Gangs of youths on national cycle route.....

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reohn2
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Re: Gangs of youths on national cycle route.....

Postby reohn2 » 26 Jul 2019, 7:16pm

pete75 wrote:That's not how the violent ones, the so called firms, dress.

I've no idea about how the "firms" dress and I suspect most people don't either,which is beside the point anyway.What's being discussed is the effect groups may have on others,whether those groups are benign or otherwise.
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Ellieb
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Re: Gangs of youths on national cycle route.....

Postby Ellieb » 26 Jul 2019, 8:44pm

Sadly 25 years of experience on local cycle paths has taught me to be very wary of groups of youths hanging about when no many other people are around. Discretion is the better part of valour.

pete75
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Re: Gangs of youths on national cycle route.....

Postby pete75 » 26 Jul 2019, 8:49pm

reohn2 wrote:
pete75 wrote:That's not how the violent ones, the so called firms, dress.

I've no idea about how the "firms" dress and I suspect most people don't either,which is beside the point anyway.What's being discussed is the effect groups may have on others,whether those groups are benign or otherwise.


If you want to avoid a potentially violent group of football supporters you need to know which ones to avoid so it's not beside the point.

reohn2
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Re: Gangs of youths on national cycle route.....

Postby reohn2 » 26 Jul 2019, 9:12pm

pete75 wrote:
reohn2 wrote:
pete75 wrote:That's not how the violent ones, the so called firms, dress.

I've no idea about how the "firms" dress and I suspect most people don't either,which is beside the point anyway.What's being discussed is the effect groups may have on others,whether those groups are benign or otherwise.


If you want to avoid a potentially violent group of football supporters you need to know which ones to avoid so it's not beside the point.

Am I now to research every group football or other wise and their potential dress code before I go for a bike ride :?
And what if not all hooligans necessarily confirm to their prescribed dress code,what then?
The point is neither you,nor I can be sure who's who,and take every situation as we find it.

Story alert
On the L&L towpath I once came across a middle aged normal looking woman with an Alsation on a lead,as I got nearer the dog spotted me began to snarl,growl and bark in a very menacing way.She shortened the lead and was struggling to hold it back,she said " don't stop love or he'll have you",there followed a short conversation as I passed,which ended with me telling her the best thing to do with such a dangerous dog.

On the same stretch of towpath I came across a chap,shaved head tattoos on his head and all over his upper body with a bit of facial metalwork adornment.With him were two brown Pitbull terrier type dogs,when he saw me approaching he simply ordered the dogs to sit, which they did by his side.
I stopped and complemented him on his dogs obedience,he thanked me and we passed the time of day then said our goodbyes,I see him regularly now and we always pass the time of day or just say Hi.

Make of that what you will.
Last edited by reohn2 on 26 Jul 2019, 9:29pm, edited 1 time in total.
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brynpoeth
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Re: Gangs of youths on national cycle route.....

Postby brynpoeth » 26 Jul 2019, 9:19pm

Footballfandom has changed a lot since my youth, has a lot to do with money now
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brynpoeth
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Re: Gangs of youths on national cycle route.....

Postby brynpoeth » 26 Jul 2019, 9:25pm

Carlton green wrote:..
Unfortunately Newspapers are not focused on delivering News they are focused on profit. Newspapers are primarily just a money making venture that happens to do so through the regular delivery of information some of which the reader pays for directly in the cover price and some of which s/he pays for with his/her time spent reading advertisements. To sell advertising space and to cover high fixed costs Newspapers sensationalise reported events so that we buy the cover and read the paper cover to cover to arm ourselves with information.

Many decades ago a local (to me) workplace dispute was covered by the media, they got so many details wrong
..

I used to love local papers, had a lot of letters published
Now I get most (?), certainly a lot of info from these fora, more opinions are available here, plenty that I agree with
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GranvilleThomas
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Re: Gangs of youths on national cycle route.....

Postby GranvilleThomas » 27 Jul 2019, 5:34pm

pete75 wrote:It's just a thought but perhaps those worried about danger from a group of youths shouldn't go cycling on the roads . You're vastly more likely to be killed or seriously injured by a respectable adult driving a motor vehicle. Compared to that threat all others are insignificant.


Exactly, I was waiting for someone to state this obvious fact.

Very obvious when you think about it.

I would rather contend with a group of kids, than some of the psychopathic nutters I encounter on the road on a regular basis.

reohn2
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Re: Gangs of youths on national cycle route.....

Postby reohn2 » 27 Jul 2019, 6:08pm

GranvilleThomas wrote:
pete75 wrote:It's just a thought but perhaps those worried about danger from a group of youths shouldn't go cycling on the roads . You're vastly more likely to be killed or seriously injured by a respectable adult driving a motor vehicle. Compared to that threat all others are insignificant.


Exactly, I was waiting for someone to state this obvious fact.

Very obvious when you think about it.

I would rather contend with a group of kids, than some of the psychopathic nutters I encounter on the road on a regular basis.

I think we'd all agree with you and Pete on that,but it's not what's being discussed.
If you're a bit timid and are faced with a gang of youths you may well be frightened or put on your mettel,not everyone rides on the road for whatever reasons.
Last edited by reohn2 on 27 Jul 2019, 6:21pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Ellieb
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Re: Gangs of youths on national cycle route.....

Postby Ellieb » 27 Jul 2019, 6:19pm

This thread has started to miss the point. It isn’t whether cycle paths are safer than roads generally. The OP has had a specific problem on a particular path. I don’t buy the idea that these kids are not aware that they are intimidating someone. Judging by the description that is exactly what they want to do. In this case I would still use the path but turn round and use the road if I saw them up ahead. I would also talk to the police. In Edinburgh there are definitely sections of path where the neds see cyclists as an easy target for their aggression.

GranvilleThomas
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Re: Gangs of youths on national cycle route.....

Postby GranvilleThomas » 27 Jul 2019, 8:10pm

Ellieb wrote:This thread has started to miss the point. It isn’t whether cycle paths are safer than roads generally. The OP has had a specific problem on a particular path. I don’t buy the idea that these kids are not aware that they are intimidating someone. Judging by the description that is exactly what they want to do. In this case I would still use the path but turn round and use the road if I saw them up ahead. I would also talk to the police. In Edinburgh there are definitely sections of path where the neds see cyclists as an easy target for their aggression.


Yes, I understand what you are saying, but what is the answer then?

If you read my previous posts I have already suggested that the OP contact the Police, so you are just going over old ground without suggesting a solution.

Perhaps we need to build private segregated gated cycle paths with security guards that you pay a subscription to access, that should keep the poor people away.

Tangled Metal
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Re: Gangs of youths on national cycle route.....

Postby Tangled Metal » 27 Jul 2019, 9:17pm

A few months ago I saw a young skinhead. Classic look too. High lace up DMs, jeans folded up and a bit short to show off the boots, white t-shirt, red braces, shaven head, tattoos, etc.

He would have been considered a caricature of a skinhead but it was just his look. No idea of whether I should have been scared of him or not, I was in a car driving past at the time. Personally if I had been walking past I would not be worried by him but the normally dressed people in that dodgy part of town would cause me concern and doubt.

Football fans vs hooligans? When I was a school kid in the 80s locally there wasn't much difference. Local rivalry between Blackburn and Burnley meant one side's loss away = gone teams town got a bit of redecoration. Either with it trashed a bit or rival fans in full team colours beating the carp out of each other. For that reason I personally would avoid any type of football fan especially with colours.

Youths? Yes, I'm wary but tend avoid of possible or just pass them as quickly as possible without looking like a potential victim. It's looking like a victim that's the issue. Personally I find it easier than most because I'm 6'5" tall and have a confident walk or manner.

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RickH
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Re: Gangs of youths on national cycle route.....

Postby RickH » 27 Jul 2019, 10:46pm

I thought I'd posted previously but it somehow got lost somewhere along the way (I really thought I'd pressed "submit" :?).

Ive found small groups of youths with bikes are fine. Often one will try to "race" me, I'm fine with that they don't usually keep up for long. If they are travelling in my direction & pulling wheelies I will often compliment them on their skill (if they are going in the opposite direction there often isn't enough time for interaction) - I've never mastered it.

The incident mentioned earlier about the Fallowfield Loop Line path doesn't surprise me but, although there have been sporadic incidents, I think it is relatively rare considering the cycle traffic there generally is there.

Be vigilant, to look for signs that may indicate trouble but, in my experience, they will be very rare. I find good humoured engagement is a good thing.

I'm used to lots of (usually inane & unoriginal) comments from many miles of soloing a tandem home (something that generally happens much less now than it did). I did have one guy look like he was about to try to hop on the back as I passed but he was thwarted by the fact I'd just "smuggled" it on a train (that technically didn't take tandems) and consequently had removed the rear pedals & handlebars to aid manoeuvring in tight spaces! :D

Oldjohnw
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Re: Gangs of youths on national cycle route.....

Postby Oldjohnw » 28 Jul 2019, 7:28am

Having spent 20+ years in youth justice I tend not to experience fear when confronted by groups of young people. IMV, the much greater thugs in our society, capable of inflicting far more harm to far more people, sit around the Cabinet in 10 Downing Street.
John

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brynpoeth
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Re: Gangs of youths on national cycle route.....

Postby brynpoeth » 28 Jul 2019, 7:45am

Gangs of joggers, usually not young, are problematic too
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dim
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Re: Gangs of youths on national cycle route.....

Postby dim » 28 Jul 2019, 7:50am

we have a few 'gangs' beating up cyclists and joggers on the Guided busway / cycle path in Cambridge:

https://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/news/cambridge-news/attack-cycle-path-cambridge-police-14136717

there has been a few reports of this happening on the same section of cycle path