Cars overtaking and then slowing down.

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Postboxer
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Re: Cars overtaking and then slowing down.

Postby Postboxer » 29 Dec 2016, 8:05pm

Username wrote:On the contrary, I have issues when people speed up while I am overtaking on my motorbike. Usually accelerating away onto a motorway, or from a dual carriageway roundabout, I start overtaking. As I reach cruising speed I find the car I have overtaken has speeded up before I complete the overtake. I then have to speed up even more, pull in and reduce speed to cruising pace. Motorists (and people in general) can be a nuisance.


If I understand this correctly, you are moving out to overtake, whilst they are also accelerating away from a roundabout? I would have thought that as the overtaker, the onus is on you to do it at a safe time and ensure you can complete the manoeuvre, if they are accelerating from a roundabout, or down a slip road, isn't it up to you to either speed up and out accelerate them, or to abort and brake to pull in behind them? I remember once whilst aborting an overtake, the car I was overtaking also braked, so we were side by side for a while until we'd both slowed down far more than necessary and I managed to slow down more to pull in behind them. It appears I disagree with -

Rule 168
Being overtaken. If a driver is trying to overtake you, maintain a steady course and speed, slowing down if necessary to let the vehicle pass. Never obstruct drivers who wish to pass. Speeding up or driving unpredictably while someone is overtaking you is dangerous. Drop back to maintain a two-second gap if someone overtakes and pulls into the gap in front of you.


Which contradicts itself, saying maintain a steady course and speed, and to slow down, which are different things. If you pull out to overtake a vehicle which itself is already accelerating, it seems unfair to force them to stop accelerating, especially if they are on a slip road heading towards a motorway.

brynpoeth
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Re: Cars overtaking and then slowing down.

Postby brynpoeth » 29 Dec 2016, 8:24pm

Bonefishblues wrote:
brynpoeth wrote:
Bonefishblues wrote:Which is good practice, I think, and then beckon them past once you can see all's clear ahead.

I would typically occupy the centre line so there was no possibility of an attempt to pass, and then wave them through asap. I often get an acknowledgement of thanks.


Do not wave them past! Only a police officer in uniform may direct traffic.

I think that I'll probably carry on doing what I do to our mutual benefit. I doubt that it's an activity the police would take much interest in. :D


It is the law, one should obey the law even if there are no cops around. You can not be sure it is safe to pass. Many "accidents" are caused by waving others on. Better for everyone to "lose" a few seconds.
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PhilWhitehurst
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Re: Cars overtaking and then slowing down.

Postby PhilWhitehurst » 29 Dec 2016, 8:31pm

Nonsense of course you can tell if it's safe to pass in many circumstances. It's not some voodoo magic to work out.

brynpoeth
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Re: Cars overtaking and then slowing down.

Postby brynpoeth » 29 Dec 2016, 8:42pm

PhilWhitehurst wrote:Nonsense of course you can tell if it's safe to pass in many circumstances. It's not some voodoo magic to work out.


I can not decide for another what they should do.

The law says: only a police officer in uniform may direct traffic. That is enough for me, I do not need to think about or question what parliament decided.

Besides, I was once in an "accident" caused by someone waving another on. My vehicle was written off. We must all stick to the letter and spirit of the law.
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Bonefishblues
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Re: Cars overtaking and then slowing down.

Postby Bonefishblues » 29 Dec 2016, 9:04pm

brynpoeth wrote:
Bonefishblues wrote:
brynpoeth wrote:
Do not wave them past! Only a police officer in uniform may direct traffic.

I think that I'll probably carry on doing what I do to our mutual benefit. I doubt that it's an activity the police would take much interest in. :D


It is the law, one should obey the law even if there are no cops around. You can not be sure it is safe to pass. Many "accidents" are caused by waving others on. Better for everyone to "lose" a few seconds.

Indeed they are. I too was the victim of an accident caused by someone being waved on whilst in my car. As indeed are many caused by an impatient or unsighted driver doing something foolish. I'd really rather that they didn't do this when I'm in such a supremely vulnerable position, hence my approach.

As I say, I think I'll continue with my approach, which serves me well (and not get into an argument about your view that I am "directing traffic" contrary to the will of Parliament :) )
Last edited by Bonefishblues on 5 Jan 2017, 9:13pm, edited 1 time in total.

PhilWhitehurst
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Re: Cars overtaking and then slowing down.

Postby PhilWhitehurst » 5 Jan 2017, 9:02pm

brynpoeth wrote:
PhilWhitehurst wrote:Nonsense of course you can tell if it's safe to pass in many circumstances. It's not some voodoo magic to work out.


I can not decide for another what they should do.

The law says: only a police officer in uniform may direct traffic. That is enough for me, I do not need to think about or question what parliament decided.

Besides, I was once in an "accident" caused by someone waving another on. My vehicle was written off. We must all stick to the letter and spirit of the law.


You're not directing traffic. Just saying I know you are there, I believe it's safe , please pass now

Ruadh495
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Re: Cars overtaking and then slowing down.

Postby Ruadh495 » 6 Jan 2017, 9:38am

PhilWhitehurst wrote:You're not directing traffic. Just saying I know you are there, I believe it's safe , please pass now


That's how I would put it. You are communicating that you are prepared to be passed. It's up to the other road user to decide if it is safe to do so. That's not "directing", it's signaling. Of course, a court might not agree...

I use an unofficial "please pass" signal when pulling into a passing place to let a following car through. It's quite common for the car to start to pull in behind me on the assumption that I have seen an oncoming vehicle they have missed, so I communicate that my reason for pulling over is to let them pass. Another circumstance is where the road width requires a close pass at low speed. This is OK (IMO) if the cyclist is expecting it and agrees to it. You can signal that you are.

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[XAP]Bob
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Re: Cars overtaking and then slowing down.

Postby [XAP]Bob » 6 Jan 2017, 10:39am

One issue I have on my commute is that there are a number of drivers who seem afraid to overtake me - long straight road, no oncoming traffic. They're paralysed by the 'what is that?'

Waving them past is often the only way to wake them up.
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
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Re: Cars overtaking and then slowing down.

Postby MikeF » 10 Jan 2017, 5:20pm

Two today, but the first a real "good" one.

1. I'm at a mini 3 way roundabout just turning left onto the slow, but busy main road. An ambulance, sirens wailing, is approaching from my right making its way through the traffic. I stop near the side of the road leaving plenty of room between me and the traffic island for the ambulance to go round the r/a and continue its way through the traffic. However Mrs MGIF, who arrives at the r/a just after me, and from the same direction in her oversized shopping trolley with a personal number plate, decides this is an "ideal" gap for turning left and passing me. She does just in front of the ambulance and is immediately held up by the traffic in front. The ambulance cannot pass her as there is no enough room between her car and the traffic island so it waits with sirens wailing. Total gridlock. After about 10-15 seconds she makes an attempt to drive on the pavement and drives a front wheel on it and waits. Still the ambulance cannot pass. After more delay she manages to drive a bit further onto the pavement and the ambulance can continue, but, overall, her inconsiderate driving must have delayed the ambulance by 20seconds or more. In fact she herself wouldn't have lost much time had she stayed behind me. :roll:

2. 20mph town zone. I stop in primary at pedestrian lights with car behind me. Just after I started off again she roars past me to make sure she can cross the traffic lights at green ahead. It was a wide enough pass so I cannot complain about that. :) However the problem for her was that just after she had crossed the junction there was a bus coming in the opposite direction, so she had to stop smartly. If I'd still been in front there would have been ample room for me to cycle safely through the gap. I followed her up the road as far as I wanted to go, but in time she didn't gain anything and I think I could have cycled faster.
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blackbike
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Re: Cars overtaking and then slowing down.

Postby blackbike » 10 Jan 2017, 11:32pm

The motorists who annoy me are the ones who pull in right to the kerb when they are stuck behind a vehicle waiting to turn right.

They unnecessarily block the road for bikes and motorbikes.

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mjr
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Re: Cars overtaking and then slowing down.

Postby mjr » 11 Jan 2017, 1:56pm

Stevek76 wrote:Few drivers tend to look more than 1 vehicle/50 metres (whichever is less) ahead and this becomes particularly bad when they have a bicycle infront of them. They become obsessed with overtaking the bike and fail to check if it's actually worth doing so.

Amen. I've even known a motorist so obsessed with overtaking the bike in a cycle lane to their left that they've driven straight into the back of a stationary car in their lane! :eek:

blackbike wrote:The motorists who annoy me are the ones who pull in right to the kerb when they are stuck behind a vehicle waiting to turn right.

They unnecessarily block the road for bikes and motorbikes.

The ones who annoy me are the ones who mount the cycle track to drive past a vehicle waiting to the right (see pic below). No matter how wide they make the roads, some motorists will still try to take more.
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[XAP]Bob
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Re: Cars overtaking and then slowing down.

Postby [XAP]Bob » 11 Jan 2017, 2:55pm

MikeF wrote:Two today, but the first a real "good" one.

1. I'm at a mini 3 way roundabout just turning left onto the slow, but busy main road. An ambulance, sirens wailing, is approaching from my right making its way through the traffic. I stop near the side of the road leaving plenty of room between me and the traffic island for the ambulance to go round the r/a and continue its way through the traffic. However Mrs MGIF, who arrives at the r/a just after me, and from the same direction in her oversized shopping trolley with a personal number plate, decides this is an "ideal" gap for turning left and passing me. She does just in front of the ambulance and is immediately held up by the traffic in front. The ambulance cannot pass her as there is no enough room between her car and the traffic island so it waits with sirens wailing. Total gridlock. After about 10-15 seconds she makes an attempt to drive on the pavement and drives a front wheel on it and waits. Still the ambulance cannot pass. After more delay she manages to drive a bit further onto the pavement and the ambulance can continue, but, overall, her inconsiderate driving must have delayed the ambulance by 20seconds or more. In fact she herself wouldn't have lost much time had she stayed behind me. :roll:


This is one place where hand signals are useful. When I see blue lights I generally make suitable accommodation on the road (as you did) but also signal to the vehicles following that that is what I am doing. In general they take the hint and stop behind me, then notice the blue lights as they fly past.
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.

roubaixtuesday
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Re: Cars overtaking and then slowing down.

Postby roubaixtuesday » 11 Jan 2017, 3:43pm

No matter how wide they make the roads, some motorists will still try to take more.


Recent altercation on my (narrow) road with motorist about 200 yards from home. It's essentially single track with traffic calming islands protruding on each side of the road alternately to limit speed. Used as a rat run and busy at rush hour.

I'm in a queue of traffic. Coming towards me, a motorist is driving half on the pavement (directly at a pedestrian) in order to avoid waiting. I stop and indicate to wind down his window.

Me: "Please don't drive along the pavement"
Motorist: "What do you expect me to do?"
Me: "Um. Wait for a gap in the traffic then drive on the road. You were driving straight at a pedestrian"
Motorist: "I let them know I was coming" [I have no idea what they meant by this]
Me: "It's illegal to drive on the pavement"
Motorist: "You are so arrogant" [obviously, I'm the arrogant one here]
Me: "You are driving on the pavement. You are breaking the law. Please don't do it again" [cycles off, shaking head]
Pedestrian [as I cycle past having caught up with them - they walked past while the above was happening] "Thank you"
Me: "Motorists are unbelievable sometimes"

reohn2
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Re: Cars overtaking and then slowing down.

Postby reohn2 » 11 Jan 2017, 5:20pm

blackbike wrote:The motorists who annoy me are the ones who pull in right to the kerb when they are stuck behind a vehicle waiting to turn right.

They unnecessarily block the road for bikes and motorbikes.

You mean stop you from going up the inside between the kerb and the car waiting to go straight on?.
Those drivers that 'close the door' on that kind of inside undertake are doing you huge favour.
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mjr
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Re: Cars overtaking and then slowing down.

Postby mjr » 11 Jan 2017, 6:18pm

reohn2 wrote:
blackbike wrote:The motorists who annoy me are the ones who pull in right to the kerb when they are stuck behind a vehicle waiting to turn right.

They unnecessarily block the road for bikes and motorbikes.

You mean stop you from going up the inside between the kerb and the car waiting to go straight on?.
Those drivers that 'close the door' on that kind of inside undertake are doing you huge favour.

They're really not. "Undertake" is motoring propaganda. Left-side overtaking/filtering is legal, mentioned in the highway code (even for cars passing slow/stopped cars!) and a good way to increase traffic flow. We've had this discussion a few times before.
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