Bristol Centre shared-space

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brooksby
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Bristol Centre shared-space

Postby brooksby » 29 Jun 2018, 11:40am

Has anyone noticed there are council workmen going over all the new "different coloured paving" cycle paths running across the Centre in Bristol, sticking down traditional painted cycle markings to replace their artful cycle lane paving inserts that nobody ever notices? They've also stuck up signs saying "Shared use, pedestrian priority".

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Redvee
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Re: Bristol Centre shared-space

Postby Redvee » 30 Jun 2018, 1:42am

brooksby wrote:They've also stuck up signs saying "Shared use, pedestrian priority".


Usually going too fast to notice the signs :lol: I ride through the centre on a daily basis and there is now a bus lane from St James Barton roundabout all the way to the Centotaph with the only hazardous part being at Christmas Street. I sometimes use the shared space on the pavement if the lights at the end of Baldwin Street are against me coming home, I'll turn right and join the paved area and slow down off course.

brynpoeth
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Re: Bristol Centre shared-space

Postby brynpoeth » 30 Jun 2018, 12:08pm

shared space is rubbish, the motor lobby likes it cos it ensures vehicles can go everywhere, no chance of sitting on a bench to relax
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boliston
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Re: Bristol Centre shared-space

Postby boliston » 30 Jun 2018, 10:15pm

I quite like the idea of shared space in busy city centre areas like bristol - it means that pedestrians get priority but cyclists can still use the area rather than some towns that have a strict 'no cycling' policy in the centre which would normally just be ignored by a lot of cyclists

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mjr
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Re: Bristol Centre shared-space

Postby mjr » 30 Jun 2018, 10:27pm

Government policy is that cycles should be allowed in pedestrian zones where it avoids hazardous, inconvenient or unattractive roads.



Since 1987.

Maybe after 31 years of minimal sporadic compliance, this should be made law?
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
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Pete Owens
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Re: Bristol Centre shared-space

Postby Pete Owens » 1 Jul 2018, 12:49am

brynpoeth wrote:shared space is rubbish, the motor lobby likes it cos it ensures vehicles can go everywhere, no chance of sitting on a bench to relax

Shared space is brilliant - the motor lobby hates it because it means the street environment is designed around the needs of people, rather than as a conduit to carry as many vehicles as possible as fast as possible. What the motor lobby really wants is to clear the streets of pedestrians so they blast along the high street at speed ignoring the rest of us...

and this is what conventional highway engineering delivers:
Pedestrians are kept to the margins of the street - preferably penned in by fencing. Priority is accorded to motors with pedestrians required to bear the entire responsibility of crossing the street without delaying the proper traffic. Crossings are arranged for the convenience of motors so pedestrians have to push buttons and wait for a light to give them a few seconds to dash from cattle pen to cattle pen. Or better still up and down steps to cross at bridges or subways. And all this systematic discrimination is so normalised it is even pushed as being for pedestrians safety.

Similarly cyclists are pushed out of the way - ideally onto the pavements to share the cattle pens with pedestrians, or narrow lanes to force us into the gutter.

I'm not sure exactly what is being talked about in Bristol - it sounds more like shared use than shared space - which is an entirely different concept.
However, there is a superb example of shared space up in my nick of the woods:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=-vzDDMzq7d0

brynpoeth
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Re: Bristol Centre shared-space

Postby brynpoeth » 1 Jul 2018, 8:31am

Plus One for opinion forming, alternative facts

Took a double-decker train to Bohmte, sharedspace town in Germany
On the way from the station into town there are tactile strips for visually disabled people left and right. Both were blocked by parked vehicles, - 99**
Proceeded to the cop shop, made enquiries. There were still "accidents" but fewer where people were injured apparently
Wanted to sit on a bench to relax but I did not dare because it was exposed to traffic, not protected by a kerb or railings

Bohmte is smaller and less busy than Poynton

I think shared space is rubbish

** what might be done about this?
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Pete Owens
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Re: Bristol Centre shared-space

Postby Pete Owens » 3 Jul 2018, 1:58am

I take it you have never visited Poynton in that case.

Take a look at this steetveiw from 2011:
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.3492495,-2.1224684,3a,90y,343.73h,92.38t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sC9E1JUPn-Z2qHZztjFXN3A!2e0!5s20110501T000000!7i13312!8i6656
And notice the pavement cafes that have sprung up since the improvements.
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.349234,-2.1224574,3a,75y,346.09h,96.7t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sc-XeIA411s2hhFwfBNrCKQ!2e0!5s20170801T000000!7i13312!8i6656

Or perhaps take a train to Hazel Grove (a mile or so north from Poynton on the same road) and enjoy the relaxing ambience of the protective cattle pen at the middle of the cross roads. Then ride down the A523. (Don't worry, most of it is a perfectly conventional A road with conventional busy high speed traffic - the scary shared space doesn't start until you are near the centre of Poynton).