Another cyclist killed by lorry in London

[atlas_shrugged]

@peetee asked when I sat in the cab of a lorry. This was about two years ago and was at a cycle charity event at Silverstone. A few lorries had been brought there by a lorry accident reduction organisation. They were trying to educate cyclists that lorries have blind spots where cyclists can just not be seen. To prove the point they had cardboard cut outs of cyclists and pedestrians in front and to the sides of the truck. When in the cab of the lorry these could not be seen. So I had to very much agree with these lorry drivers that they have blinds spots. This web site shows the issue:

https://wrightstart.co.uk/driving-safet ... lind-spots

[661-Pete]

It turns out that this latest guy to be killed on that stretch of road was a physician to the royal household. Maybe Maj will add her two penneth now. We can but hope.

I mentioned that detail in my OP. Not that E2R would be likely to contribute to the discussion - nor that any such intervention would make a blind bit of difference.

The simple fact is, there are significant dangers when cyclists and large lorries are using the same road space - even at low speed. More so than with cars. And the death toll continues to mount.

[[XAP]Bob]

@peetee asked when I sat in the cab of a lorry. This was about two years ago and was at a cycle charity event at Silverstone. A few lorries had been brought there by a lorry accident reduction organisation. They were trying to educate cyclists that lorries have blind spots where cyclists can just not be seen. To prove the point they had cardboard cut outs of cyclists and pedestrians in front and to the sides of the truck. When in the cab of the lorry these could not be seen. So I had to very much agree with these lorry drivers that they have blinds spots. This web site shows the issue:

https://wrightstart.co.uk/driving-safet ... lind-spots

I don't care what 'blind spots' you claim to have from the cab. It is your responsibility to manoeuvre your vehicle safely on the road. If you need to have someone walking alongside you to tell you whether or not it is safe, or a man with a red flag in front of you then so be it.

If you need better mirrors and/or cameras to see what is around you then you need to have those installed.

[horizon]

@peetee asked when I sat in the cab of a lorry. This was about two years ago and was at a cycle charity event at Silverstone. A few lorries had been brought there by a lorry accident reduction organisation. They were trying to educate cyclists that lorries have blind spots where cyclists can just not be seen. To prove the point they had cardboard cut outs of cyclists and pedestrians in front and to the sides of the truck. When in the cab of the lorry these could not be seen. So I had to very much agree with these lorry drivers that they have blinds spots. This web site shows the issue:

https://wrightstart.co.uk/driving-safet ... lind-spots

Here's a quote from your link:

If you fancy getting behind the wheel of one of these enormous machines check out their page here, they are awesome!

I don't think a comment is appropriate or needed.

[squeaker]

I don't care what 'blind spots' you claim to have from the cab. It is your responsibility to manoeuvre your vehicle safely on the road. If you need to have someone walking alongside you to tell you whether or not it is safe, or a man with a red flag in front of you then so be it.

If you need better mirrors and/or cameras to see what is around you then you need to have those installed.

+1. Applies to a good few SUVs too (although the better equipped ones do seem to have reversing cameras, which is a start).

[peetee]

@peetee asked when I sat in the cab of a lorry. This was about two years ago and was at a cycle charity event at Silverstone. A few lorries had been brought there by a lorry accident reduction organisation. They were trying to educate cyclists that lorries have blind spots where cyclists can just not be seen. To prove the point they had cardboard cut outs of cyclists and pedestrians in front and to the sides of the truck. When in the cab of the lorry these could not be seen. So I had to very much agree with these lorry drivers that they have blinds spots. This web site shows the issue:

https://wrightstart.co.uk/driving-safet ... lind-spots

Ah, right. So these vehicles were used to show potential blindspots. Well that shouldn't be too difficult and they are probably not indicative of a comprehensively set up lorry by a responsible haulage company that is willing to spend the time and effort to do so and employ staff that care.
The ones I drove were fitted with multiple mirrors such that a tapering triangle of area immediately to the rear was the ONLY part of the road that was not visible. As I have already stated, driver vigilance ensures that you know what, if anything is in that area and if you are in any doubt you send your 2nd man out to check.
I have a 2007 Vauxhall Vectra estate and I have to say the visibility to the rear of that is no better that the lorry, in fact, if I were speaking of the mirrors in particular they are just awful in comparison.

[CubbyJaggy]

@peetee asked when I sat in the cab of a lorry. This was about two years ago and was at a cycle charity event at Silverstone. A few lorries had been brought there by a lorry accident reduction organisation. They were trying to educate cyclists that lorries have blind spots where cyclists can just not be seen. To prove the point they had cardboard cut outs of cyclists and pedestrians in front and to the sides of the truck. When in the cab of the lorry these could not be seen. So I had to very much agree with these lorry drivers that they have blinds spots. This web site shows the issue:

https://wrightstart.co.uk/driving-safet ... lind-spots

I don't care what 'blind spots' you claim to have from the cab. It is your responsibility to manoeuvre your vehicle safely on the road. If you need to have someone walking alongside you to tell you whether or not it is safe, or a man with a red flag in front of you then so be it.

If you need better mirrors and/or cameras to see what is around you then you need to have those installed.

I would argue this is the wrong attitude if you know that a big lorry has a blind spot then you shouldn't cycle in the blind spots simple really health and safety is EVERYONES responsibility especially in dangerous places like roads. Its a very arrogant view point really Yes it is the driver responsibility to manoeuvre it safely and he is if your in his blind spot then your just simply not helping the situation.

[Cyril Haearn]

@peetee asked when I sat in the cab of a lorry. This was about two years ago and was at a cycle charity event at Silverstone. A few lorries had been brought there by a lorry accident reduction organisation. They were trying to educate cyclists that lorries have blind spots where cyclists can just not be seen. To prove the point they had cardboard cut outs of cyclists and pedestrians in front and to the sides of the truck. When in the cab of the lorry these could not be seen. So I had to very much agree with these lorry drivers that they have blinds spots. This web site shows the issue:

https://wrightstart.co.uk/driving-safet ... lind-spots

I don't care what 'blind spots' you claim to have from the cab. It is your responsibility to manoeuvre your vehicle safely on the road. If you need to have someone walking alongside you to tell you whether or not it is safe, or a man with a red flag in front of you then so be it.

If you need better mirrors and/or cameras to see what is around you then you need to have those installed.

I would argue this is the wrong attitude if you know that a big lorry has a blind spot then you shouldn't cycle in the blind spots simple really health and safety is EVERYONES responsibility especially in dangerous places like roads. Its a very arrogant view point really Yes it is the driver responsibility to manoeuvre it safely and he is if your in his blind spot then your just simply not helping the situation.

I keep away from them but I cannae keep them away from me, right?

I avoid cycling on the road, use cycle paths only, often wait when I actually have priority, never trust a driver to obey the law, never

One crossing near home walkers have priority, cyclists do not but drivers often pause and try to wave one across
I give them a mouthful

[CubbyJaggy]

Indeed you can't keep them away from you but you can stay out of blind spots if they pull up a long side you Reverse back maybe I dunno actually XD but get away I would actually get off and stand on the path if there is one or tap on the door and say I AM HERE HELLO !!! just making you aware thank you SMILE SMILE

[Cyril Haearn]

Indeed you can't keep them away from you but you can stay out of blind spots if they pull up a long side you Reverse back maybe I dunno actually XD but get away I would actually get off and stand on the path if there is one or tap on the door and say I AM HERE HELLO !!! just making you aware thank you SMILE SMILE

Maybe I cannae get away, if there are railings for example
I park my cycle on the edge of town, then walk

[CubbyJaggy]

Oh Gosh no no no Cycle cycle cycle Set a grand example and wear ARMOUR PLATING XD hehehehe I totally agree with you but the blind spot thing you said just seemed a bit off to me really

[peetee]

if you know that a big lorry has a blind spot then you shouldn't cycle in the blind spots simple really health and safety is EVERYONES responsibility especially in dangerous places like roads. Its a very arrogant view point really Yes it is the driver responsibility to manoeuvre it safely and he is if your in his blind spot then your just simply not helping the situation.

Indeed. It works both ways. In most situations you can see the driver in his cab in the mirrors as you approach the vehicle. In fact it's one of the things I do automatically driving or cycling. It's a self defence tactic in much the same way Richard Ballantyne taught me to make eye contact with drivers likely to cross my path. There are lots of simple methods like these that help you to make incident free progress on the road and I am often reminded that there are many road users out there that never put them into practice.

[Cyril Haearn]

if you know that a big lorry has a blind spot then you shouldn't cycle in the blind spots simple really health and safety is EVERYONES responsibility especially in dangerous places like roads. Its a very arrogant view point really Yes it is the driver responsibility to manoeuvre it safely and he is if your in his blind spot then your just simply not helping the situation.

Indeed. It works both ways. In most situations you can see the driver in his cab in the mirrors as you approach the vehicle. In fact it's one of the things I do automatically driving or cycling. It's a self defence tactic in much the same way Richard Ballantyne taught me to make eye contact with drivers likely to cross my path. There are lots of simple methods like these that help you to make incident free progress on the road and I am often reminded that there are many road users out there that never put them into practice.

But you don't know that he has seen and registered you even if he can

I prefer NOT to make eye contact, never trust them to halt fully and to apply the handbrake, how many do that, no they creep forward and miss one by a whisker

[mjr]

I think we've a notorious recent case where a lorry pulled up behind a cyclist at some lights in London, then drove straight over the cyclist when the lights changed. Should we really have to dismount and cower every time one of these drives nearby? Putting all the responsibility on the cyclist is no way to encourage cycling. Let's ban the blind lorries instead. They're not safe.

[[XAP]Bob]

@peetee asked when I sat in the cab of a lorry. This was about two years ago and was at a cycle charity event at Silverstone. A few lorries had been brought there by a lorry accident reduction organisation. They were trying to educate cyclists that lorries have blind spots where cyclists can just not be seen. To prove the point they had cardboard cut outs of cyclists and pedestrians in front and to the sides of the truck. When in the cab of the lorry these could not be seen. So I had to very much agree with these lorry drivers that they have blinds spots. This web site shows the issue:

https://wrightstart.co.uk/driving-safet ... lind-spots

I don't care what 'blind spots' you claim to have from the cab. It is your responsibility to manoeuvre your vehicle safely on the road. If you need to have someone walking alongside you to tell you whether or not it is safe, or a man with a red flag in front of you then so be it.

If you need better mirrors and/or cameras to see what is around you then you need to have those installed.

I would argue this is the wrong attitude if you know that a big lorry has a blind spot then you shouldn't cycle in the blind spots simple really health and safety is EVERYONES responsibility especially in dangerous places like roads. Its a very arrogant view point really Yes it is the driver responsibility to manoeuvre it safely and he is if your in his blind spot then your just simply not helping the situation.

The attitude of the law should be that a blind spot, or the sun in your eyes is no defence.

I’m not talking about defensive riding - I’m talking about the law. Blind spots should be illegal - or at least in places where you cannot manoeuvre...