Temporary traffic lights - inadequate time for passage

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meic
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Re: Temporary traffic lights - inadequate time for passage

Postby meic » 29 Oct 2018, 6:29pm

We all went through the cones on our Audax yesterday.
More often that not I (and most people that I ride with) take the road on the downhill and through the cones on an uphill, if it is obviously easy enough to do so (which often means our side of the road being the side coned off), out of awareness of the inadequate time given by temporary traffic lights.
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Re: Temporary traffic lights - inadequate time for passage

Postby Vorpal » 30 Oct 2018, 6:30am

I don't see riding in the coned off section as much different than riding down a closed road. I think it's okay with caution, and potentially saaves some hassle. Holes that a person could fall down should be further cordoned off, but of course, a cyclist who goes through the coned off area may have to accept liability in case of an incident.
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Re: Temporary traffic lights - inadequate time for passage

Postby mjr » 30 Oct 2018, 7:57am

Vorpal wrote:I don't see riding in the coned off section as much different than riding down a closed road. I think it's okay with caution, and potentially saaves some hassle. Holes that a person could fall down should be further cordoned off, but of course, a cyclist who goes through the coned off area may have to accept liability in case of an incident.

Riding down a closed road carries a fine of up to £1000. Does riding in a coned section? I suspect not.
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Re: Temporary traffic lights - inadequate time for passage

Postby pete75 » 30 Oct 2018, 8:14am

thirdcrank wrote:
Vorpal wrote:They are supposed to recognise cyclists. I have gotten them fixed sometimes by contacting the local highways authority.


You know that, I know that, but they often don't. There are a lot of specialist traffic management firms involved in this now and I think things are better. It's normal for there to be a contact number on the lights if there's a problem. Unfortunately, it's a bit of a work creation scheme for those firms and they seem to do the all singing, all dancing set-up even when it's unnecessary. I live in a cul-de-sac off a cul-de-sac but when Yorkshire Water's sub-contractors had a van outside our house last week, they coned it off, placed a load of roadworks signs (even though they were working in my back garden) then took pics of it all to be archived. No temporary traffic lights, BTW. :wink:


It's not uncommon for temporary traffic lights to be used merely so whoever is carrying out work can park their vehicles on the road.

Then there's various called health and safety reasons. Near here there were temporary traffic lights for about three weeks where a shared use path alongside the road was being repaired. I contacted the council who said they were there because it wasn't safe for the workers to be on the path without them. My response was along the lines of well in that case it's not safe for anyone to use the path without them is it?

It's the rule rather than teh exception that not enough time is left for cyclists to get through. The same can apply to any slow vehicles. I once saw a steam traction engine going through - about 6 mph so nowhere near enough time. For some reason waiting drivers seemed loath to take it on in a head to head.


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Re: Temporary traffic lights - inadequate time for passage

Postby Xilter » 30 Oct 2018, 9:24pm

Had this happen to me a few months ago. It was the last time I was considerate and waited my place in the que of vehicles. I now arrogantly shove my way to the front and let the trail of cars flash lights revving their engines and bleeping their horns knowing it is for their presence that the oncoming traffic will opt to wait.
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Re: Temporary traffic lights - inadequate time for passage

Postby thirdcrank » 6 Feb 2019, 7:03pm

This afternoon I witnessed a close shave of the accident-waiting-to-happen kind.

They've installed temporary lights on a busy B road near here, operating with sensors only. ie nobody supervising the lights. There seems to be a common belief that flashing a vehicles headlights will encourage the lights to change. I suspect that's a mistaken belief. There was a stationary bus whose driver was frantically flashing the headlights. That was taken by a driver at red at the other end to proceed. The bus driver must have then got a green because he set off through the roadworks.

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Re: Temporary traffic lights - inadequate time for passage

Postby londoncommuter0000 » 6 Feb 2019, 8:05pm

althebike wrote:I went for a nearly nice ride yesterday, beautiful day, but lots of roadworks. Near Bramshill, just south of Reading stopped on a read light by some roadworks, the lights changed and off I went, I got about halfway along the works when the lights changed and I was met by oncoming traffic, the first car just charged at me, I had no where to move either my bike or myself out of the way so I just stood there , the car braked hard and passed slowly , the next two vehicles were large lorries, the 2nd lorry inched past , the driver wound down his window and gave me some abuse for cycling through a red light. So here I was thinking the oncoming traffic should wait for the lane to clear before proceeding and all along it was my fault for cycling past a green light. Traffic lights, whether at road works, or other junctions, do need to give cyclists and other vulnerable road users time to clear out of the way before changing.


Just a point of order: the car did not charge at you. The selfish [expletive] inside did.
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Re: Temporary traffic lights - inadequate time for passage

Postby londoncommuter0000 » 6 Feb 2019, 8:13pm

There's a part of my regular commute into London, where there are currently traffic works. If you're interested, it's when you leave the A200 heading NE and turn left onto the one-way system on Bestwood Street. You're effectively on one lane as you swing left onto Bestwood Street but then there is a bus lane that appears on the left. Except at the moment (well, the last time I cycled in at any rate!), the bus lane is blocked by a long fence which extends to the exit of the McDonald's 'Drive-thru'.

That means that it's effectively one lane, and of course for my own safety, I 'take the lane'. Every single morning, without fail, the car driver behind will be around 6 - 18 inches from my rear wheel, slipping the clutch and revving the engine.

It takes me about .. I dunno, maybe six to eight seconds to clear the blocked part of the lane, at which point I merge into the bus lane, and am overtaken by drivers glaring at me, sometimes shouting, and sometimes deliberately swerving across me to take the B207 (Trundley's Road).

Plus ça change.
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Re: Temporary traffic lights - inadequate time for passage

Postby Vorpal » 7 Feb 2019, 8:47am

thirdcrank wrote:This afternoon I witnessed a close shave of the accident-waiting-to-happen kind.

They've installed temporary lights on a busy B road near here, operating with sensors only. ie nobody supervising the lights. There seems to be a common belief that flashing a vehicles headlights will encourage the lights to change. I suspect that's a mistaken belief. There was a stationary bus whose driver was frantically flashing the headlights. That was taken by a driver at red at the other end to proceed. The bus driver must have then got a green because he set off through the roadworks.

In the USA, some years ago (70s?) traffic lights in some places could detect the strobe effect of emergency vehicle lighting. It was believed that flashing the high beams at such lights would cause them to change. This was false, even then (such lights detected flashes in excess ofsome number per second), but the rumours persisted. I guess just because people like to believe they can beat the the system. Anyway, lights don't even do that anymore. In places where emergency vehicles can change the lights in their favour, they now use transmitters, instead.
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Cugel
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Re: Temporary traffic lights - inadequate time for passage

Postby Cugel » 7 Feb 2019, 9:10am

londoncommuter0000 wrote:
althebike wrote:I went for a nearly nice ride yesterday, beautiful day, but lots of roadworks. Near Bramshill, just south of Reading stopped on a read light by some roadworks, the lights changed and off I went, I got about halfway along the works when the lights changed and I was met by oncoming traffic, the first car just charged at me, I had no where to move either my bike or myself out of the way so I just stood there , the car braked hard and passed slowly , the next two vehicles were large lorries, the 2nd lorry inched past , the driver wound down his window and gave me some abuse for cycling through a red light. So here I was thinking the oncoming traffic should wait for the lane to clear before proceeding and all along it was my fault for cycling past a green light. Traffic lights, whether at road works, or other junctions, do need to give cyclists and other vulnerable road users time to clear out of the way before changing.


Just a point of order: the car did not charge at you. The selfish [expletive] inside did.


Yet it was the abilities and design of the car as a tool of aggressive physical thrust & threat (and potentially lethal effect) that allowed or even encouraged the self-centred little skinbag in it to perform his charge. Terrorists are often enabled and amplified in their terrorising by the weapons available to them.

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Re: Temporary traffic lights - inadequate time for passage

Postby Audax67 » 7 Feb 2019, 9:51am

Referring to the OP, I'm reminded of one outing in Austria that included an 8% climb through temporary roadworks in a tunnel. That was, er, intense.
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Re: Temporary traffic lights - inadequate time for passage

Postby John Holiday » 9 Feb 2019, 5:53pm

Had something similar on the Old Dee Bridge in Chester last year. Waited for the green light before proceeding with group of family cyclists, only to be confronted part way across with oncoming traffic.
Lead driver stopped, but hail of abuse from following drivers.
When I queried lag time with Cheshire Highways, they said " they were aware of problem, but extending the lag for cyclists, would frustrate motorists "!
Should perhaps have replied to them that "Roads were not built for motor cars ".

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Re: Temporary traffic lights - inadequate time for passage

Postby [XAP]Bob » 10 Feb 2019, 8:10am

John Holiday wrote:Had something similar on the Old Dee Bridge in Chester last year. Waited for the green light before proceeding with group of family cyclists, only to be confronted part way across with oncoming traffic.
Lead driver stopped, but hail of abuse from following drivers.
When I queried lag time with Cheshire Highways, they said " they were aware of problem, but extending the lag for cyclists, would frustrate motorists "!
Should perhaps have replied to them that "Roads were not built for motor cars ".

More frustrating that being forced to reverse back because they went when it wasn’t safe?
Maybe add a ‘cyclist passing’ button to extend the time from the bottom. You could even have an automatic detector.
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Re: Temporary traffic lights - inadequate time for passage

Postby Bmblbzzz » 10 Feb 2019, 12:22pm

This isn't a problem restricted to temporary traffic lights; it applies to some permanent lights at narrow sections of road.