The safest way to cross a roundabout?

[mjr]

Really not happy? get off and walk the bike.

And complain to the highway authority that you don't feel safe there, please. Nothing will change if we just meekly dismount at every piece of crap design.

[meic]

Is it really crap design if it serves 10,000 people well for every one person inconvenienced in this way?
Underpasses dont come for free.

[mjr]

Is it really crap design if it serves 10,000 people well for every one person inconvenienced in this way?
Underpasses dont come for free.

Where is your line? Is something good design if it's known to kill 1 in 100,000 users? Would it still be OK if it only killed 1 in 100,000 but all those killed were disabled?

You don't need underpasses every time - look at the Netherlands. Some do, some don't. And in future, it would often be cheaper to put underpass tubes in than move the rest of the earth to make a solid artificial embankment. Some places you don't even need to do that because there are already underpasses that used to carry railways and/or still carry farm or service roads and things like that - they could be opened tomorrow with bridleway creation and improvement orders, but this country just doesn't do stuff like that. It seems we would rather tell people to get off/out and push their vehicles.

[meic]

It seems we would rather tell people to get off/out and push their vehicles.

I would rather get off/out and push my vehicle than have a million pounds spent just to enable me not to so once a month. Even if there are twenty others like me over the course of a year.

You don't need underpasses every time - look at the Netherlands

The Netherlands doesnt have the extremely unbalanced ratios between cyclists and motors that we have. I bet there are not many pedestrian crossings on the road across the Nevada desert, possibly a thousand miles between them. Not a case of bad design just a recognition of the levels of use.

[mjr]

You don't need underpasses every time - look at the Netherlands

The Netherlands doesnt have the extremely unbalanced ratios between cyclists and motors that we have. I bet there are not many pedestrian crossings on the road across the Nevada desert, possibly a thousand miles between them. Not a case of bad design just a recognition of the levels of use.

Like the joke goes, you don't judge demand for a bridge by the numbers currently swimming across the river. The Severn Bridge could not have been justified simply by the numbers using the ferry it replaced. Infrastructure planning should cater for the levels we want, not only provide for the levels we currently have. So, do we want cycling levels closer to those of the Netherlands or the Nevada desert?

[meic]

We seem to be surviving by just using one of the Severn crossings for cyclists.
Would any bridge crossing have been built at all if it wasnt for the demand from motor transport?
I really doubt it, a small ferry would be more likely. The train lines dont allow cyclists in their tunnel either.

[Si]

Having said that, when teaching adults to deal with traffic who enquire about "how do I do roundabouts?" my start gambit is usually asking how they'd do them in their car, ....
Pete.

i used to do that but found i ended up having to tell half of them how to do it properly in a car before i started to tell them how to do it on a bike

My 2p's worth...

Roundabouts like all situations....before you get there work out what the threats will be, prioritise and then plan evasion strategies. As you enter and ride the roundabout observe based upon the prioritised threat list and employ evasion strategy if required, otherwise continue to plan for new threats ahead and to plan new evasion strategies to counter.

Generic chief threats on roundabouts - people entering when they should give way, people overtaking and cutting you up, people ramming you from the rear, especially on entry if you slow when they think there is enough time to make the gap.
1. Look at what they are doing.....their approach speed, where are they looking; ride where you can be seen - often centre of correct lane, not in another vehicle's shadow; let them know where you are going if its not obvious; make eye contact then watch their front wheel; adjust your speed such that you can stop if they suddenly go, etc etc
2. If possible ride in a possition where people are only going to pass you on one side so that you dont have to manage traffic coming at you from all sides. If stuff is coming past you close turn round and give it the death stare etc. Know where you are going ifnthey do cut across you before they do it.
3. Dont just fixate on the roundabout.....have a proper look behind on your approach, death stare, get that following drivers attention.....make them have to think about what you are doing, make them ask themselves 'why the eck is he glaring at me?' If you think you might need to stop then be in the right gear to get going quickly again and get yout pedal up ready to go straight away.

Then youve got all the other stuff like hazardous road surface (gets warn quicker here due to all the stopping and starting), loads of slippery white paint everywhere, sudden side winds as roundabouts can be more open than surrounding roads, peds who like you are consentrating on the motor traffic and ignoring all else, etc etc etc. Its a nightmare out there

Alternatively go for the baldrick school of road safety.....buy a car, buy some spray paint, lock the car in your garage, paint your name on the side....,

[Dominic]

for me it depends how big the roundabout is. If it's a small one then I just check over my right side to see if there's a car coming, then I "own" the lane and do the normal manouver .
If it's a large roundabout then I would never be in the middle. I always hug the centre (right) of the lane, (obviously if i'm going right and then as I need to head to my chosen exit i check over my left and switch lanes.
I also try to increase my speed to attempt to speed match as much as possible.

Ditto

[landsurfer]

Over 50% of my rides either start or finish at a major roundabout near my home.

This is my way.

Watch; Watch the traffic on the roundabout before you enter it, if their indicating be prepared for them doing something different.
Position; I enter the roundabout then take position in the middle of the roundabout lanes i.e. the line between the two lanes, as soon as i enter the roundabout.
Signalling; Big, full arm extended signals. No doubt where i'm going signals.
Eye contact; Look at every waiting driver, at their entries to the roundabout, in the eye.
Have they seen you ? If in doubt look for a possible escape route.

I'm a big bloke, in a red jersey with red track mitts.
I aim to make myself as visible as possible and to control or influence the traffic entering the roundabout as i go round it.... so far it seems to have worked ... so far ..

[Vorpal]

I enter the roundabout then take position in the middle of the roundabout lanes i.e. the line between the two lanes, as soon as i enter the roundabout.

IMO This encourages people to overtake on both sides.

I once entered a roundabout between lanes. I was forced into this position by drivers deliberately blocking me from entering a travel lane I didn't find it a comfortable way to go round, and I did have drivers overtaking on both sides. I moved into a lane as soon as it was safe to do so. I really think that travelling between lanes is only safe when traffic is standing or slow, and I get to choose where and when to filter.

On a roundabout, I would *much* rather take the lane from the beginning and use it as if I were driving a car.

Making yourself big; that is using an upright position and clear signals is definitely a good idea, though.

[Cyril Haearn]

Having said that, when teaching adults to deal with traffic who enquire about "how do I do roundabouts?" my start gambit is usually asking how they'd do them in their car, ....
Pete.

i used to do that but found i ended up having to tell half of them how to do it properly in a car before i started to tell them how to do it on a bike

My 2p's worth...

Roundabouts like all situations....before you get there work out what the threats will be, prioritise and then plan evasion strategies. As you enter and ride the roundabout observe based upon the prioritised threat list and employ evasion strategy if required, otherwise continue to plan for new threats ahead and to plan new evasion strategies to counter.

Generic chief threats on roundabouts - people entering when they should give way, people overtaking and cutting you up, people ramming you from the rear, especially on entry if you slow when they think there is enough time to make the gap.
1. Look at what they are doing.....their approach speed, where are they looking; ride where you can be seen - often centre of correct lane, not in another vehicle's shadow; let them know where you are going if its not obvious; make eye contact then watch their front wheel; adjust your speed such that you can stop if they suddenly go, etc etc
2. If possible ride in a possition where people are only going to pass you on one side so that you dont have to manage traffic coming at you from all sides. If stuff is coming past you close turn round and give it the death stare etc. Know where you are going ifnthey do cut across you before they do it.
3. Dont just fixate on the roundabout.....have a proper look behind on your approach, death stare, get that following drivers attention.....make them have to think about what you are doing, make them ask themselves 'why the eck is he glaring at me?' If you think you might need to stop then be in the right gear to get going quickly again and get yout pedal up ready to go straight away.

Then youve got all the other stuff like hazardous road surface (gets warn quicker here due to all the stopping and starting), loads of slippery white paint everywhere, sudden side winds as roundabouts can be more open than surrounding roads, peds who like you are consentrating on the motor traffic and ignoring all else, etc etc etc. Its a nightmare out there

Alternatively go for the baldrick school of road safety.....buy a car, buy some spray paint, lock the car in your garage, paint your name on the side....,

What is the death stare?
Is it not better to avoid eye contact, keep them guessing?

[Vorpal]

I also look at waiting drivers. If they start edging forward, or they are approaching the roundabout and not (in my opinion) slowing enough, I give them the eye.

It's the same sort of look I give my kids when they are doing something they know they shouldn't.

[landsurfer]

I enter the roundabout then take position in the middle of the roundabout lanes i.e. the line between the two lanes, as soon as i enter the roundabout.

IMO This encourages people to overtake on both sides.

Heres the thing, I have never been overtaken by any vehicle on this roundabout, maybe we have well trained drivers in Rotherham, but i doubt it ... Maybe the big guy in the bright shirt just stands out.
The roundabout is at Bawtry Rd, Wickersley, Rotherham S66 1JY, well thats the pub next to it.

[Vorpal]

I enter the roundabout then take position in the middle of the roundabout lanes i.e. the line between the two lanes, as soon as i enter the roundabout.

IMO This encourages people to overtake on both sides.

Heres the thing, I have never been overtaken by any vehicle on this roundabout, maybe we have well trained drivers in Rotherham, but i doubt it ... Maybe the big guy in the bright shirt just stands out.
The roundabout is at Bawtry Rd, Wickersley, Rotherham S66 1JY, well thats the pub next to it.

This is the one that gave me the most trouble https://www.google.no/maps/@51.8684333, ... 312!8i6656

[Mick F]

+1 from me too.

Take the lane and stay in control.