Group riding

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TrevA
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Group riding

Postby TrevA » 5 Jun 2020, 7:24pm

Can we resume group rides in groups of 6?

CUK guidance seems to suggest that we can, but BC guidance is far more cautious and recommends not riding in groups of more than 2 on the road, for the time being.

What are people’s thoughts? Are you riding in groups yet?
A cart horse trapped in the body of a man.
http://www.jogler2009.blogspot.com

Pennine pedaller
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Re: Group riding

Postby Pennine pedaller » 5 Jun 2020, 7:48pm

Most local CCs have put notices on social media that all rides in club kit should be in no more than twos.
I suppose it’s different if you’re not in a CC or not in one that’s affiliated with BC.

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mjr
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Re: Group riding

Postby mjr » 5 Jun 2020, 8:09pm

One CUK and one indie group near me started rides again this week, but I've not yet joined one. I see little risk as long as distances are kept.
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
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Marcus Aurelius
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Re: Group riding

Postby Marcus Aurelius » 5 Jun 2020, 8:48pm

BC have said all bets are off until July the 4th, reviewed every fortnight.

Reddington
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Re: Group riding

Postby Reddington » 5 Jun 2020, 8:50pm

I rarely ride in groups of more than two so it doesn't really affect me.I must admit I haven't seen any larger groups out yet.That might all change Saturday and Sunday though.I will be keeping an eye out whilst riding this weekend!

ChrisF
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Re: Group riding

Postby ChrisF » 5 Jun 2020, 11:14pm

Anyone not on the front will be breathing in air that has just been expelled by the rider in front. Would need much more than a 2m to gap to allow any particles to disperse. Safer to ride 6 abreast :wink:
Chris F, Cornwall

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TrevA
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Re: Group riding

Postby TrevA » 5 Jun 2020, 11:26pm

As I’ve mentioned elsewhere, CUK and BC guidance are now at odds. CUK saying that rides of groups of 6 are OK, BC are saying that you can only ride in a group of six in a traffic free environment due to the amount of space required to social distance on the road.

I’m not sure if anyone has done any studies of the airflow around a group of cyclists, but do droplets in the air flow directly backwards? It’s often a cross wind, which must have some effect - blowing any droplets to the side?

Groups of jockeys are now gathering in close formations on racecourses around the country, albeit whilst wearing a mask. Footballers will soon be running around a pitch for 90 minutes and not social distancing, and not wearing masks.
A cart horse trapped in the body of a man.
http://www.jogler2009.blogspot.com

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TrevA
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Re: Group riding

Postby TrevA » 5 Jun 2020, 11:35pm

Marcus Aurelius wrote:BC have said all bets are off until July the 4th, reviewed every fortnight.


What will have changed by 4th July? The virus will still be around, there won’t be a vaccine by then. The infection rate might be lower, but not by much. Are they just stringing us along and extending the resumption of group rides a few weeks at a time, rather than telling us the unpleasant truth that all group riding is suspended for the foreseeable future?
A cart horse trapped in the body of a man.
http://www.jogler2009.blogspot.com

PH
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Re: Group riding

Postby PH » 6 Jun 2020, 1:21am

TrevA wrote:CUK guidance seems to suggest that we can, but BC guidance is far more cautious and recommends not riding in groups of more than 2 on the road, for the time being.

Cycling UK seem to be clarifying what's permissible under the regulations and guidance. On the website, in response to the question on whether is was sensible to ride as permitted in groups, the reply was
"Cycling UK: We have outlined what the regulations and guidance permit, but riders and clubs should make their own assessment of whether they should undertake any socially distanced group ride, and if so, when, where and how."
https://www.cyclinguk.org/article/coron ... ycle#group

My MG are discussing it now, but for me there's little appeal in socially distanced social cycling, regardless of the risks.

pwa
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Re: Group riding

Postby pwa » 6 Jun 2020, 6:58am

mjr wrote:One CUK and one indie group near me started rides again this week, but I've not yet joined one. I see little risk as long as distances are kept.

Exactly. If people find riding with friends enjoyable even with adequate distancing, I see no problem in that. If they don't like the distancing they should just ride alone or with their household members until it becomes acceptable to do otherwise. It's not ideal and it is not how we would like it to be, but it is a small sacrifice we all have to make for a while. Hopefully we are talking months rather than years.

tim-b
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Re: Group riding

Postby tim-b » 6 Jun 2020, 7:51am

Hi
Opposing views expressed here...
Practicing “social distancing” with six feet between yourself and other athletes is a good start, says Treakle. “Because the virus is transmitted by droplets and droplets don’t travel very far or linger in the air for a long period of time, a six-foot buffer zone should prevent transmission.” https://www.runnersworld.com/news/a31470786/spit-snot-etiquette-for-runners-coronavirus/

His team concluded that cyclists and runners have to stay much farther than 6 feet from a runner or rider in front of them to avoid inhaling droplets or having them land on their bodies. He calculated safe distances for each sport: That 65 feet is needed when riding a bike at 18 miles per hour, 33 feet while running at a 6:44 minutes-per-mile pace, or 16 feet while walking at a normal pace. “By that time, the droplets will have moved down to the ground and you won’t get them in your face,” says Blocken. https://www.wired.com/story/are-running-or-cycling-actually-risks-for-spreading-covid-19/

...I'll stay safe max group of two cycling side-by-side until I know different
Regards
tim-b
~~~~¯\(ツ)/¯~~~~

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TrevA
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Re: Group riding

Postby TrevA » 6 Jun 2020, 8:33am

I think an acceptable compromise, would be having a socially distance meet up at a cafe that is open for takeaways and has an adequate outside space nearby for a small group to be 6 feet apart. Everyone rides there and back on their own. Only problem is that the weather has changed and isn’t suitable for an outside meet up.

I’m quite lucky as my wife cycles and we cycle out as a pair. If I fancy a faster ride, I can go out with my son in law. We’ve hardly ridden this week after doing over 200 miles last week.
A cart horse trapped in the body of a man.
http://www.jogler2009.blogspot.com

ChrisButch
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Re: Group riding

Postby ChrisButch » 6 Jun 2020, 8:58am

Surely variations in wind direction are the factor which makes it currently impossible to get this right in practice. If there were no other traffic on the road, the safe distancing technique for a group of 6 would be to string out in a single line in a cross wind, but in a head or tail wind all 6 would ride side by side. Some similarities to the tactics used by a race bunch in strong winds, but reversed.

Marcus Aurelius
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Re: Group riding

Postby Marcus Aurelius » 6 Jun 2020, 9:29am

TrevA wrote:
Marcus Aurelius wrote:BC have said all bets are off until July the 4th, reviewed every fortnight.


What will have changed by 4th July? The virus will still be around, there won’t be a vaccine by then. The infection rate might be lower, but not by much. Are they just stringing us along and extending the resumption of group rides a few weeks at a time, rather than telling us the unpleasant truth that all group riding is suspended for the foreseeable future?

I agree. They are drip feeding the bad news. There is a vaccine, it’s already in full production, the company behind it have said they’d rather have loads ( 2 billion doses ) ready, by September, and wait for the results of the clinical trials, than the other way round.

Pete Owens
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Re: Group riding

Postby Pete Owens » 6 Jun 2020, 12:23pm

That is different from there being a vaccine. There are several potential vaccine candidates being developed by different teams around the world. Since clinical trials are very expensive this is normally done in small steps over years: lab tests on cultures -> animal tests -> small scale human trials to check for safety -> larger human trials to see if it may be effective -> very large scale long term human trials to measure the effectiveness over time split by different age groups -> manufacture. At each stage in the process the results are analysed to see if it is worth proceeding to the next and in most cases it isn't.

Due to the urgency of the situation the whole process is being accelerated with stages conducted in parallel - even including large scale manufacture. This means that IF one of the potential vaccines turns out to be effective then we will be able to start vaccinating immediately, but more likely those billions of doses will have to be destroyed. To date we don't have any information as to whether any of the vaccines offer any protection at all.