Quiet Lanes

Commuting, Day rides, Audax, Incidents, etc.
Tangled Metal
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Re: Quiet Lanes

Postby Tangled Metal » 3 Aug 2020, 9:45pm

Anyone taken the IIRC red Bank route from Grasmere to Elterwater? They've now got satnav warning signs because too many caravans and motorhomes have been down there following their satnavs. In case you don't know the road to get a motorhome out of that road you need a crane!! I've seen that road closed for hours twice now because of caravan and motorhome.

peetee
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Re: Quiet Lanes

Postby peetee » 3 Aug 2020, 10:07pm

I shall give that suggestion the consideration it deserves :D

It wasn’t entirely comedic. Village groups have done this many times over the years.
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RickH
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Re: Quiet Lanes

Postby RickH » 3 Aug 2020, 11:41pm

We've had a satnav for the car for quite some time as Mrs H's work used to take her round the schools of Salford & the many different permutations of getting between any pair of schools & being expected to use the shortest practicable route was challenging.

Satnavs have generally got better at recognising what the road is like & I've found that newer ones will generally avoid the single track lanes & back streets.

These days you can get ones with knowledge of widths & heights in their database to stop you going down unsuitable routes with larger vehicles.

Although we have a car specific satnav (which does get live-ish traffic data) that Mrs H generally uses, I tend to use Google maps as that seems to have more responsive traffic/road closure data.

Of course the simplest way of making a road quiet is to close it off somewhere along its length so only the traffic you want to allow can pass through ("modal filtering" in current parlance).

Bmblbzzz
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Re: Quiet Lanes

Postby Bmblbzzz » 4 Aug 2020, 12:37am

Evidently it depends which lane and what time. The only Quiet Lanes I know have always been very quiet when I've been on them - usually no motorised traffic at all - and likely to remain that way due to width and direction. A case of designation in response to features present versus in hope?

If you want quiet lanes, whether or not they're Quiet Lanes, I'd second Rick H's last sentence.

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simonineaston
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Re: Quiet Lanes

Postby simonineaston » 4 Aug 2020, 8:15am

Of course the simplest way of making a road quiet is to close it off somewhere along its length so only the traffic you want to allow can pass through ("modal filtering" in current parlance).
There's one of them on what used to be my route to work and back - utter bliss. Jam-packed with squirrels, bunny-rabbits, blackberry bushes in the verges, etc. I wish it could go on for miles...
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ratherbeintobago
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Re: Quiet Lanes

Postby ratherbeintobago » 4 Aug 2020, 8:24am

Problem with ours is that farm access is still required, and if you can fit a tractor…

How much would tractors be bothered by some discreet speed bumps though?

reohn2
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Re: Quiet Lanes

Postby reohn2 » 4 Aug 2020, 8:30am

Quiet Lanes are just a nice sign IME :?
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ratherbeintobago
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Re: Quiet Lanes

Postby ratherbeintobago » 4 Aug 2020, 8:33am

reohn2 wrote:Quiet Lanes are just a nice sign IME :?


Aye, like painted cycle lanes on a main road :-/

reohn2
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Re: Quiet Lanes

Postby reohn2 » 4 Aug 2020, 8:34am

ratherbeintobago wrote:
reohn2 wrote:Quiet Lanes are just a nice sign IME :?


Aye, like painted cycle lanes on a main road :-/

Quite!
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tykeboy2003
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Re: Quiet Lanes

Postby tykeboy2003 » 4 Aug 2020, 9:21am

Most after-market (ie not factory fitted to the vehicle) satnavs have a vehicle selection option such that if you select a vehicle type appropriate to the one you're using it will avoid unsuitable roads. I have one in our motorhome and have selected a fair sized truck and so far it's not tried to send me to my doom.....

DaveGos
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Re: Quiet Lanes

Postby DaveGos » 7 Aug 2020, 2:26pm

I live in a lane that is on the outskirts of a village but connects to the main road, the lane is in a terrible state with 6 inch grass down the middle of it , flooded most of the winter as the ditches are no longer maintained, potholed , so narrow its very difficult to get a car past a pedestrian let alone a bike. It was not so bad when I moved to the area nearly 30 years ago, the local runners used it on a circuit , but its too bad even for them now. Its main use if for the local horse riders , whose mounts fertilise the grass. Us locals never drive it, we go through the village which i 1/2 mile longer but faster and you dont have to wash your car after. I dont even use it for cycling much , but do occasionally in mid summer. I was riding it the other day and 3 vehicles came in the opposite direction and for each I had to get off the bike and find a bit of the hedge that I could get close to to let them by . I asked the first 2 if they were using sat navs , they were, the thrir was the local dustbin wagon which reverses 1/2 mile to one loan house. Which highlights another issue of inappropriate sized vehicles. The daily bus is far too large, the oli company uses a full size tanker and dont get me on tractors

pwa
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Re: Quiet Lanes

Postby pwa » 8 Aug 2020, 12:09pm

peetee wrote:
Tangled Metal wrote:What would help is if satnav firms changed their route finding to ignore quiet roads suitable for more vulnerable users. Fat chance of that!!


Yes. It all comes down to economics. Home deliveries are here to stay and the vehicles represent a large percentage of road traffic. The software behind delivery scheduling will divide an area into the most efficient selection of rounds and each round will get structured to provide the shortest route between drops. The suitability of the road is immaterial as long as it’s a recognised highway. In many cases drivers may know a better, longer option but their workload and/or employer pressure is such that they won’t take it.

I know some home delivery drivers and they themselves avoid lanes they deem unsuitable because they are hard work to drive on and don't save as much time as you might imagine. But that depends on the driver knowing the area well enough to feel confident in over-ruling the satnav. In these times of fast changing jobs, many drivers are relatively new to the area.

Vorpal
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Re: Quiet Lanes

Postby Vorpal » 8 Aug 2020, 12:55pm

There were a couple of quiet lanes in Essex that I thought worked very well. They were done as pilots in 2004/5. IIRC, Essex CC were pretty clear that they were not traffic calming initiatives, but intended to reduce through traffic and preserve the character of the lanes. They were already reasonably well used by equestrians and cyclists. I don't think they did much after the pilot, but Suffolk implemented several quiet lanes, and I thought those were also fairly well done.

As for satnavs... https://www.google.no/maps/@51.8576712, ... 312!8i6656 is at the entrance to BOAT which used to be a reasonable cut-through for a cyclist. Equestrians use it, but it has some horrible potholes, and it's really unsuitable for motor vehicles. Nonetheless, satnavs will sometimes try to take folks down there & they have to back out again. The white sign visible on the side is a locally made sign that reads something like: 'LORRIES: no through route - wrong satnav directions' becuase satnavs see it as a valid route. Other vehicle drivers can turn around or back out, but lorry drivers cannot do so easily, and it's muddy in the winter, so lorries sometimes get stuck.
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pwa
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Re: Quiet Lanes

Postby pwa » 9 Aug 2020, 8:04am

Vorpal wrote:There were a couple of quiet lanes in Essex that I thought worked very well. They were done as pilots in 2004/5. IIRC, Essex CC were pretty clear that they were not traffic calming initiatives, but intended to reduce through traffic and preserve the character of the lanes. They were already reasonably well used by equestrians and cyclists. I don't think they did much after the pilot, but Suffolk implemented several quiet lanes, and I thought those were also fairly well done.

As for satnavs... https://www.google.no/maps/@51.8576712, ... 312!8i6656 is at the entrance to BOAT which used to be a reasonable cut-through for a cyclist. Equestrians use it, but it has some horrible potholes, and it's really unsuitable for motor vehicles. Nonetheless, satnavs will sometimes try to take folks down there & they have to back out again. The white sign visible on the side is a locally made sign that reads something like: 'LORRIES: no through route - wrong satnav directions' becuase satnavs see it as a valid route. Other vehicle drivers can turn around or back out, but lorry drivers cannot do so easily, and it's muddy in the winter, so lorries sometimes get stuck.


Professional drivers who know an area have a mental list of lanes to avoid where possible, but a driver who doesn't know an area is really reliant on the satnav. They know how vulnerable that leaves them, and they don't like it. I hope satnavs improve to make more intelligent choices.

Where I live there is a dense network of genuinely quiet lanes that have survived the satnav age, but there are also a handful of lanes that I avoid on a bike because they are busier than their width merits. When you look on a map you can see how a satnav might opt for them as a quicker way from A to B, but when you know them you also know that slightly longer routes on wider roads are actually quicker. We need satnavs to catch up with the exact nature of individual lanes.

Look at this street.
https://www.google.com/maps/@51.5852442 ... 6?hl=en-GB
It looks like an urban street but it is actually only reachable via tight, twisty lanes. Any delivery vehicles aiming for these homes have no choice but to use those lanes. But it is also a route that my own satnav (Garmin, fully updated) will put my car on as a short cut if I let it, which I don't. Locals know the nature of the lanes and avoid them. Strangers are the ones who get caught out.

Bmblbzzz
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Re: Quiet Lanes

Postby Bmblbzzz » 9 Aug 2020, 12:45pm

Interesting that you say that looks urban; to me it looks distinctly rural! But that's not got much to do with the topic.