Temporary Traffic Lights and Cyclists

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[XAP]Bob
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Re: Temporary Traffic Lights and Cyclists

Postby [XAP]Bob » 20 Sep 2017, 2:53pm

BakfietsUK wrote:I like the "cycle time" pun [XAP]Bob. Two minutes is interesting I was not aware of that. Do you know where it is written. I love the USA and the pragmatic approach to procedure. We could really do with some of that.


http://lmgtfy.com/?q=uk+traffic+light+cycle+time (sorry, it's too long since I've used that ;) :lol: )

Various sources seem to agree that it is a conventional UK max, but I don't know if any have statutory force.
If you are waiting more than two minutes (in the absence of other traffic) then I think it is entirely reasonable to assume that the lights are faulty and proceed with caution.
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.

boliston
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Re: Temporary Traffic Lights and Cyclists

Postby boliston » 24 Sep 2017, 10:02pm

a few years ago i was going up a local b road hill climb called corfe hill where there were temp lights but no way of telling how long they were as the road has many bends - when the lights changed to green i was first in the queue so had quite a few cars behind but the one way section was a lot longer than i thought and no way to stop safely to let any cars overtake - some cars started coming down the other way and luckily they had to slow down as there were cars behind me coming up and once the vehicles had stopped i could just about cycle past them but i seem to remember quite a lot of horn tooting - nothing overtook me for the next couple of miles so i'd imagine the cars following behind me had to reverse back down

old_windbag
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Re: Temporary Traffic Lights and Cyclists

Postby old_windbag » 24 Sep 2017, 10:34pm

I had to stop at a temporary light today. I could not see if cars were waiting at other end as it was on a bend. I waited for what seemed like an age then it changed to green and I proceeded, but I was at the point of considering setting off on red as it may not have detected me. Anyway having been in this situation too many times I think the sensor should flash an led constantly to indicate a vehicle has been detected so you know it has responded to your prescence, then clear itself before next amber to red, not that difficult to add to the design.

Pete Owens
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Re: Temporary Traffic Lights and Cyclists

Postby Pete Owens » 24 Sep 2017, 11:30pm

Its not just temporary lights.

The formula for calculating the all-red stage at conventional lights doesn't allow for cycling speed. It is not a problem at small junctions (we can get up to 10 mph as fast as a car by which time we will have cleared a small junction). However if the junction is large with splitter islands there often isn't enoght time to clear it before conflicting traffic gets a green.

I have to make a right turn on my commute here:
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.343237,-2.6304882,3a,75y,247.76h,88.98t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1svdVc6l6HGj92vgORS8VCEQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
And it is common for the traffic turning left from the opposite direction to start before I clear the junction.

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661-Pete
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Re: Temporary Traffic Lights and Cyclists

Postby 661-Pete » 25 Sep 2017, 6:39am

It's perhaps one excuse for:
1. Getting in front of the foremost vehicle, and
2. Taking the whole roadworks stretch in primary position, preventing any following vehicle from passing.
Anti-social? "Not my problem, mate!" Leastways, I'd be tempted to retort thus, if challenged.......
Suppose that this room is a lift. The support breaks and down we go with ever-increasing velocity.
Let us pass the time by performing physical experiments...
--- Arthur Eddington (creator of the Eddington Number).

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Mick F
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Re: Temporary Traffic Lights and Cyclists

Postby Mick F » 25 Sep 2017, 7:23am

I came up to a temp traffic light the other day, It was red. I stopped.
Three or four minutes later, it was still red.
Traffic came towards me, then a pause, then more traffic.
Mine was still on red.
I went through the lights on red, and saw some workers, so I slowed and told them that their lights are defective.
They actually weren't "defective", but badly set as it wouldn't change for cyclists.

Some months ago, there were temp lights and roadworks on the hill up towards Tavistock. It's the busy A390 and I took my place stopped with the traffic.
The lights went to green, and off we went up the hill.
The lane was wide enough at first for the traffic following me to overtake, which left me in a very low gear grinding up the hill.
The roadworks were perhaps 150yds long and the lane got narrow bordered by a high rocky bank and the continuous roadworks barriers - no cones, just a "solid" fence of barrier.
The lights went to green at the far end and the lead vehicle was a huge artic.
Off he set towards me, and I kept going! I had no option, other than turn round and have to repeat the whole thing ad infinitum. :lol:
The lorry driver stopped, and so did I, We were perhaps 5yds apart and glowering at each other.
He blasted his horn.
I remained stopped.

Eventually, one of the workers pulled a barrier away to let me out.
The traffic went through, then I set off again up the hill and away.
Mick F. Cornwall

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Patrickpioneer
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Re: Temporary Traffic Lights and Cyclists

Postby Patrickpioneer » 25 Sep 2017, 11:21am

I get off and become a pedestrian, then no one can say a damn thing.

Bmblbzzz
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Re: Temporary Traffic Lights and Cyclists

Postby Bmblbzzz » 25 Sep 2017, 1:06pm

The 2-minute 'cycle time' might be a decent average guideline but clearly makes no allowance for the length of the roadworks section nor the presence of junctions within it. At some (permanent) traffic lights on narrow bridges and the like, there are notices with advice to cyclists to wait a full cycle and go at the beginning of the green in order to get through before the other direction gets green. It could all act as a reminder to everyone that green does not (theoretically and legally) mean a simple "go".

Tangled Metal
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Re: Temporary Traffic Lights and Cyclists

Postby Tangled Metal » 25 Sep 2017, 1:26pm

Sorry but what's the problem? Move to the front of the traffic queue waiting on red then take the primary position so no car can pass. Simple pootle through with the combined mass of all the cars and vans stuck behind you. If the lights turn green before getting through then any car setting off will not get past so most likely they'll wait. If they don't then two opposing streams of traffic create a blockage and standstill. You must ride past the traffic blockage and happy days.

BTW I've done that have didn't get any punishment close passes or many horns going off. Used to do it all the time when they were building the heysham link road. The contractors worked out the issue and we got longer green light periods. Try it, it works!

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meic
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Re: Temporary Traffic Lights and Cyclists

Postby meic » 25 Sep 2017, 1:30pm

That sort of inconsiderate treatment of other road users falls way below the standards that I set for myself.
Yma o Hyd

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[XAP]Bob
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Re: Temporary Traffic Lights and Cyclists

Postby [XAP]Bob » 25 Sep 2017, 1:57pm

meic wrote:That sort of inconsiderate treatment of other road users falls way below the standards that I set for myself.

Is it inconsiderate to ensure your safety, and the safety of all other road users using that stretch of road by drawing the workers' attention to the failure?
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.

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meic
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Re: Temporary Traffic Lights and Cyclists

Postby meic » 25 Sep 2017, 2:00pm

You can ensure your safety by waiting for the motorists who are in front to have their turn and go after them.
No harm in letting the motorists who are behind you have their go first either, then just take your place at the front for the next cycle of the traffic lights.
Yma o Hyd

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[XAP]Bob
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Re: Temporary Traffic Lights and Cyclists

Postby [XAP]Bob » 25 Sep 2017, 2:11pm

meic wrote:You can ensure your safety by waiting for the motorists who are in front to have their turn and go after them.
No harm in letting the motorists who are behind you have their go first either, then just take your place at the front for the next cycle of the traffic lights.


At which point you have oncoming traffic accelerating at you, assuming that the road is clear.
Or of course you have the 'next lot' up your backside, and you may as well let them go and wait ad infinitum.
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.

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Mick F
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Re: Temporary Traffic Lights and Cyclists

Postby Mick F » 25 Sep 2017, 2:13pm

What SHOULD happen, is that motorists obey the highway code.
Green only means GO if it safe and clear to proceed.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/the-highway ... ng-traffic
Mick F. Cornwall

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meic
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Re: Temporary Traffic Lights and Cyclists

Postby meic » 25 Sep 2017, 2:15pm

At which point you have oncoming traffic accelerating at you, assuming that the road is clear.

You are in exactly the same position as if you had queue jumped to the front of the previous queue.

There is no need to wait for those who arrived after you, merely respect that those who arrived before you, should by any standards of decent behaviour, not be pushed in-front of just to delay them.

We could invent an acronym for it, how about MGIF.
Yma o Hyd