink:
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[XAP]Bob
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Re: Cyclists in Stealth Mode.

Postby [XAP]Bob » 17 Dec 2016, 10:10pm

It's always amusing to ask people who tell me that I'm invisible who they are talking to...
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flat tyre
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Re: Cyclists in Stealth Mode.

Postby flat tyre » 17 Dec 2016, 11:15pm

Went out for a ride this afternoon, the early part of which was in foggy conditions. what amazed me was the number of cars driving in stealth mode with no lights on whatsoever!

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Re: Cyclists in Stealth Mode.

Postby wearwell » 17 Dec 2016, 11:36pm

ACyclingRooster wrote:As a cyclist of many many years - indeed 56+yrs but more importantly as a driver that covers many thousands of miles each year and a great many hauling a 26ft twin axle caravan on the back of a large estate car - I see many many;far to many sights that really beggar belief.

The current one is cyclists of all ages with very poor lighting or absolutely no lighting at all on their bikes or even fastened to their bodies.

Why is this so ?

Are some of those bikes so expensive that there is no money left for protective High-Vis clothing and decent lights ?
Many are riding solo and without any High-Vis clothing at-all and often in country lanes and rural locations on filthy roads with hedgerows lining the road
which they blend into better than the birds that use them for shelter and gathering the last of the berries.
Agree. Camouflage cyclists. No need nowadays - LED lights are relatively cheap and highly effective and a yellow top is essential on any busy road.

drossall
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Re: Cyclists in Stealth Mode.

Postby drossall » 18 Dec 2016, 8:25am

Of course it makes sense to use good lights, and nearly everyone here probably does. In fact, in a forum such as this, most of probably have lights far above minimum brightness (and cost). It's like asking keen footballers about the benefits of fitness training.

However, the point of the CTC campaign mentioned above was that lights give extra visibility, and the duty of drivers to see cyclists (or anything in front of them) exists anyway. If we're ever to achieve good road safety, that's what we need - both sides doing everything they can, not either side trying to pass the responsibility onto the other.

If this had put into practice in the courts, hitting a stealth cyclist would have brought condemnation. Hitting a lit cyclist would have brought incredulity. In fact, of course, the law was changed to raise the bar of cycling visibility.

That bar continues to rise now, with hi-vis, flashing lights, and so on.

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Spinners
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Re: Cyclists in Stealth Mode.

Postby Spinners » 18 Dec 2016, 8:41am

ACyclingRooster wrote:
The current one is cyclists of all ages with very poor lighting or absolutely no lighting at all on their bikes or even fastened to their bodies.



Could I clarify one thing. You do mean at night, don't you?
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gaz
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Re: Cyclists in Stealth Mode.

Postby gaz » 18 Dec 2016, 8:48am

In collisions involving a bicycle and another vehicle, the most common key contributory factor recorded by the police is ‘failed to look properly’...
RoSPA.

When drivers "look properly" they see unlit cyclists. When drivers don't "look properly" ...

Thread about a West Sussex Police study reporting 90% of cyclists injured in collisions during the hours of darkness were using lights.
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Re: Cyclists in Stealth Mode.

Postby mjr » 18 Dec 2016, 8:57am

flat tyre wrote:Went out for a ride this afternoon, the early part of which was in foggy conditions. what amazed me was the number of cars driving in stealth mode with no lights on whatsoever!

This. Visibility yesterday was down below 50m (lights on when it dips below 100m IIRC) and there were still motorists hurtling along single track unlit :-( I was very glad we could put bright and steady dynamo lit riders at each end of the group, with some bright German lights scattered among.
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reohn2
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Re: Cyclists in Stealth Mode.

Postby reohn2 » 18 Dec 2016, 10:01am

flat tyre wrote:Went out for a ride this afternoon, the early part of which was in foggy conditions. what amazed me was the number of cars driving in stealth mode with no lights on whatsoever!


Last night we went for a Pizza and to the cinema,it was foggy and there weren't many vehicles out on the roads.
In the 10mile drive in darkness and fog I counted 5 vehicles with defective lights,and umpteen driving well over the speed limit including two driving like in a race,and I was tailgated by three vehicles so close I couldn't see their headlights in my RVM :?
I took it easy on the 4mile motorway part of the journey and saw more than half a dozen cars driving well in excess the 70mph limit this is in fog!
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