Collision - not sure where to start

Commuting, Day rides, Audax, Incidents, etc.
Aristurtle
Posts: 4
Joined: 10 May 2021, 10:17am

Collision - not sure where to start

Post by Aristurtle »

Hi all,
I was (a few years ago) a member of cycling UK and I thought I would post here in the hopes of some advice.

I was hit by a car around 3 weeks ago - (completely the fault of the car - who turned right without seeing me). Police are apparently pursuing a charge of driving without due care and attention on the driver. I am recovering well but as things become clearer medically, it is now likely I will lose some teeth - I am now seeing a specialist in the hopes of saving a few that were effectively smashed inward and then re-positioned by the maxfax doctor who attended A&E.

The bills for this are starting to mount up due to the urgency this has to be done, there was no chance of getting the treatment on the NHS (this is what my own NHS dentist has told me) and I called a local lawyer (who just didn't seem very clued up and I just didn't really relate to them whatsoever) and I wondered if anyone has any advice about representation and starting the process of making sure the medical treatment will be paid for and my bike might be replaced! Driver admitted liability at the scene, apparently (police took statements as I was concust and driver was shaken up) and police have since written out for witness statements.

Thanks for any advice - does cycling UK have a legal team for non-members?
Dom
Jdsk
Posts: 24636
Joined: 5 Mar 2019, 5:42pm

Re: Collision - not sure where to start

Post by Jdsk »

Welcome.

I wouldn't rule out NHS treatment... how about asking your GP about a referral?

Do you have a crime reference number?

Do you know the identity of the driver?

Do you have cover for legal fees through membership of a union, or an association (eg Which?) or an insurance policy?

Jonathan

PS: This appears to be a first post.
Pebble
Posts: 1934
Joined: 7 Jun 2020, 11:59pm

Re: Collision - not sure where to start

Post by Pebble »

If you don't have legal cover I would approach one of the companies that specialise accidents.

I was in a no fault accident a few years ago and through my insurance policy I had legal protection, a company called "Carpenters Group" handled the case on my behalf very well, they seemed to know exactly what and how to claim for my injuries, I believe you can approach them as an individual.
Aristurtle
Posts: 4
Joined: 10 May 2021, 10:17am

Re: Collision - not sure where to start

Post by Aristurtle »

Hi Jdsk,
Yes, it is my first post on this forum; thanks for your reply.

I wouldn't rule out NHS treatment... how about asking your GP about a referral?
It is a dental injury, I am just doing what my NHS dentist has told me - not sure that the GP would say anything other than to do what your dentist says.

Do you have a crime reference number? Yes

Do you know the identity of the driver? I have the reg and insurance - this was given to me by police.

Do you have cover for legal fees through membership of a union, or an association (eg Which?) or an insurance policy? No - I do not have any legal expenses insurance that would be applicable to this.
Aristurtle
Posts: 4
Joined: 10 May 2021, 10:17am

Re: Collision - not sure where to start

Post by Aristurtle »

Thanks Pebble,
I did check legal expenses but I don't have it on my motor policy (it is my understanding that many of the legal expenses products are often very limited in scope - often only in relation to the vehicle registered etc.) I have some in relation to properties but they stipulate the remit very clearly, and these are in relation to liabilities related to those properties.

I guess a recommendation for a solicitor who specialises in bikes/cyclists would helpful and thank you for your mention, Pebble, of Carpenters, who do seem to specialise in bikes.
Pebble
Posts: 1934
Joined: 7 Jun 2020, 11:59pm

Re: Collision - not sure where to start

Post by Pebble »

It all seems to be a complex game played between legal teams, and they all know all of the querky little rules that must be followed. You need a specialist to argue your side.

good luck
eileithyia
Posts: 8399
Joined: 31 Jan 2007, 6:46pm
Location: Horwich Which is Lancs :-)

Re: Collision - not sure where to start

Post by eileithyia »

/sorry to hear of your accident and you seem to have all the info regarding a solicitor, I would just look for a cycle specific solicitor, plenty advertise if the cycle mags. Not sure why either your doctor or dentist cannot refer you for maxfax care under NHS as that would be usual.

Importantly as you progress with this, keep a diary of pain, of all appointments, of progress as you perceive, what you can eat and when you can eat normally (should that be an issue), a list of all out of pocket expenses, hospital car parking, transport to and from etc., any other out of pocket expenses incurred by others, time off work, time to care for you etc. These are all things you will forget about as time progresses and cases like these may take 18-24 months to settle minimum, indeed I would not settle until I felt that recovery is as good as it will ever get.

Best wishes for a speedy recovery
I stand and rejoice everytime I see a woman ride by on a wheel the picture of free, untrammeled womanhood. HG Wells
Jdsk
Posts: 24636
Joined: 5 Mar 2019, 5:42pm

Re: Collision - not sure where to start

Post by Jdsk »

eileithyia wrote: 10 May 2021, 2:25pmImportantly as you progress with this, keep a diary of pain, of all appointments, of progress as you perceive, what you can eat and when you can eat normally (should that be an issue), a list of all out of pocket expenses, hospital car parking, transport to and from etc., any other out of pocket expenses incurred by others, time off work, time to care for you etc. These are all things you will forget about as time progresses and cases like these may take 18-24 months to settle minimum, indeed I would not settle until I felt that recovery is as good as it will ever get.
Excellent advice for anything that might end in legal proceedings. Contemporaneous written records make a big difference.

As above, and also for all communications about the claim. If you discuss anything by 'phone write it down immediately afterwards.

Other standard advice is to sleep on everything that you write before it's sent, and to get someone who isn't involved to read it before it's sent.

Jonathan
User avatar
Cowsham
Posts: 4963
Joined: 4 Nov 2019, 1:33pm

Re: Collision - not sure where to start

Post by Cowsham »

How much do you remember of the incident ? I mean were you able to relate what happened to the police at the scene or did that information get relayed by the driver only ?
I am here. Where are you?
Aristurtle
Posts: 4
Joined: 10 May 2021, 10:17am

Re: Collision - not sure where to start

Post by Aristurtle »

Thank you so much to everyone for your advice - and indeed, excellent advice about keeping all records.

I did give an account (not entirely sure how coherent it was) at the scene. I remember vividly some very specific memories - the car bonnet in particular. It is a junction I cycle through every day and was very aware of my road position etc... and made it as clear as I could to police what happened. I have since filled out a formal witness statement. The police have assured me that the driver said to them at the scene that they just didn't see me and they also tried to reassure me that they had 2 independent witnesses which have also been written to - I am going to chase the police and make sure this is all followed up as I have heard stories of this being half-hearted by police, but with any luck, liability will be settled without too much issue (although their insurance company is yet to be contacted by me at this stage).

The maxillofacial team just said that a dentist could handle the process from there on - I think unless it is something that involves complex other head and neck injuries and broken bones etc... it is just passed onto dentists. To be fair, although it absolutely sucks, I think I was very lucky that it is just my teeth and no more complex breaks/jaw injuries etc...

Thanks again to everyone who has taken the time to offer advice - I have taken it all onboard. Any other recommendations/experiences with law firms would be appreciated before I call a couple but other than that - thanks again.
User avatar
Cowsham
Posts: 4963
Joined: 4 Nov 2019, 1:33pm

Re: Collision - not sure where to start

Post by Cowsham »

I think you have everything in hand -- as you say keep a check on what stage the police are at and that they are proceeding with contacting the independent witnesses.

Try to get them to give you an email to that effect. You won't obviously be given names of the witnesses but it would be reassuring to have evidence that witnesses were contacted by police.

Get in contact with the at fault parties insurance as soon as you can but it might be wise to talk to your own solicitor first.

You might be contacted by another company who will look after the claim for the at fault insurance company/party. Make sure you consider all your costs as a result of the accident - loss of income - etc -- I'd think getting a solicitor or even a "No Win no fee" company on your side would be a wise move.
I am here. Where are you?
wirral_cyclist
Posts: 1024
Joined: 17 May 2010, 9:25pm
Location: Wirral Merseyside

Re: Collision - not sure where to start

Post by wirral_cyclist »

Aristurtle wrote: 10 May 2021, 10:28am
The bills for this are starting to mount up due to the urgency this has to be done,
You probably wont see a medical penny for a year (or two?) we got the second-hand value of written off bike and damaged kit in about 10 weeks with Leigh Day (British Cycling's legal crew). CUK legal team get a lot of flak for tardiness for even kit payout.

As others have said you need to keep extensive records.
thirdcrank
Posts: 36776
Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 2:44pm

Re: Collision - not sure where to start

Post by thirdcrank »

As others have said,:-

You should gather and preserve as much evidence as you can about both the crash and everything relating to it such as all your consequent expenses. Record everything in some sort of diary so you can recall the facts later - probably much later.

Beyond all that, you need legal advice from the right lawyer, ie a specialist in personal injury claims involving cyclists. All membership of organisations like cUK gets is access to a collective conditional fee agreement ie the sponsoring organisation puts up the initial money. Otherwise, you have to negotiate directly with your lawyer. The rules for this type of funding were changed a while ago - to the benefit of insurers - and I've not kept up-to-date with that.

The law rarely moves quickly to a result and compo for personal injury often seems very slow, but that's partly caused by the importance of being sure of the extent of injuries, especially anything permanent and any disabilities. While some lawyers are slow by nature, tales of delay in reaching a settlement do not demonstrate poor service.

In your case, it seems that police inquiries, which are often invaluable to a civil claim, are incomplete so a PI lawyer would not have anything on which to finalise a claim. I don't know anything about interim payments, which are something a lawyer should help with.

==============================================================

PS AFAIK, when you do see a solicitor one of the first things they will check will be if you have any existing source of funding eg through insurance or membership of an organisation like a trade union. They won't just take your word for it but when they arrange the first interview they will ask to to take in your insurance policies etc so they can do the checking.

One of the things that seems to be outstanding at the moment is what the independent witnesses say. Not for nothing does Ivor Ting-ting refer to them as witlesses. Many witnesses who blow hot at the scene blow cold when they have had chance to reflect and decide they don't want to become involved. Some are not really witnesses as all but were nearby and reached their own conclusions about what must have happened. In today's circumstances, if the police attended and began an investigation, you are in front. I'd be cautious about pestering the investigator at this stage. This is understandably with you all the time, but they'll have a stack of other cases all vying for their time.
Red Kite
Posts: 47
Joined: 10 Sep 2012, 5:20pm
Location: Hertfordshire, UK

Re: Collision - not sure where to start

Post by Red Kite »

I would contact the driver's insurer. You might find they do not resist the principle of paying your costs and possibly compensation for distress, but if they accept liability for the consequences of their insured's action that's an essential step. Are you claiming for the bike? If they have accepted that, the personal injury claim might be a formality although the amount for distress etc could be a negotiation and you would probably benefit from legal assistance.

I'm not a lawyer. Do you have legal cover on your house insurance?
Cube Touring Hybrid One e-bike, Brompton P6R with Swytch conversion
thirdcrank
Posts: 36776
Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 2:44pm

Re: Collision - not sure where to start

Post by thirdcrank »

Unless you really know what you are doing I'd say you should not try to negotiate with the driver's insurer. If it was damage-only ie easily quantifiable that might be different: all but the most expensive bikes are peanuts in this context, but personal injury is on a different scale. I'd go so far as to suggest that an insurer will only settle quickly if they think it's in their interest to do so and they will only take your claim seriously if it comes through a personal injury lawyer. Also, there's nothing to be gained by making a false start then turning to a solicitor to sort it out.
=============================================================================

PS I've remembered an ancient thread of mine Instructing a lawyer.

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=49627

Details will have changed, especially the system of so-called "No win, no fee" and claims for soft tissue injury, but the principles are unchanged. Also, Martin Porter QC who is in one of the links ended his piece by offering advice on the selection of a decent lawyer. I don't know if that still holds but it costs nothing to ask him.
Post Reply