woman freezes to death after falling from bike

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The utility cyclist
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Re: woman freezes to death after falling from bike

Postby The utility cyclist » 19 Oct 2020, 4:36pm

thirdcrank wrote:Whenever I read anything like this, I think about my own experiences. It's mentioned in one of the links that it was still daylight when the first report was received. Now, anybody with an iota of experience of searching for people reported missing knows that full use must be made of any remaining daylight. But this isn't an MFH report: there should be no question of searching for somebody reported as having been found. Nor were they found in remote moorland: no need for the finder to spell out SOS in the snow for the benefit of the helicopter. This was in Kingston-upon-Hull - according to wiki a city of 250,000 people. The simple point is that there were insufficient personnel available to cope with demand. Rationing by queuing has led to this death.


You're taking the police line that there was insufficient personnel, we know police lie to cover their arses. I KNOW for a fact that police officers were in the near vicinity doing not very much, something that was very low priority. They were doing a low level policing job 10 minutes walk away at around the same time the call was made, so why weren't police pulled from a low priority scenario of people exiting from a sports arena to one of high priority?
The insufficient personnel just doesn't hold water, police standing around doing pretty much nothing a few minutes away is not insufficient personnel!
if they couldn't attend why didn't they call for an ambulance at least?

Humberside Police are a disgrace.

thirdcrank
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Re: woman freezes to death after falling from bike

Postby thirdcrank » 19 Oct 2020, 4:58pm

The utility cyclist wrote:
You're taking the police line that there was insufficient personnel, we know police lie to cover their arses. I KNOW for a fact that police officers were in the near vicinity doing not very much, something that was very low priority. They were doing a low level policing job 10 minutes walk away at around the same time the call was made, so why weren't police pulled from a low priority scenario of people exiting from a sports arena to one of high priority?
The insufficient personnel just doesn't hold water, police standing around doing pretty much nothing a few minutes away is not insufficient personnel!
if they couldn't attend why didn't they call for an ambulance at least?

Humberside Police are a disgrace.


You should report your information to the coroner

(In case it's not clear, I don't think that insufficient personnel is any sort of excuse in a case like this. Police and Crime Commissioners were appointed to prevent things like this.)

Jdsk
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Re: woman freezes to death after falling from bike

Postby Jdsk » 19 Oct 2020, 5:07pm

I've written to the Coroner asking if the verdict and remarks are available. And whether a PFD Report has been issued.

Jonathan

arnsider
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Re: woman freezes to death after falling from bike

Postby arnsider » 23 Oct 2020, 10:59am

For what its worth, might I suggest carrying a space blanket. They are very cheap and easy to put in a saddlebag or even a pocket.
Providing you are conscious, you can either pull it over yourself or direct a helper.

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The utility cyclist
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Re: woman freezes to death after falling from bike

Postby The utility cyclist » 23 Oct 2020, 3:35pm

arnsider wrote:For what its worth, might I suggest carrying a space blanket. They are very cheap and easy to put in a saddlebag or even a pocket.
Providing you are conscious, you can either pull it over yourself or direct a helper.


For 99.999% of people riding bikes this is simply not going to happen nor is required, the women was less than 2 miles away from her destination in a densely populated area, there would have been absolutely no need to take a space blanket, would you take one to walk or cycle around the corner to the shops or library?
The victim did direct a helper and yet when it came down to it the people who should have helped her didn't, excuses, failures/inaction by the police at every avenue and because of that someone laying helplessly on their own, froze to death. If those paid to render assistance had done what they should have then a space blanket wouldn't have made a jot of difference. and it certainly wouldn't have saved them over the time it took for someone to discover her body 17 hours later.

Jdsk
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Re: woman freezes to death after falling from bike

Postby Jdsk » 24 Oct 2020, 9:33am

arnsider wrote:For what its worth, might I suggest carrying a space blanket. They are very cheap and easy to put in a saddlebag or even a pocket.
Providing you are conscious, you can either pull it over yourself or direct a helper.

I don't, and probably won't. But it might have made a difference on this occasion.

Jonathan

PS: I've received a reply from the Coroner asking why I want to know...

mercalia
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Re: woman freezes to death after falling from bike

Postby mercalia » 24 Oct 2020, 12:00pm

Jdsk wrote:
arnsider wrote:For what its worth, might I suggest carrying a space blanket. They are very cheap and easy to put in a saddlebag or even a pocket.
Providing you are conscious, you can either pull it over yourself or direct a helper.

I don't, and probably won't. But it might have made a difference on this occasion.

Jonathan

PS: I've received a reply from the Coroner asking why I want to know...


Freedom of Information Request? ( mind your own business....)

Jdsk
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Re: woman freezes to death after falling from bike

Postby Jdsk » 24 Oct 2020, 12:04pm

Not an FoI request. Inquests and their reports are usually open to the public.

They want to know why I want to know, in what capacity I asked, and if I wish to be accorded Interested Person status.

Jonathan

thirdcrank
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Re: woman freezes to death after falling from bike

Postby thirdcrank » 24 Oct 2020, 12:26pm

Out of interest, if we accept that it's necessary to read at least three media links to get any sort of a coherent tale, is there something you feel is missing from all three?

Jdsk
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Re: woman freezes to death after falling from bike

Postby Jdsk » 24 Oct 2020, 12:30pm

It starts with my general mistrust of a lot of popular reporting. But I'm particularly interested in:
• What the coroner said about the rôle of alcohol, and how that was reported.
• The timing of the whole sequence.

Jonathan
Last edited by Jdsk on 24 Oct 2020, 12:49pm, edited 1 time in total.

thirdcrank
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Re: woman freezes to death after falling from bike

Postby thirdcrank » 24 Oct 2020, 12:48pm

It's my impression that since Michael Mansfield went to town at the Dodi Al Fayed inquest, the whole system of coroners and inquests has been put on a more sound footing, although plenty might disagree.

What we do seem to have here is an avoidable death which exposed organisational failures in the police. What we also seem to have is that the Humberside Professional Standards Department found no individual to be at fault but the force would learn lessons. As Lord Gnome might say "So that's all right, then."

Postboxer
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Re: woman freezes to death after falling from bike

Postby Postboxer » 25 Oct 2020, 11:30pm

I want to know if the police attempted to contact the witness who had reported it to them, as surely they would have been able to direct them. One of the reports seems to suggest that the woman could be seen from the witness's home. I also want to know if they calculated how drunk she had been and how injured her ankle was. I'd also like to know the reason she wasn't spotted, was she in a strange location, some distance from a path, or away from any route through the cemetery, obscured by trees, or did the police really only have a quick glance in from the gate or something?

Herts Audax
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Re: woman freezes to death after falling from bike

Postby Herts Audax » 26 Oct 2020, 12:42pm

They sat in their car and looked out the windows. Jesus, they could have at least done a search. If she was able to walk she wouldn't be in the cemetary!

Jdsk
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Re: woman freezes to death after falling from bike

Postby Jdsk » 26 Oct 2020, 12:44pm

Postboxer wrote:I want to know if the police attempted to contact the witness who had reported it to them, as surely they would have been able to direct them. One of the reports seems to suggest that the woman could be seen from the witness's home. I also want to know if they calculated how drunk she had been and how injured her ankle was. I'd also like to know the reason she wasn't spotted, was she in a strange location, some distance from a path, or away from any route through the cemetery, obscured by trees, or did the police really only have a quick glance in from the gate or something?

I'll let you know if I ever receive more information from the coroner.

Jonathan

FerociousDog
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Re: woman freezes to death after falling from bike

Postby FerociousDog » 26 Oct 2020, 1:22pm

Probably too scared to go in a cemetery in the dark?
Police these days generally need 4 cars,2 vans and an armed response unit for even the most mundane tasks :roll:

The old beat Bobbies must be embarrassed at what's become of the profession :!: