E Scooter accident

Commuting, Day rides, Audax, Incidents, etc.
thirdcrank
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Re: E Scooter accident

Post by thirdcrank »

We're in a bit of an unrealistic situation at the moment because AIUI, the trials involve hire schemes which will have all their inherent problems of things like being dumped. I suspect their real potential comes from being attractive to teenagers. There's nothing to stop these being used on private property but once bought for that purpose, the temptation is to venture further afield. I've seen a couple of "crackdown" type pics of scooters being seized but in the real world there's a limit to that, especially with juvenile suspects. The complications of dealing with juveniles, especially if there's no parent present from the outset are quite considerable. Not insurmountable, of course, but I suspect the threshold is quite low. Probably the only difference between these scooters and the zillions of uninsured, untaxed, unMOTed cars driven by unlicensed or disqualified drivers is that they are so much more obvious to the public. The chance of being in a confrontation with the police could be attractive to some and playing a form of whack-a-mole in back streets even more so.
PH
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Re: E Scooter accident

Post by PH »

thirdcrank wrote: 16 Jun 2021, 7:25pm I suspect their real potential comes from being attractive to teenagers. There's nothing to stop these being used on private property but once bought for that purpose, the temptation is to venture further afield.
I'm not sure the main market is teenagers, I don't live in a hire area but see plenty and although the age group is largely under 25's there seems a fairly even split between teenagers and those in their 20's.
I doubt many of them are being bought with the intention of being used on private property, or sold with that in mind. Many people don't even realise the illegality, I've met some who think "Not to be used on public roads" means OK on cycle paths and pavements. I know one of the major retailers doesn't bring the subject up unless the customer does, and then their legal position is referred to as a "Grey area"
I don't know how you'd enforce a law that has exemptions for a hired version of the same thing used in the same way, I've seen a Police announcement saying they'll clamp down on those causing a nuisance, which implied there's no issue using one in a sensible manner. Maybe there's a market for making your own look like a hired one, maybe someone is already catering for it.
thirdcrank
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Re: E Scooter accident

Post by thirdcrank »

I suppose I'm saying is that if these catch on - and I believe they will - then there's not much that will stop them. Floodgates. One of my teenage grandsons had one on order with his saved up Crimbo and birthday money and the only thing that stopped him - and saved my blood pressure - was that the supplier could not deliver so he cancelled.
djnotts
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Re: E Scooter accident

Post by djnotts »

Totally statistically unfounded but certainly on the University-side of Nottingham I would judge students the most common users of the official trial versions.
Look tempting - I tried standing on a parked one a few days ago! If I understood the app thing hire system I'd give one a go!
iandriver
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Re: E Scooter accident

Post by iandriver »

I notice a couple of people have now lost their licenses for drink driving on them https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-m ... e-57499839

Not sure it's in the same league as operating a two ton vehicle motorway speeds, but the punishment appears the same.
Supporter of the A10 corridor cycling campaign serving Royston to Cambridge http://a10corridorcycle.com. Never knew gardening secateurs were an essential part of the on bike tool kit until I took up campaigning.....
philvantwo
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Re: E Scooter accident

Post by philvantwo »

The kids in a bad way, on a life support machine and the doctors wanted to turn it off as medically there's nothing they can do for him but his mother pleaded with them to leave it on.
GayUnicorn
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Re: E Scooter accident

Post by GayUnicorn »

philvantwo wrote: 18 Jun 2021, 7:47am The kids in a bad way, on a life support machine and the doctors wanted to turn it off as medically there's nothing they can do for him but his mother pleaded with them to leave it on.
Oh dear that's an awful outcome.
thirdcrank
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Re: E Scooter accident

Post by thirdcrank »

iandriver wrote: 17 Jun 2021, 12:45pm I notice a couple of people have now lost their licenses for drink driving on them https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-m ... e-57499839

Not sure it's in the same league as operating a two ton vehicle motorway speeds, but the punishment appears the same.
FWIW the punishment for an offence under s4(1) of the RTA 1988 "driving while unfit through drink or drugs" is a mandatory ban of at least 12 months with a max of 6 months imprisonment or a fine at level 5 on the standard scale (which since 2015 has been an unlimited fine.)

The idea is that aggravating features should shift the penalty further up those scales.

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1988/53/schedule/2
Bmblbzzz
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Re: E Scooter accident

Post by Bmblbzzz »

mattsccm wrote: 15 Jun 2021, 10:13pm Surely they need a design feature that, at the very least, makes 2 up use ridiculously uncomfortable if not impossible? Despite the best will in the world they are never going to be used responsibly by so may users that some form limitation is needed. Ok, it may stop the odd user but so what. It's a tough world.
A better design feature would be brakes and handling suitable for riding two-up.
Bmblbzzz
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Re: E Scooter accident

Post by Bmblbzzz »

thirdcrank wrote: 16 Jun 2021, 7:25pm We're in a bit of an unrealistic situation at the moment because AIUI, the trials involve hire schemes which will have all their inherent problems of things like being dumped.
I just haven't seen them being dumped, unlike the dockless hire bikes. I expect this is the real reason for requiring driving licences to hire them.
thirdcrank
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Re: E Scooter accident

Post by thirdcrank »

mumbojumbo
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Re: E Scooter accident

Post by mumbojumbo »

Do you need a license for these toys? They are similar in status to e-bikes.I have seen electric MTBs churning up bridal paths largely because the indolent rider needs make no effort to propel his bike.
Jdsk
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Re: E Scooter accident

Post by Jdsk »

mumbojumbo wrote: 19 Jun 2021, 7:15pmDo you need a license for these toys? They are similar in status to e-bikes.
As above:
Jdsk wrote: 15 Jun 2021, 7:26pm They're motor vehicles, and relevant legislation applies.
https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... ansporters
eBikes aren't.

Jonathan
mumbojumbo
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Re: E Scooter accident

Post by mumbojumbo »

E-bikes have no engine?I thought a motor supplemented human power-in my view that is an engine.

Wikipedia says

An engine or motor is a machine designed to convert one form of energy into mechanical energy.
PH
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Re: E Scooter accident

Post by PH »

mumbojumbo wrote: 19 Jun 2021, 7:57pm E-bikes have no engine?I thought a motor supplemented human power-in my view that is an engine.

Wikipedia says

An engine or motor is a machine designed to convert one form of energy into mechanical energy.
This is a thread about an accident that resulted in a death.
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