Why wear black?

Commuting, Day rides, Audax, Incidents, etc.
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The utility cyclist
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Re: Why wear black?

Postby The utility cyclist » 18 Jan 2020, 7:29pm

TrevA wrote:Ive encountered 2 black wearing cyclists in the dark in the last 2 days. One was just an ordinary bloke on a bike, wearing normal clothes. Bizarrely, he had a front light but no back light. Driving behind him I could see him due to his pedal reflectors.

The other was a hardcore commuter/racing man out training, dressed head to toe in black, but you could see him because of the reflective detailing on his clothing shining in the headlights, in addition to his bright front and rear lights.

So are you saying that if instead of cyclists with a small amount of reflectives they had in fact being a fallen tree across the road, a herd of cows/black sheep, a massive boulder or a broken down vehicle with no electrics you would have smashed straight into them?

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Cunobelin
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Re: Why wear black?

Postby Cunobelin » 19 Jan 2020, 7:41am

mattheus wrote:I know I'm wasting my breath here - most of the Frequent Posters seem to like posting this way - but it is a flipping stupid way to run a forum!

[and yes, I know this is thread drift from the Main Topic i.e. why cyclists in black are organ-donors with great arteries]


The worst and lowest level of “discussion”

“I have no supporting evidence so I am going to claim you will all die needless painful deaths at cost to the grieving family”


Of course if anyone actually thinks this is in any way supportive or evidence of a claim, remember that there are thousands out there who feel that cycling at all makes you an organ donor

Is it unequivocal proof that cycling should be banned outright

If not, why offer it in a thread such as this?

Cowsham
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Re: Why wear black?

Postby Cowsham » 21 Jan 2020, 8:53am

Black is my favorite colour ----- for doing burglaries at night, only problem is my getaway vehicle is a bicycle.

Vorpal
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Re: Why wear black?

Postby Vorpal » 21 Jan 2020, 10:03am

Cyclists in black are clearly more visible than cyclists in any other colour, based upon the number of people who see them :wink:
“In some ways, it is easier to be a dissident, for then one is without responsibility.”
― Nelson Mandela, Long Walk to Freedom

Cowsham
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Re: Why wear black?

Postby Cowsham » 21 Jan 2020, 10:29am

Vorpal wrote:Cyclists in black are clearly more visible than cyclists in any other colour, based upon the number of people who see them :wink:


Oh buugger!

fullupandslowingdown
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Re: Why wear black?

Postby fullupandslowingdown » 21 Jan 2020, 1:00pm

True, true. They are all accidents that should never have happened.

I fully acknowledge that hi vis and flashing lights make no difference if the driver chooses to drive above the speed limit, tailgates the vehicle in front, doesn't keep their windshield clean and free from obstructions, chooses to distract themselves with a phone, laptop, eating and drinking or passengers, takes drugs and or alcohol, doesn't maintain their vehicle correctly or exceeds it's safe limits, has no real understanding of the forces of nature i.e the distance it takes to stop a vehicle from 80mph, or the limit of road holding when steering hard, or the significant increase in stopping distance in snow and ice.

I also accept, and have previously argued the very fact that if we keep improving the visibility of people through lighting and clothing, then it becomes an arms race where those left behind become increasingly vulnerable, where as years ago they would have been perfectly safe. Human propensity for adaption is unfortunately a two edged sword, it often works for our benefit, but sometimes also to weaken us when we are lazy or shortsighted or greedy.

But it's hardly going to make road side workers any safer if they throw away their hi viz and wear black or camo. Hi viz is only one aspect of road safety such as proper education and training, enforcement and public campaigning,road and vehicle design. But if hi viz saves just one fatality, one family's grief, then it's worth every penny.

Eliot Field 1992 - 2011

Cowsham
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Re: Why wear black?

Postby Cowsham » 21 Jan 2020, 1:21pm

it's no good for burglaries though -- look what happened the last time I tried it.

https://youtu.be/9L0l2kbuhcw

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[XAP]Bob
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Re: Why wear black?

Postby [XAP]Bob » 21 Jan 2020, 3:41pm

fullupandslowingdown wrote:But if <intervention> saves just one fatality, one family's grief, then it's worth every penny.

Eliot Field 1992 - 2011


ABSOLUTE POPPYCOCK!

Else we'd ban smoking, drinking, and cycling, walking as well.
We'd also have to ban driving (although at that point we wouldn't need to ban cycling and walking...)
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.

Icsunonove
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Re: Why wear black?

Postby Icsunonove » 21 Jan 2020, 3:56pm

[XAP]Bob wrote:
fullupandslowingdown wrote:But if <intervention> saves just one fatality, one family's grief, then it's worth every penny.

Eliot Field 1992 - 2011


ABSOLUTE POPPYCOCK!

Else we'd ban smoking, drinking, and cycling, walking as well.
We'd also have to ban driving (although at that point we wouldn't need to ban cycling and walking...)


Life jackets for everyone walking or running (and cycling?) near water.....

From the Royal Life Saving Society:
"The most startling fact is that the largest ‘grouping’ of people losing their lives in 2018 was once again, those people who had no intention of going into the water and were walking or running close to water (93 people)."
https://www.rlss.org.uk/news/today-the- ... n-released

mattheus
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Re: Why wear black?

Postby mattheus » 21 Jan 2020, 4:04pm

Don't forget helmets for bathrooms and staircases.

fastpedaller
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Re: Why wear black?

Postby fastpedaller » 21 Jan 2020, 4:24pm

Cowsham wrote:it's no good for burglaries though -- look what happened the last time I tried it.

https://youtu.be/9L0l2kbuhcw


Apparently it can be useful for various thefts because it 'makes the wearer a person of authority' - I recall being at Mablethorpe a few years back, and at the weekend (not during weekdays) there was a 'car parking £3 all day' sign outside a disused pub, with 2 guys wearing hi-viz issuing a raffle ticket stub and taking cash payment from each of the people willing to park their car there. Certainly looked suspicious to me :x

fastpedaller
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Re: Why wear black?

Postby fastpedaller » 21 Jan 2020, 4:27pm

Saw a guy at local supermarket, all dressed in black, and got chatting to him about his nice alloy frame 90's bike he'd picked up as a bargain. He put a H on his head, and then started up a flashing rear light on his saddle before he departed. I left shortly after (driving) and a few hundred yards away caught him up , and we were facing a bright sky with damp road, and it was apparent that the black of his clothing showed up long before the rear light!

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Cunobelin
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Re: Why wear black?

Postby Cunobelin » 21 Jan 2020, 4:58pm

[XAP]Bob wrote:
fullupandslowingdown wrote:But if <intervention> saves just one fatality, one family's grief, then it's worth every penny.

Eliot Field 1992 - 2011


ABSOLUTE POPPYCOCK!

Else we'd ban smoking, drinking, and cycling, walking as well.
We'd also have to ban driving (although at that point we wouldn't need to ban cycling and walking...)



Brings me back to my colleague who thinks riding a bicycle at all is suicidal

To paraphrase...

But if banning bicycles saves just one fatality, one family's grief, then it's worth every penny.

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Cunobelin
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Re: Why wear black?

Postby Cunobelin » 21 Jan 2020, 5:08pm

fastpedaller wrote:
Cowsham wrote:it's no good for burglaries though -- look what happened the last time I tried it.

https://youtu.be/9L0l2kbuhcw


Apparently it can be useful for various thefts because it 'makes the wearer a person of authority' - I recall being at Mablethorpe a few years back, and at the weekend (not during weekdays) there was a 'car parking £3 all day' sign outside a disused pub, with 2 guys wearing hi-viz issuing a raffle ticket stub and taking cash payment from each of the people willing to park their car there. Certainly looked suspicious to me :x



Remember a local pub, the car park was always full as it was used by commuters and shoppers... never any room for customers

They tried various options, and ended up with a barrier operated by tokens issued by the pub... lasted a week before it was removed and commuters were back


Now operated by a car parking company with exemption for customers whose registration is typed in by bar staff as they purchase

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Cunobelin
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Re: Why wear black?

Postby Cunobelin » 21 Jan 2020, 5:10pm

fastpedaller wrote:Saw a guy at local supermarket, all dressed in black, and got chatting to him about his nice alloy frame 90's bike he'd picked up as a bargain. He put a H on his head, and then started up a flashing rear light on his saddle before he departed. I left shortly after (driving) and a few hundred yards away caught him up , and we were facing a bright sky with damp road, and it was apparent that the black of his clothing showed up long before the rear light!



As has been oft said, it is the contrast

You would need a pannier full of different colour tops and be changing two or three times on each commute