Invisible indicators on new cars.

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mattsccm
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Re: Invisible indicators on new cars.

Postby mattsccm » 17 Oct 2020, 10:30am

The day they didn't have to be orange and seperate was the day they went wrong. I have been told that having an orange bulb inside a clear lense works because the new bulbs are better than old ones. So why not use them with ornage lenses and have even better ones. Only one reason for this . Look and anyone who considers looks when buying a car needs to re assess their priorities .

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NATURAL ANKLING
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Re: Invisible indicators on new cars.

Postby NATURAL ANKLING » 17 Oct 2020, 10:45am

Hi,
Cowsham wrote:
cycle tramp wrote:Campaign for the return of pop out side indicators? (also known as trafficators)


Right on !

Then you need some back seat passenger to give the pillar a nice good thump, Or put your hand out the window to pull it back :)
If you remember how to do that when you're a child.
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NATURAL ANKLING
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Re: Invisible indicators on new cars.

Postby NATURAL ANKLING » 17 Oct 2020, 10:48am

Hi,
Tangled Metal wrote:Also indicators moved away from the corners of cars such that you can no longer see an indicator flashing in your direction from the side.

Side repeaters, both my cars got those, but they're a bit old-fashioned, do they still fit them?
NA Thinks Just End 2 End Return + Bivvy
You'll Still Find Me At The Top Of A Hill
Please forgive the poor Grammar I blame it on my mobile and phat thinkers.

pwa
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Re: Invisible indicators on new cars.

Postby pwa » 17 Oct 2020, 10:53am

mattsccm wrote:The day they didn't have to be orange and seperate was the day they went wrong. I have been told that having an orange bulb inside a clear lense works because the new bulbs are better than old ones. So why not use them with ornage lenses and have even better ones. Only one reason for this . Look and anyone who considers looks when buying a car needs to re assess their priorities .

You don't get a choice, though. You buy a car on the basis of a list of attributes, then usually just put up with whatever lights and indicators the thing comes with. I find the Audi indicators that seem to move the light across a narrow lens really irritating, but if I wanted an Audi for other reasons (I don't) I would just put up with that (in my eyes) defect.

atlas_shrugged
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Re: Invisible indicators on new cars.

Postby atlas_shrugged » 17 Oct 2020, 10:58am

Completely agree with the sentiment of the OP.

For whatever reason it is very difficult to buy an indicator bulb that uses LEDs for use on the roads. The indicator bulbs still use filaments and a special socket. However the new integrated light/indicator units will often use LEDs for the indicators.

It is beyond stupidity that some of these new light units no longer need to have an external amber section so you can see where the indicator is supposed to be flashing. This affects a split second decision that many - especially vulnerable road users - have to make, often this is a life or death decision.

Does anyone have a link to the latest motor vehicle indicator specification?

Pebble
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Re: Invisible indicators on new cars.

Postby Pebble » 17 Oct 2020, 11:25am

pwa wrote:
mattsccm wrote:The day they didn't have to be orange and seperate was the day they went wrong. I have been told that having an orange bulb inside a clear lense works because the new bulbs are better than old ones. So why not use them with ornage lenses and have even better ones. Only one reason for this . Look and anyone who considers looks when buying a car needs to re assess their priorities .

You don't get a choice, though. You buy a car on the basis of a list of attributes, then usually just put up with whatever lights and indicators the thing comes with. I find the Audi indicators that seem to move the light across a narrow lens really irritating, but if I wanted an Audi for other reasons (I don't) I would just put up with that (in my eyes) defect.

I have often wondered if AUDI consider their array of blinding DRLs and silly indicators to be a form of jewellery that adorn their even sillier pretentious image.

Cowsham
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Re: Invisible indicators on new cars.

Postby Cowsham » 17 Oct 2020, 11:36am

Just checked the wife's wee Toyota -- it's got integrated in headlamp indicators but clearly visible even when headlights are on. It's also got door mirror indicators which make them very obvious a bit like the semaphore type I suppose. I think part of this is because the car is 8 years old now.

She wants to change up to a new or newer car but this will be a deal breaker as far as I'm concerned. Just too dangerous.

Other people have noticed this too and maybe an explanation that the painted type bulbs lose paint over time rendering them almost clear! This shouldn't really happen with led since the colour is the wavelength given off by the semiconductor material
https://www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/post ... m?t=109905

Elizabeth_S
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Re: Invisible indicators on new cars.

Postby Elizabeth_S » 17 Oct 2020, 12:31pm

Glad it's not just me that thinks this. Most things about cars have specifications but indicators seem to be allowed to be a fashion accessory, and some of them are really difficult to spot. Definitely they are design over function now.

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tykeboy2003
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Re: Invisible indicators on new cars.

Postby tykeboy2003 » 17 Oct 2020, 1:34pm

Pebble wrote:As a driver I like to see flashing lights on bikes, it identifies them as a cyclist from a greater distance.


That's exactly the reason I never have flashing lights, I'd rather leave the drivers guessing what I might be. That way they will pay more attention until the point when they identify me as a cyclist - which is of course the point at which I will be instantly forgotten and dismissed from their thoughts.

Jdsk
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Re: Invisible indicators on new cars.

Postby Jdsk » 17 Oct 2020, 1:38pm

Cowsham wrote:Is there anything that can be done to improve the situation?

cycle tramp wrote: I don't think we will be the only ones asking for a change, we could other organisations involved

Working with others is very sensible.

Working with a research organisation to study and document the problem could move this on from anecdote. Time to detect might be an appropriate metric.

Prejudiced comments about all drivers and some brands are probably counterproductive.

Jonathan

PS: Is this the thread with the greatest agreement ever? : - )

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tykeboy2003
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Re: Invisible indicators on new cars.

Postby tykeboy2003 » 17 Oct 2020, 1:39pm

Elizabeth_S wrote:Glad it's not just me that thinks this. Most things about cars have specifications but indicators seem to be allowed to be a fashion accessory, and some of them are really difficult to spot. Definitely they are design over function now.


Agree completely, functionality in cars went out the window years ago, replaced by flashy gadgets some of which are ok some are pretty useless. We have a motorhome from 1996 based on a Renault Trafic van and it's a real trip down memory lane, no gadgets to speak of, not even intermittent wipers...

simonhill
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Re: Invisible indicators on new cars.

Postby simonhill » 17 Oct 2020, 1:44pm

When I saw the title of this post, I assumed it was because so many motorists don't indicate anymore. Out on my bike this morning, I tried to see if I could spot the invisible problem, trouble is I was never sure if someone is not signalling or the signal is invisible.

At my last MoT I had to change the front indicator bulbs as the orange had faded too much. My Van is 24 years old, so clear lens covers is not a new fashion thing.

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mjr
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Re: Invisible indicators on new cars.

Postby mjr » 17 Oct 2020, 4:32pm

NATURAL ANKLING wrote:Hi,
All that progress and tech for what.................
But we forget...............they got to use the $%^&£ things first :evil:

Yes, no point worrying about the design when they so often don't use them, but you can't prove they didn't.
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
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Mick F
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Re: Invisible indicators on new cars.

Postby Mick F » 17 Oct 2020, 6:18pm

simonineaston wrote:
Has anyone noticed or more to the point not noticed indicators on some new cars?
Yes, I have.
Me too, and for some years.

Rears are fine, but fronts are terrible these days.
Talking as a motorist, and cyclist, and as pedestrian.
Mick F. Cornwall

fastpedaller
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Re: Invisible indicators on new cars.

Postby fastpedaller » 17 Oct 2020, 7:14pm

[quote="NATURAL ANKLING"
Side repeaters, both my cars got those, but they're a bit old-fashioned, do they still fit them?[/quote]

Yes, all cars have to include them - sometimes incorporated into the door mirrors, but they are there.
I have a kit car, and to register a kit car (once you've built it!) it has to go through a one-off DVSA Individual Vehicle Approval (IVA) test, which can take a number of hours and is very detailed. One aspect it's hot on is the separation distance of different function lights, and also the angles of visibility to an observer. A number of us in kit car clubs have noticed that many mass-production cars would be unable to pass the test (which is mainly applicable to modified/kit cars/imported cars/vehicle conversions eg hearses, ambulances and motorhomes). I've certainly noticed rear LED indicators on some cars are almost impossible to see if the observer isn't looking directly at them (eg 30 degree offset they are invisible)